not on the CFC prohib list...

O

ollie

BANNED
BANNED
BANNED
Rating - 100%
20   0   0
Location
Winterpeg
Several discussions have occured on the board dealing with the legality of making new Semi auto only recievers for various guns, but what about ones that are not on the list, and wouldnt be prohibited for other reasons like OAL or barrel length? M2's, MG42's, Brens and so on are available built on new recievers and that's what gets me wondering.

What criteria deem a gun acceptable to be built as a "new" S/A? I'm thinkg PPSH-the parts kits are available and those russian wartime engineered recievers must be able to be duplicated with relative ease by a competent machine shop...?
 
Last edited:
There are dozens of WWII rifles and subguns that are only prohib because they are select fire or full auto, they are not prescribed(by name) prohibited. All it takes is a new manufactured receiver that is semi auto only and they would be either restricted or non-restricted depending on barrel length. One problem we face though is that all those cheap surplus f/a milsurps that are available cannot be parted out by the shops that have them here in Canada. It's also pretty tough to get customs to clear a "parts kit" for a f/a firearm if you were to import.
 
"Variant" is relevant only when a firearm is specifically named. If the firearm is not specifically prohibited by name, then a semi only version might be possible, like the examples listed. If a new semi only receiver is made, it is likely going to have to be specifically approved by the Techs at the Registry, and a new FRT number created. A possible source for a parts kit would be a currently registered prohib. Break it for parts, and scrap the receiver. Duplicating a PPSh receiver would not be easy. It is a heavy, formed steel pressing. Substantial dedicated tooling would be necessary. Manufacturing one in a machine shop would be a challenge, and likely prohibitive from a cost standpoint. The thread is probably no longer available, but a CGN member has described in detail his difficulty in getting a semi auto Sten type firearm entered into the system, because of official differences in opinion over what part constitutes the receiver. Keep in mind that there are no standards over what constitutes an acceptable semi auto design. The ones currently available are US versions, approved by the ATF, and subsequently accepted as semi by the CFC.
 
The semi-auto sten guy would be me, and I'm still waiting. Whatever you build would have to be different enough so as not to be easily made full auto, and not able to accept full auto parts. And of course, the registerable part must not have been previously a F/A.
The nail biting would begin if and when you send it in for examination. Thats when you may or may not ever see it again.
The time delays don't seem to be entirely because of the difficulty in deciding whether the gun is acceptable. I built two AR15s using 80% receivers, and I'm still waiting (almost a year now) to get an FRT # assigned to them. Actually, I think at this point, I have about a half dozen guns tied up in the CFC for different reasons; a couple for no FRT#, decision as to whether it's a C/A, determination whether it's restricted or not, deregistration of a non-registerable cannon, and acknowledgement of deactivation.
I would say the CFC is now officially a typical government beurocracy, tied up in red tape and backlog. They also seem to be second to the RCMP lab in decision making.
 
So where does one start the process? I would like to do it, and even be willing to lay out a fairly substantial sum to have a receiver made. Is it possible to consult the RCMP or CFC before expending huge amounts of time and more importantly, money?

Also, how can I ever get a look at a PPSH reciever or plans thereof? It would help to know what would be involved exactly in machine work to get a quote, and also to give the authorities to consider.

Can anyone with some subgun experience say what a PPSH mechanism is most like? Sten? Thompson? ____? might be important if it closely resembles another gun, particularly the status of it's closest cousin...
 
I'd stick with your other idea of taking a 10/22 and dressing it up. It *might* be easier to just get some sort of PPSH looking covering parts for it, granted it's still a .22 and that's probably not quite as fun, though the 25 round mags beg to differ. You'd also need PPSH mags for it, can't imagine those are readily available pinned to 5.
 
the plot thickens... I am most certainly going to follow this a little farther...
80% recievers, new production(i think) can be ordered S/A only, good price

http://www.prexis.com/sten/51.htm

If this gun is not prohibited, it'll be a bit of work but I will get my PPSH! So who do I buzz to inquire? The CFC?
 
The other problem you will have is getting a parts kit in to work from.

They do not allow them to cross the border unless you are grandfathered for that firearm.

Not sure if there is law to back it up but it is their policy.
 
What about finding a prohib for sale and getting them to take out the receiver, which I assume is the registerable part, and selling you the rest. That would leave you, hopefully, with a barrel and all the other fixins just minus a receiver.....
 
Well, I called the CFC today and they told me they would get back to me...

Basically told that it may be entirely possible, but unless they can get in touch with the Interordanance who made the semi SR41's(which would need new barrels,becaue the rifling only extends 10 inches, the other 6 are blank), I will be required, at my expense, to send a specimen of whatever I want to import (or make), be it reciever, or new produciton whole gun. However, he said he would keep checking and keep me informed if they find anything... I guess that's about it then, eh? I'll keep my ear to the ground and try to work something out, maybe buy one submit it as a sample...

Otherwise, apparently there are rare semi auto M60's out there that are in the process of being approved...

and if anything, it felt pretty good to use some of my tax dollars for a phone chat about guns! Not to mention he was one of the few i've ever spoken with who had actual knowledge of firearms!
 
happydude said:
What about finding a prohib for sale and getting them to take out the receiver, which I assume is the registerable part, and selling you the rest. That would leave you, hopefully, with a barrel and all the other fixins just minus a receiver.....
Click to expand...

Marstar who has the largest supply of WWII f/a's in inventory, cannot even sell prohib parts to non 12(x) license holders. It will be difficult getting the parts to even put a new manufactured non-restricted or restricted together.....
 
Hitzy... Is it law that Marstar can't sell the prohib parts OR is it their company policy? After all, only the reciever is the "controlled" part of the firearm in Canada.

Cheers
Jay
 
Jay said:
Hitzy... Is it law that Marstar can't sell the prohib parts OR is it their company policy? After all, only the reciever is the "controlled" part of the firearm in Canada.

Cheers
Jay
Click to expand...

I'll let them answer that......
 
If the CFC decrees from on high that a semi PPSH is not prohibited, wouldnt that make it legal to own parts for them? To undertake such a build, one would need a reciever, legal length barrel and all the other bits. If the gun is'nt a prohib, doesnt that open up a grey area about importing the relatively innane bits like butt, group, etc?
 
If im not mistaken customs hasnt got a problem as long as the parts are worth less than 100 bucks or something like that, and arent for a prohibited firearm. So you make a bunch of trips and bring back each little piece...
 
yes but in YOUR case it WOULD be for a prohibited firearm

remember pinning mags most are done with a pop rivit through the body to 5 or 10 rnd or less (rifle/pistol)

canada customs will NOT allow mags through unless they are welded they have thier own rules it really depends what crossing and what agent opens it IF its opened
 
The under $100US per order exemption is only valid for certain exempt categories of parts. Bolts and barrels require import/export licences. Incidentally, an original length barrel would make the firearm restricted; with a 18 1/2+ barrel it would be non restricted. The SR41s, with US minimum 16+' barrels look weird, with a Cdn barel the appearance would be ridiculous. At least with a restricted 10" whatever length barrel, it would look like a PPSh. Customs is a power unto itself. This is another reason why going with the import/export permits would be a good idea if a border crossing is required. The paperwork is done in advance. I think that the best way to proceed would be to deal with the receiver first, and get it papered into the system. Then you would have proof that you are assembling a legal restricted/non restricted firearm, and any parts you are acquiring are specifically for a known-to-be-legal, documented firearm.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom