Old 1894 Winchester Value?

Fultron

Fultron

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Hello everyone, I'm sort of a lurker here, I don't post much but I do frequent this place. Anyway, right to the story.

An older friend and neighbor of ours who recently had some severe health problems was forced to move away to be closer to family. Before he left, seeing as he could no longer use the rifles and shotguns he owned, he gave them to my family. Among them were a few very old rifles, of which my favorite and subsequent choice turned out to be the Winchester. Without too much thought as to its monetary value, it went into the gun cabinet. Not doing any research, I had assumed it was a Winchester designed in 1994 rather than 1894.

The other day I decided to research what I had here, and I was somewhat astonished to realize this particular Winchester was built in 1912, seeing as it has a serial number in the 624 ### range. Furthermore, the rifle is in nearly mint condition with a bore that could not have seen more than 200-300 rounds. The bluing is in amazing condition, 98% intact with only a worn area around the barrel near the front sight, as if it was repeatedly picked up and set down that way. It is chambered for the .32 Winchester Special and seems to have a 3/4 Magazine. It also has a hole on the left side of the receiver where I believe there was at one point a saddle ring that has since been lost. The action is magnificent, working with amazing ease compared to our Marlin 336 and a friends Post 64 Model 1894.

This is sort of long, so I'll get to the point. When we received the rifle, it had been drilled and tapped for a side mounted scope. I have since removed the mount and all, but there are still 4 empty holes on the side of the receiver .

Do you guys have any idea what this rifle might be worth? Obviously there is no way I would sell it, but I would like to get an idea. Also, will the value be reduced significantly since it was drilled and tapped?

Thanks a lot for those who bothered to take the time to read this, can't wait to hear what you have to say.
 
You are going to get quite a variety of answers as to value, I would guess. If I were you I would just look up one of the many genuine Winchester collectors on the net and contact one or two of them. Short of a picture, you gave an excellent description of it. The point is, the answers you get here will be so varied that you won't know who to believe, nor who is giving an opinion based on genuine knowledge, and who is just giving an opinion.
 
Sounds like it would be a very nice collectable (read $$$) 94 till you got to the part about the D&T for side mount! I have a 1954 M-64 in .32 in same condition but it too had been D&T for a side mount scope! I figure mines worth about $4-500 bucks.
 
I am not an expert but just the drilling has altered the value greatly. Being "unoriginal", the gun becomes a "shooter" which means "of little collector value" . Being in 32SP caliber again deminishes value as the caliber is not in high interest. It truely has the value of what someone will pay for it. An octagon barrel being of higher interest than a round barrel. You call it a rifle but the empty Saddle ring hole says it is a carbine with a 20 inch barrel. I can place a value of $350-$450. I have several originals in this age bracket and can guage by what they cost me.
 
The collector value is definitely gone due to being D & T'd. As well, the mag may have been shortened, and the saddle ring is missing.
That said, if it's a great solid shooter, MY opinion would be between $300 and $450.
 
I noticed at the Calgary gunshow that alot of .30-30 Winchester 94's manufactured in the early decades of the 20th century were going from $350-$450. Mind you if it was in a different caliber the prices just got stupid!!!
 
The big demand seems to be the obscure calibers. I have been hunting for winnies in 38-55 caliber. Not many seem to be around. Most are stowed away in a safe or closet. The 30-30 caliber, except in exceptional shape and/or special features, is so commonplace. Some 60-80% guns are just being used as shooters. If it is not original condition, just use it yourself and enjoy.
 
Pics would help. I'd hazard a guess that you would be able sell it in the $400 - $550 range on the CGN exchange forum, possibly a little more. It would be worth more without the drill and tap.

Generally speaking the collector market is a lot smaller in Canada than it is in the USA, and a lot harder to nail down with prices. Pricing estimates you get from the US collector's forums are not always relevant for Canada.
 
Alright, thanks a lot guys. I figured that the scope would have cut the value substantially. If I had a camera I would post some pictures but unfortunately I do not currently own one.

After some measuring I guess this is a carbine with the 20 inch barrel, but that makes me wonder why the mag is so short. Is there any evidence of 3/4 mag carbines at all? If not, is there any way I can bring it back to its original configuration?

EDIT
I should also state, right now, the rifle holds 4 + 1 in the chamber, which seems odd to me.
 
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the gun cannot be returned to its former glory and still be a "collector. The gun can have a new full length mag tube added for aesthetics and keep as a hierloom. the holes can be plugged with setscrews . The gun even as an early pre war carbine has little value other than as a "shooter",Too much damage and missing pieces lower the value considerably. I cannot tell without pics if the mag is held in place with a barrel band or a ring and dovetail slot under the barrel. If a ring and slot, it has really been damaged beyond repair , and would be only useful for parts.
 
A number of "Special Order" features wwere available for the Model 1894 Saddle Ring Carbine, which was most often chambered in either 30-30 or 32 Winchester Special. The shorter magazine was a relatively inexpensive option to save a little weight. Most deer hunters found the saddle rings "rattled" too much and many were removed (forever). Likewise many were modified by drilling and tapping for either receiver (peep) sights or scopes which seemed to be very much in vogue in 50's and 60's.

Sounds like you've got a "shooter" in nice condition. Maybe $ 400 to $ 500.
Unaltered, maybe double that
 
1894 Saddle Ring Carbines came standard with a 20" barrel and full mag, and has a barrel band just behind the rear sight around the barrel and tube, but could also be ordered with a 3/4, 1/2 or button magazine. Good chance yours is original. The 3/4 mag is a nice looking option, in my humble opinion.
Pics would be useful.
Also, yes, as noted above, drilled and tapped (like a reblue or refinish) and you can cut the value in half, but it still sounds like a very nice gun to me. Enjoy it!

Matt

P.S. Just curious: does your carbine have the rear ladder flip-up carbine sight, or a different type, i.e a 3 leaf express sight, etc. Sometimes you'll find the SRCs with special orders, such as a special length magtube, may also have been fitted with special sights.

Cheers.
 
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I know its of no value to a collector since it had the scope mounted, I just thought it may not be in the original configuration and that I might be able to restore it to something close to standard for my own peace of mind. I like to have my rifles in the configuration they were designed for. Anyway, since it was an option to have the 3/4 mag, I think I will leave it the way it is and put it to good use. It makes a good, fast-handling brush gun.

And to Matt74, it does have the flip up carbine sight.
 
I'd leave it as is too. Sounds like a very nice little carbine. I just picked up a 1921 30WCF Saddle Ring Carbine a few weeks back, and you are right, they are a fast handling littlegun. I couldn't believe how quick mine came up, and how comfortable it was at the shoulder. Enjoy the ol' gun!

Matt

P.S. If the 3/4 mag is original, and it likely is, they are a nice special-order feature, and does add to the gun. Personally, I like the looks of the shorter mags too.
 
If the Magazine used to be full length there should be a hole on the bottom of the barrel where the screw that went through the magazine cap used to seat.
Sad about the scope mount. These rifles really do not need a scope, and it makes them clunky to handle. Screws the value too.
It could be restored, as far as the magazine tube and carbine saddle ring of course, just a matter of finding the parts.
It's not absolutely impossible that the gun came with a short mag. Winchester did a large business in the custom shop in those days. Check for that hole.
 
It appears that the 3/4 mag is original, as its lacking the hole on the barrel. Thats comforting in a way, the rifle hasn't been completely molested as I thought for a moment. I just may look for a saddle ring though, considering the big hole in the receiver is kind of ugly, and makes a good place for dirt and water to collect.

I didn't realize the sights were worth that much. I do like them but there doesn't seem to be anything particularly special about them, besides that they flip.
 
Matt74 said:
1894 Saddle Ring Carbines came standard with a 20" barrel and full mag, and has a barrel band just behind the rear sight around the barrel and tube, but could also be ordered with a 3/4, 1/2 or button magazine.
Cheers.
Click to expand...

Actually on original SR carbines the barrel band is between the front site & the muzzle. :)

And for JYC :eek: Again on a SRC carbine there is no hole for the mag cap screw to go in to. :)

HPIM0251.JPG


Hopefully I can shoot a rifle better than I can a camera :rolleyes:
 
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