Ontario ammo registry

amber2010

amber2010

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Stouffville, Ontario
I'm not sure if this has been discussed before, so correct me if it has and /or delete as you see fit.
Exactly what is the purpose of recording all retail ammo purchases in Ontario? I believe it was the Rae government that initiated it some time ago during those dark years of his reign.
What do stores do with the lists? Does the CFO get them? Is there some dark damp cellar where some poor b'tard has to look at them eventually? And do what? See which gangbanger bought some ammo?
Or could it just have been a smoke and mirrors exercise? Methinks I know the answer.
 
Mail... Order...

And, the ammo registry in ONTerrible has ZERO affect on criminality! It is a complete waste of resources & puts law abiding gun owners at risk by recording their name, PAL number, address & ammunition purchase!

Cheers
Jay
 
Passed unanimously in Ont legislature by all present including Mike Harris later premier who left it on the books.
 
Can come one clarify this ammo registration for me?

A) Stores are recording who bought what and keeping it on record for the same reason we register handguns
or
B) Stores are keeping records of what they sell like most retail stores

Before the paranoids pipe up does any one actually have an answer? A lot of stores keep record of what you buy. You have a card at MEC or La senza they have your name and a copy of the receipt attached....OMG the government knows I like wearing G strings over thongs!!!!
 
Gnome75 said:
Can come one clarify this ammo registration for me?

A) Stores are recording who bought what and keeping it on record for the same reason we register handguns
or
B) Stores are keeping records of what they sell like most retail stores

Before the paranoids pipe up does any one actually have an answer? A lot of stores keep record of what you buy. You have a card at MEC or La senza they have your name and a copy of the receipt attached....OMG the government knows I like wearing G strings over thongs!!!!
Click to expand...

yup HERE it is Ontario LAW

https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/94a20
 
We keep them on an Excel spread sheet containing the date, time, quantity/caliber, PAL # and stock number of the product. A separate spread sheet is likewise kept for the sale of pellets (yes for air guns). Both are done to comply with Ontario's Ammunition laws.

Originally there was a requirement to record the name and address of the buyer as well. While the law was never changed and technically it still "should" be recorded to "comply with the law as written", a good while ago the CFO issued a circular saying that due to privacy concerns they would no longer be "checking for name/address". However, like I said, the law was never amended, so if the Attorney General got a burr in their butt they could pull the Business Firearms Licences (BFL's) of any Ontario retailer "not" recording the name and address along with the other required information.

There is nothing in the law that I have seen that says "how long" we have to keep the records, so we have quite a number of years worth.

They DO NOT get sent anywhere, achieved at some secret location, transferred to some main frame etc, they are on a single stand-alone machine (where I work - that's the way "we do it", others may differ - there is not list of specifications as to how or where it must be stored).

And YES, every 6 to 8 weeks the Regional CFO stops by and amongst his other checks (guns properly locked up in show cases, warehoused guns stored in a secure lock-up, not exceeding our total amount of ammunition etc) he "does" check the sales logs. It's almost always simply a "look to see that we are doing it" - he has never made a note, made a copy - in fact one of the few times he commented was when he saw that we had recorded a temporary licence number issued to a US hunter (the number is way longer than a PAL/RPAL so it really stood out).

And yes, if you have a BFL and sell pellets, similar records are kept (just don't need a PAL to buy them - any "Government issued photo ID is fine". If you don't have a BFL then NO RECORDS are required when you sell pellets (figure the reason for that one???)

This was probably another one of those "see Toronto, we are taking steps to protect you" laws that serves no other purpose than "perception of taking action".

More recently, possibly due a number of issues with "failing to check when selling ammo or stolen/forged PAL" it has been "suggested" that we confirm the identity on the PAL with a second piece of photo ID. Since this isn't the "law" we have not implemented it - it's onerous enough already just complying with the law as written.
 
Our local Can Tire keeps hard copy ledger books under lock at all times and only for 30 days after they're full. After that they go to the shredder. That requires the local CFO rep to get their arses in gear if they want to check the ledger. Local management flatly refused to keep customer's personal info on their computer data base recording only normal sales and inventory.
 
It's a great example of a futile effort.

I'm sure every time someone is shot in the 'hood with a 9mm the police run to all the retailers to check to see who bought 9mm ammo recently...

The geniuses who came up with this should be embarrassed.
 
667 said:
It's a great example of a futile effort.

I'm sure every time someone is shot in the 'hood with a 9mm the police run to all the retailers to check to see who bought 9mm ammo recently...

The geniuses who came up with this should be embarrassed.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I'd wager things like ammo registration have probably never been used for any productive purpose, nor probably ever prevented any crimes. Although if the government took all the tax dollars spent on these placebo regulations, and instead spent the money on community out reach programs for inner-city and at risk youth, it would likely serve society in a far more long term and productive manner.

-R
 
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