Norc 1911 sport model - Mag release falls off?
- Thread starter geclark
- Start date
easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Greater Vancouver, BC
And probably the largest 1911 manufacturer as well
I don't know if 5150 Steel is the best grade for the 1911, but it sure works great! It was good enough for Bill Wilson who at some point in time, would only work on Colt, Springfield Armory and Norinco frame/slides...until he figured they spent too much on tooling to machine Norincos, darned Chinese steel was wearing out their expensive cutters faster than Colts and SAs.
4140 alloy tool steel, aka CrMo steel. if US is the biggest consumer, China will be the 2nd. There is nothing fancy about 4140. It is good for machining, case hardening and the core provide the required toughness. I should not waste my time here.I am about to have a 1911 built for me, this is what it will begin as.
https://www.dlaskarms.com//popup_image.php?pID=343&osCsid=bd1bf7c519aa5bd40c09e9ff411b322d
Please don't attempt to convince me that Norc uses a superior material than a North American, 4140 forging, to build their guns!
4140 alloy is the material that the likes of PGW, and many other high end gun manufactureres machine their receivers from, including Dlask, Wilson, Les Baer, Kimber, the list goes on and on. After machining parts from 4140 a part is heat treated to provide an engineered hardness range to match up to other component hardness ranges.
Something I am not convinced Norc do, perhaps someone can 'enlighten' me though.
Just because someone says/feels that a Norc frame is considered "tougher" than others, if that is the case, and I'm not saying it is, then what part do you think will begin to wear then as the gun is used? Perhaps maybe the slide rails?!
The matching of moving steel parts/components in a gun is a refined science. Something I'll leave to other 'quality' gun manufacturing companies............................Norc not being one of them!
I assume you have performed Rockwell or Brinell hardness tests to confirm the "toughness", or more correctly 'hardness', of a Norc frame and understand how hard the material should be, so the slide and frame rail wear evenly?
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And probably the largest 1911 manufacturer as well
I don't know if 5150 Steel is the best grade for the 1911, but it sure works great! It was good enough for Bill Wilson who at some point in time, would only work on Colt, Springfield Armory and Norinco frame/slides...until he figured they spent too much on tooling to machine Norincos, darned Chinese steel was wearing out their expensive cutters faster than Colts and SAs.
You see, it sounds cool, but it's one of those internet myths.
Back then Wilson recommended or if You wish accepted Colt and SA for custom job.
He would also agreed to work on Norincos as only those 3 makers were producing forged slide and frame pistols back then.
Once the other makers caught up on the forged slide/frame thing, Norinco was dropped from the line.
Not because of the steel, just because other makers were putting better stuff on the market.
You still can build a custom gun on Norinco frame and slide with many gunsmith across the USA.
There are however better choices out there.
Good starter gun, but nothing more really.
some people like to buy a old rusty car and fix it up just for the fun of fixing/restoring it.
i would much rather mess up on a $350 gun then a $700, $1000, $1500, $2000 gun, how about you? as well they are nice beater guns that i don't have to worry about getting dirty, scratched, dropped, etc. not that i drop guns on purpose, but my heart wont lock up when i accidentally drop the gun.
(example for a new gun owner with few guns)
i have a $2000 budget for the next 3-5 months for guns and ammo.
$1500 1911, and say 1000 rounds of cheap 45acp.
vs
$350 1911, (if you get extra parts or get work done add $150), 3000-4000 rounds of 45acp.
i don't knock anyone who wants a $2000 1911, i would love one, but right now my budget doesn't support that. and even still i would rather 2-3 guns over 1.
easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Greater Vancouver, BC
I guess this (in bold, above) is another internet myth?
Which myth do we believe? Of course, the myth that we want to believe
Anyways I see more internet posts from seemingly knowledgeable shooters and gunsmiths even, that say that Norkie frames and slides are hard on tooling, than say otherwise, which would attest to the alleged quality of Norinco steel. If you have had experience with machine tools and their tooling then you know that tooling is not cheap. Which is a good reason for any gunsmith, like Bill Wilson, to turn away Norkie-based jobs.
Now quality of steel aside, if Norkies were forged and machined out of spec, I would also think that no gunsmith would work on them...but they do. So I conclude that Norkie 1911s are made of good quality steel using acceptable quality workmanship/craftmanship.
Why classify the Norkie as a starter gun? I used to feel the same way when all I had were real 1911s, you know, Gold Cups, Combat Elites, WWII Colts and Remingtons, etc some of which were built into pin guns and IPSC Stock pistols. But that changed when I shot a Norkie 1911. I like to keep them in box stock form as they work good enough, but my prized Norkie is a Roger Kotanko'd Sport bought from a friend....I like this piece as much as any Colt I ever had.
I haven't checked recently but at one time when Norcs were still importable into the US, Wilson advertised that they would do work on certain 45s and others they would not and Norcs were one of the brands that they WOULD work on. While I'm not a real Norc fanatic if they're good enough for Wilson they can't be that bad.
+1
For me half of the fun is working on the equiptment.
You are not a real gun enthusiast unless you know how it works and what makes it better.
But, on the other hand I like buying something that a superior professional has already perfected
They are good cheap starter guns, but leave a lot to be desired. I've had a couple over the years, still have an NP29 for now but it will be sold shortly. They are loose and shoot OK, go bang and tend not to fall apart. They are not nice guns, there is no attention to detail, finish is poor at best compared to anything else on the market. Here in Canada they are a good deal, in the US they have a lot more affordable options for 1911's. If we could get some of the Philippines offerings for under $400 like they can, Norks would rarely be considered.
