Newbie advice please

[jadam]

I'd like to spend some quality range time this winter getting ready to give Service Conditions a go (I'm local to Ottawa) with the further goal of giving CQB a shot as well. I've done a fair bit of reading through the forums and was hoping to get some of the collective brain trust's feedback on what I'm thinking of putting together for myself. I don't consider myself a CGN search expert, so if I'm covering ground again (and again), please forgive me. This may also be long, I've been described as chatty, so.....

I am right-handed and left eye dominant. I prefer to shoot long guns left handed and pistols right handed. This works for me (and Larry Vickers, it appears) so I don't plan to change it. Probably should have been left handed, but this is what I have to work with.

I will be receiving my AR in mere hours if Canpar does it's thing correctly. I opted for an 18" NEA DMR. I understand that not everyone is confident in their product, but the value for money seemed good to me and I like to buy Canadian when I can. I plan to swap out the safety, charging handle and trigger with ambi, ambi and better ones (ALG Combat Trigger) respectively. Again, looking for value.

Considering the optic, I am keen to get a bit more reach than just 4x, but also want to stay value oriented. Ideally I'd get a low mag range FFP MRAD scope, but not at a value pricepoint. My LR bolt rifle has an MRAD scope and as a child of the metric system it just works for me. That said, I'm really liking the Vortex Diamondback HP 2-8 despite being an MOA scope. The magnification range and eye relief are great and the reticle drop hashes seem to match pretty well to a 75g round (Hornady steel match seems like a good value option). Note that I don't plan to click my adjustments at each distance. I would rather learn to use the scope even if that means I'm disadvantaged a little. (I don't mean to start a war on training value versus winning here - this is just my take on the matter. Even if I had an FFP MRAD scope my plan would be to know my drops at set ranges and/or have a cheat sheet on the stock.)

For CQB I would likely slap a set of offset mounts with BUISs on them and run those under 75-100 m. Red dot would be nice, but I have a few sets of BUIS kicking around. Also, the 2x doesn't seem that unforgiving.

In terms of kit, I think a battle belt is the better way to go for me after reading Hungry's suggestions. Making a system that works for both SC and CQB is a bit of a challenge so far. Because of my cross-handedness, I need the AR mags and pistol holster on the right and the pistol mags on the left. So far I've found that one AR mag at 2 o'clock, pistol at 3 and two more at 4 and 5 seems to work very well for me in some at home testing. On the left I have presently four pistol mags running from 10 to 11 o'clock. I think I need one more AR mag and I think I could piggyback it on the two in the right back. I could probably make it four mags there if needed. I'm not clear if the 5 mags required includes the one in the rifle. Evening up the weight a little is an IFAK on the rear left (i like to be prepared). Any further suggestions? Where (if at all) would a dump pouch go? Right now I have it at the 2 o'clock position (small one off the mag pouch).

Finally, I have some LAR mags but since competition is limited to 5 rounders, I'm looking for some good value and reliable full-length mag suggestions. With the riveting I can only assume cleaning the mags is a nightmare, so what does everyone use?

If you made it this far, thank you! Any suggestions are most appreciated.

 

[kombayotch]

In ORA SR matches you can use LAR with 10 rounds. You can also use them in NSCC or CQB, but you can only load them with 5 rounds. They work well with a GSDesign extension and you never have to worry about rivet placement preventing you from inserting the mag with the bolt closed (something you will want to be able to do).

CQB and SR short range stages are still about precision. They're not about speed like IPSC/3gun. The scoring area is much smaller. An offset sight puts you at a serious disadvantage in either. I've won CQB matches and FIBUA with a 3-24x March FFP set on 3x. These are games where you're better served dialing for each distance on the turrets (yes, even CQB). So, you need to know your come-ups/hold-overs at each distance regardless of what you use.

Not sure why you're equating MRAD with metric. If you're using an FFP scope properly, it's irrelevant what linear measurements you use with it. It's an angle and since your reticle is always accurate and is in the same units as your turrets, you just measure with the reticle and plug the measured value directly into the turrets. There is no reason to think about inches or cm. I've shot FFP MRAD for over a decade and have always used inches/yards/MPH... still faster with MRAD than with MOA. Not that it makes any difference when you're only shooting at one distance at a time and have plenty of time to adjust your settings.

 

[Bolivar]

Whew, lots of info to process.

Kit

I shoot cross handed like you so I understand your challenges in that regard. I have not found an acceptable way to carry my rifle mags on the same side as my pistol. For CQB you really need to to have 3 three mags at the ready for quick changes. One more in an obviously different location but easy to access (or otherwise marked so you know it is your 4 round mag and not a 5 rounder) and you can then have your starting 5 round mag in your pocket or something. Similarly for pistol, you only really need one mag in a pouch, the other gets inserted in the mag well at the start of the match. May folks have enough mag pouches for all their mags though, gives you a convenient place to stow your mags once they are bombed up.

For SR, round count at the line is 55 or 60 rounds. So say 6 - 10 round LAR mags. Round count per stage is 10 so the 10 round mags are easy math wise. A lot if civi's run this with extenders so they are 30 round length which makes them easy to fit in standard pounches and you can mono-pod off the mag for prone. That gets to be a lot of mags sitting around your back or over top of your pistol. For SR as well, it's good to make sure your mags are situated so you can lay prone with them. On your hip, in front of your pistol is not likely optimal.

I run a tac vest and battle belt for CQB. For SR, all I need is the tac vest. My rifle mags get situated in the vest, single stack across or doubled at the side of the vest so I can lay prone comfortably. I also hang my dump pouch off the back of my vest, at the rear opposite my rifle side. The dump pouch is most important for SR because you always finish ahead of your start point. In match 14, 500m ahead. You can't go back and pick up mags. In CQB I stuff the mags I can in my pouch as I progress through each sub-stage but always leave some on the ground to be picked up on the way back to score targets. My tac vest also carries my water bladder so I can hydrant whenever I want/need.

My battle belt is set up to carry my holster and pistol mag pouches on opposite sides. I have a couple of rifle pouches back behind my hip on my pistol side but I have not run a match that I only need two mags. It's more for casual plinking so I don't need my vest all the time. I run a separate dump pouch on my belt opposite my pistol but only use it when I am primarily shooting pistol.

Rifle - no comment. Like you say, they are hit or miss. Hopefully you will get a good one. If you are hell bent on upgrading the trigger right away, fill yer boots.

Optic

The 2-8 will probably do you just fine for SR and CQB. I run a fixed 3X for both and have found it to be adequate. I wouldn't bother with the off-set buis. Nothing wrong with using your scope.

Using drop marks on your scope. Try it. If it works for you great. Most of the top scoring shooters that I know dial. Kombayoch is one of those shooters.
Best to get a optic that gives you the option to do either if you can.

 

[jadam]

Thanks to you both for the responses. Good to know about the BUISs being a bad call. 2-3x as a low end on the scope sounds manageable.

I guess I'll be saving up for an FFP scope then! I'm still getting used to angular measures so I still tend to equate MRAD with 10cm/100m and am using the target for corrections as opposed to the reticle. Easy enough to do that math in my head fast, but I see that with an FFP scope I would be able to do it quicker with the reticle.

I'll keep playing with my load out setup and see what ends up feeling good.

Thanks again!

-j

 

[kombayotch]

Your doing the math for no reason though. It's like if someone asked you what the angle of something was and instead of using a protractor (the reticle) that you had readily available, you instead estimated the length of the sides then did a calculation to figure out the angle. It's a slower and less accurate approach to make estimates and do math to convert from a linear measurement to an angle than just measuring the angle directly with a calibrated instrument (the reticle).

1 MRAD at 236 yards is 1 MRAD. 1 MRAD at 1266 yards is 1 MRAD. Both the reticle and the turrets are in MRAD (angles), so there is no need to think about linear measurements or to do math.