I say the opposite. Anyone smart can learn how to use a progressive outright, especially for pistol ammos. Progressive are not complicated.
Newbie , progressive press brand help ?
- Thread starter nofai
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I say the opposite. Anyone smart can learn how to use a progressive outright, especially for pistol ammos. Progressive are not complicated.
As long as he takes the time to learn the details of what goes into a safe and useable round, a progressive is fine. I just meant some may be a little over eager to fill up the ammo box without taking the time to learn the ins and outs of safe reloading. A single stage kinda forces you to slow it down and pay attention to what’s really going into a proper handload. I’m not saying he would make that mistake but I’ve had that phone call asking what to do with 500 rounds of oops.
You do NOT reload what can be bought however. Are you reloading 147gr FMJ? No Campro or Berry's copper or wax spray painted lead. Real FMJ. Something like American Eagle 147gr. 1000 fps, 300 foot-pounds. Can be had for $300 per thousand. $0.30 each, free shipping.
Being a savvy reloader you can get decent primers from Tenda for $0.035 each. Order a couple of years supply and get free shipping. To reach that power level and velocity needs about 5gr of whatever powder you like that works. Best price probably Hummason at around $240 + $20 for shipping for 8 lbs. Titegroup need not apply. Won't meet the power or velocity of the factory stuff. So, about $0.025 a round for powder. Now you need bullets. I have lost track of where to get decent prices on REAL FMJ bullets. Even 10 years ago I think they were pretty expensive, around $100 for 500 if I recall correctly, so at that time around $0.20 each. Add in brass. No you don't get to go to the range and pick it up, not at any of the ranges I have been to for quite some time now. Most of the crap lying about on the floor is steel or aluminum these days anyway. If there is real brass lying about, it usually 'belongs' to the range as well these days. I can guarantee you that anything I leave lying around (which I NEVER do because that isn't the shooting I do any longer) is so shot out it would belong in a smelter. Factor in another $100 for 1000 so-called 1F after they are cleaned and culled and amortize across the lifetime of shooting and reloading. Probably $0.01 a shot. With THESE prices, it is sitting at $0.035+0.025+0.20+0.01=$0.27 a round for 147gr FMJ so $270 per thousand. So, yes, you save around $0.03 a round.
But wait! Now add in $1500 for a good progressive press like a Dillon 650 with dies, shell feeder, bullet feeder, powder alarm, primer sorter and feeder, and all the other bells and whistles so that you actually CAN reload 300 plus rounds an hour IF it runs properly without screwing up, so that you can reload your 10K plus rounds a year. Hmm, $0.03 a round savings. Wow! Break even on the press is 1500 / 0.03 = 50000. Yes, that is correct, 50K rounds to break even reloading 9mm 147gr ammo on a new Dillon 650 kitted out press actually CAPABLE of doing so. How do I know? I owned one, for years. It cranked out about 15K .357 and the same amount of .38SP, and about 4K 0.40 S&W before my back decided for em to give up on handgun. Changing out calibers was a PITA in my opinion with near total disassembly and reassembly/fine tuning required.
Now, yes, you can run low power 115 or 124 gr plated or waxed lead Berry or Campro bullets, with Dominion primers, 2.8gr or less of Titegroup or similar powder, with really questionable range floor brass to reach the reload costs that you are speaking of, but they won't meet match shoot power levels, and have significant feed problems in a lot of pistols. So, even if you want to reload these plinker rounds for $0.17, at $0.13 savings, it will be just a bit over 11500 rounds to break even. I would suggest that very few people shoot that much in a year unless they are significant match competitors and if so, they certainly are NOT shooting plinker rounds either in practice nor in competition, nor are they sitting behind a press incapable of supplying them with decent amounts of decent ammo in a reasonable period of time. They are too busy shooting.
Certainly saves me money, I see no reason to use a .20 projectile when a .09 campro is doing the job just fine. Sure they're plated but they're TMJ and claim to be .008 thick so that's more than a few molecules worth of copper. The cheapest factory ammo that shoots anywhere near acceptable in my gun is Blazer Brass, which is back up to over .26 a round now. My handloads are .17 - .18 each, so I save 80 bucks per thousand on the outside. Plus my homegrowns are way more accurate, which makes it worthwhile even if I had to pay more for them than factory. I payed just under $200 for my loadmaster used, so it was close to paid for after just the first 2000 rounds.
I don't count my time, it's a hobby, it's my me time. If I wasn't reloading or troubleshooting whatever new way the loadmaster just figured out to go wrong, I'd be doing something completely mindless and unproductive, like posting on an Internet forum or something.
I don't count my time, it's a hobby, it's my me time. If I wasn't reloading or troubleshooting whatever new way the loadmaster just figured out to go wrong, I'd be doing something completely mindless and unproductive, like posting on an Internet forum or something.
Huh? Who needs FMJ for pistol?
I'm new to reloading, but I can easily use 124gr Berry plated bullets, range brass, Dominion primers, and 3.9-4.0gr Titegroup for a power factor of 130-133, confirmed by chrono. Reliable and works great. Knocks over steel as required, and I've made, and shot, over 4500 rounds since Dec on my Hornady LNL AP. At a cost of $0.17/round, tax in, I'm saving about $0.10/round, when compared to current sale pricing on factory ammo, at $250/1000, plus tax.
Who needs FMJ 9mm reloads? What in particular are you trying to achieve.
Let alone, ‘really questionable range floor brass’... did you hand chamfer your 30k rounds too?
And titegroup can’t reach higher velocity? Really...
Let’s talk with someone who knows something.
I’ve already loaded 18k this year alone in 9mm on my dillon 650 with casefeeder. I have supplies for 20k more to finish off my competition season.
I easily break your ‘300’ rounds an hour, honest time i double that +.
I’ve recently replaced every wear part on my 650 as its gone over 100k since i’ve owned it in 4 years.
I guess that would be true if I was reloading for minor power factor back then. Never shot such. Didn't know that minor power level was all that exists now. Anyway, 124gr 9mm won't meet major with Titegroup. Only 147gr could get there reasonably if you could hold on to the gun and keep the barrel pointed where you wanted to. So no Titegroup behind a 147gr bullet, it would be damn hard on the wrist. I actually don't know of anyone who shot minor. Ah well, times change. And yes, most everything available was ball for an auto. The only time lead was used was in revolvers. Anyway, enjoy your shooting.
Got to add though, that if I was still doing it, I would still use ball with decent brass. Came from 45ACP then and went to 40S&W and 9mm.
Don't know about sourcing brass off the floor though. The indoor range I belonged to back then used to allow picking up your own brass if you could actually reach it. These days the only 'brass' I see lying about at a range is steel and aluminum junk.
Got to add though, that if I was still doing it, I would still use ball with decent brass. Came from 45ACP then and went to 40S&W and 9mm.
Don't know about sourcing brass off the floor though. The indoor range I belonged to back then used to allow picking up your own brass if you could actually reach it. These days the only 'brass' I see lying about at a range is steel and aluminum junk.
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