Norinco Tokarev vs CZ52

Luckyorwhat

Luckyorwhat

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I'd like to get one of these 7.62 guys, but don't know which. The Norinco comes with a 9mm barrel, but the CZ is a CZ.

Which is preferable, and is the Norinco trigger as bad as some in US forums have said? Are those old ones, and new ones are better?

Also, where do you get CZ52s? I've found a Czech place selling them, plus many spare parts - is this where I get to know that Questar place?

Thanks;
Scott
 
Me, I want something in the same caliber so I have done a bit of looking.
The tokarev(and I assume the norinco version) are less accurate of the two, however it is cheaper and has a thicker barrel. The thicker barell is advantagous with the high pressure round that 7.62x25TT is. The CZ52 has a thinner barrel than the tok, and some disastrous explosions have resulted when the a7.62x25 round is mistaked for a 7.62x25TT round. The former being intnded for ruskie submachine guns, and are much higher pressure. Some have stated that this happens enough to warrant learning eastbloc languages to read what the surplus ammo crates say. But the CZ52 isent too much more expensive, and both guns have 9mm conversion kits which apparently are easily switched up so you can fire 7.62x25 or 9mm.
I personally want a CZ52 if the price is right, so I look forward to hearing from others regarding sources.
 
I have a CZ52 and from most of what I have read the CZ52 was designed to shoot the higher velocity Czech ammo also used in their submachine guns, it only makes sense to do so. The Czech ammo is a higher velocity or "hotter" round than the Russian. There is a bad batch of Bulgarian 7.62x25 ammo which is destroying CZ52's down in the USA but I don't believe it is available in Canada; here are some links and info:

http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/4653/bad.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62x25_Tokarev

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vz_52_(pistol)

The vz. 52 fires a particularly hot loading of the 7.62 x 25 mm TT cartridge developed in Czechoslovakia, designated M48. It is often referred to simply as the "Czech Load". This is an 85 grain (5.5 g) FMJ bullet fired at 1,640 ft/s (500 m/s), 18% faster than the stated velocity of the common Russian load. The Czech load gives both unusually flat trajectory and relatively high penetrative power for a handgun.
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Silverback said:
There is a bad batch of Bulgarian 7.62x25 ammo which is destroying CZ52's down in the USA but I don't believe it is available in Canada; here are some links and info:
Click to expand...
I hear that Bulgarian 7.62mm(and also Czech SMG ammo) have also destroyed Tokarevs:eek: not just Cz52's; I think it's the ammo and not the gun.
 
Luckyorwhat said:
I'd like to get one of these 7.62 guys, but don't know which. The Norinco comes with a 9mm barrel, but the CZ is a CZ.

Which is preferable, and is the Norinco trigger as bad as some in US forums have said? Are those old ones, and new ones are better?

Also, where do you get CZ52s? I've found a Czech place selling them, plus many spare parts - is this where I get to know that Questar place?

Thanks;
Scott
Click to expand...

I have both types; I personally prefer the Tokarev over the CZ.
-Both have ####ty triggers,
-Both are fairly accurate(not so much because of their great quality but because of the ammo they shoot)
-The CZ is somewhat heavier and feels less confortable in the hand; to me it's like shooting out of a brick(and not in a Glock kinda' way:) ). But this is my perception, other shooters, with different size hands might disagree.
-For some odd reason the kick is greater on the CZ than the Tokarev, using the exact same ammunition(it feels like shooting a .44 magnum revolver).
-The famous firing pin problem for the CZ is not a myth unfortunatelly...I needed two...:bangHead:
-Also I think, the CZ is picky on the ammo it shoots; I used different types of milsurp ammo in mine and had a couple jams with one type. I have not had such problems with the Tokarevs(I don't know about the Norinco).
Hope this helps.
 
Regarding the purchase of a CZ-52, your best option in Canada is currently...our very own CGN EE:wave: :wave: There are always people on the Forum wiiling to sell or trade away their CZ. In the "old days"(a couple months ago:rolleyes: ) P&S Militaria(aka JP) used to have these in stock for about $250, accessories included.
As for Questar, they are good to deal with, however it is just not worth it to import this gun($200 for the handgun, plus Questar fee of $225, plus shipping, duties and other headaches).
 
You might want to ping Clark about this subject. IIRC he tested CZ52s to destruction and attempted to do the same with Tokarevs. He found the Toks so strongly built that he was unable to damage them no matter how powerful his load. [But that's my memory and it might be wrong. Ask Clark.]

I have a Norinco Tokarev (Norkarev?) and, while the bang from it is very loud, the recoil feels trivial. Light bullet, lots of propellant. Firing Marstar military surplus, it was clocked at 1462 fps and the man who tested it, a much better shot than myself, shot a one inch group at 12 metres.

It does jam, a lot when clean and even more when dirty.
 
Is that Clark'159', '.com', or 'y'?

Thanks for tips all, I'm decided then.

To be perfectly clear though, is the Norkarev:) rated to fire TT ammo then?
 
From what I've seen, read and shooting I've done with my father's Tok (I kinda adopted it over the summer) I can say rather confidently that the Nork will eat whatever you want to feed it. As for reliablibity, as long as you don't limp-wrist the thing it will fire 100%. The one caveat the we encoutered when the Norkarev(?) was new it that the first mag had to be hand-cycled iin order for all the burrs and crap on the inside to get smoothed out. Many hundreds or rounds later it still keeps chugging along
 
Luckyorwhat said:
I'd like to get one of these 7.62 guys, but don't know which. The Norinco comes with a 9mm barrel, but the CZ is a CZ.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry this is of no help, but when I read this I couldn't help thinking of Homer saying
"Barney's film had heart, but football in the groin had a football in the groin"


I'd suggest the Tokarev because they're cooler. :D
 
I have TT33 and CZ52. Shoot both from time to time - accuracy is good enough for combat pistol. Barrel of TT33 is not chrome as compare to T54 Norinco. TT33 is more handy due to smaller size and lighter in weight. CZ52 is more complication internally - roller clam barrel lock, push botton slide release etc. If you can find both - go for it. They are keepers - if they are gone, they are gone.
 
Luckyorwhat said:
Is that Clark'159', '.com', or 'y'?
Click to expand...
Sorry, dumb mistake on my part. I confused the Clark of this group with Clark Magnuson <c.magnuson@comcast.net> of alt.rec.guns.

Clark Magnuson spends a lot of time testing various guns to destruction and has single-handedly destroyed the myth that CZ52s are much stronger than Tokarevs. Apparently, they are even weaker than old Mauser C96s. (I think that's neat -- I own a Norkarev and two broomhandles.)

You may wish to email Mr. Magnuson for his advice.
 
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