Optics Review for the newer Precision Shooter

Tomochan

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An update to this article with more scope reviewed and better pictures taken can be found at: http://rifletalk.org/2015/04/26/optics-selection-for-the-newer-precision-shooter/


I have owned a lot of scopes and the reason I've owned so many is because, like most people, I made the mistake of initially buying cheap scopes. Today, I firmly believe the old adage "only a rich man can afford cheap glass". So, having written a number of reviews about various firearms - all of which can be found in their respective forums - I thought it was about time that I shared some observations I have made regarding some of the optics choices out there. These observations are geared towards the newer shooter or someone considering an upgrade.

I must point out that I am even less of an optics expert than I am a firearms expert and all the observations I make are totally subjective using no fancy measuring devices just the 'as issued eyeball/human/ Ver 1.0' All scopes have been subjected to a standard 'box test' and evaluated through the range of magnification (where applicable) that each scope has. Please note: I have not typed up all the technical specifications because if you are reading this you have access to the internet and can easily find out all that stuff from the various websites of the scope makers.

I am not going to comment about glass I have not owned nor used extensively and I'm just writing about scopes here not ACOG's, Red Dots etc.

In keeping with my style when writing about firearms, I cover a range of price points and keep to some consistent observations which are:

Price and Availability
Looks
Controls
Optical Clarity
So what do we have to review ? Here are the test subjects:
Chinese Knock-Off's Commonly Found on Ebay
Cheap Chinese 'Brand Name' Scopes - like NcStar, Leapers, Zos etc
Brand Name and Pricier Chinese/Other Asian Scopes - Falcon, BSA
Bushnell Elite Series Scopes (3200, 4200 and 6500)
Sightron Scopes
Nightforce NXS and BR Scopes
Schmidt and Bender PMii

Cheap Chinese Knock Off Scopes

The huge attraction of these scopes is that they are cheap and so readily available. They promise an amazing range of magnification, illumination and features for less than $200 and sometimes even cheaper. A plentiful supply and no hassle in getting them - what could be better ? Sadly, though shipped from Asia and arriving at your door often within a week, these scopes are, by and large, just junk. The glass can vary from 'bottom of beer glass' quality to reasonably OK but the one cilck ( yes, 'click' isn't always spelled correctly! ) per 1/4 MOA can vary from a a quarter of an inch to an inch at 100 yards to nothing at all at 100 yards. When you figure out what one or four clicks or eight clicks will move the POA don't write it down because it will change. Remember, I said that 'by and large these scopes are junk' well I put that caveat in there because sometimes you will come across one that is shockingly good - I had one completely fake 'Leupold Mk 4 Tactical in 3.5-10x40' that was clear, consistent and stood up to recoil on a M14 - but it really is a lottery. My advice: don't waste your money.

Chinese Brand Name Scopes

A XDOptics and something called an AIM
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If you read some of the UK gun mags - like, for example, Target Shooter - you will be surprised to see how many serious people use Chinese scopes. I can only assume that this is because of price but they cannot all be junkers because even if the scopes were free, people who shoot a lot won't use junk glass. I have used several of these Chinese Brand Name scopes - NcStar, a ZOS and a XD Optics. I found NcStar to be mediocre - all seem ok on a .22 but they are unreliable on any centrefire; some seem to hold a zero but many do not. My experience with ZOS was the same as that of one of my shooting buddies in that the glass was OK but the adjustments were off, they initially held zero but, over time, drifted and therefore proved to be a bad buy. My buddy still has his ZOS whereas I shot mine ( yes, you read that correctly - I shot it doing a Carlos Hathcock re-enactment! ). The XD Optics on the other hand is a good scope - it has true 1/8th clicks, the glass is OK and it holds zero but it has the oddest reticule - referred to as a 'Russian Sniper Reticule' it is profoundly unsuited for target work but would be OK for a plinker. It sits in the bottom of a drawer until I can find a use for it or give it away. My advice on these scopes: save your money - while they appear better than the simple knock off's there are better, much bette,r alternatives out there for just a bit more money.

Brand Name, Pricier Chinese/Other Asian - Falcon

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The Falcon range of scopes represents what I think of as the legitimate Asian made good quality scope. I have owned a number of their scopes and two of the Falcon offerings are still with me and both still see service on rifles today. Over the years I have found the Falcon 1.5-5 with red/green illumination to be a very good scope for my AR's and one of these still sits on my LMT MRP ( yes, it really isn't out of place on what is, after all, a high end AR ).

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The other I found very good was the Falcon Menace 4.5-18x56 and that is the scope that I always thought was the best they made. It may be actually out of production now, but I considered the Menace superior in optical clarity to the higher magnification FFP that replaced it. I owned four or five of these at one time and sold them as I upgraded - of the ones I sold, I know for sure that two are still in service on .308's and the owners continue to like them. After some period of time as an orphan then service on a .338 Lapua my remaining Falcon Menace now sits on a .223 bolt gun.

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Sniper Central did a good review of these scopes a while back and I concur with them: good glass, repeatable controls, a sticky mag adjustment ring at start, fairly soft - almost mushy - clicks (you don't want to use gloves ) but a good buy for the money (about $500 IIRC for the Menace). A mean, aggressive profile, these look like tanks and mine all held up well under lots of shooting.

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Bushnell Elite Series Scopes

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Back when dino’s roamed the earth, a very good line riflescopes were a staple of the multinational Bausch and Lomb who today make a myriad of eye-care products. Bushnell bought out B+L’s scope making business and rebranded them as Bushnell Elite. As of earlier this year, the Elite series of scopes remained Bushnell’s premier offering but within that line there are three distinct groupings – the 3200, 4200 and 6500 – with, generally, the 3200 being the cheaper and 6500 being the more expensive. Bushnell has recently dropped the numbering system and now uses just the word Elite but since I haven’t seen any of the new scopes I will stick to the old nomenclature.

I have owned more Bushnell Elites than any other brand of scope and used them on everything from hunting rifles to battle rifles to precision tactical rifles and have never been disappointed but there are, of course, limitations. I will speak about three of Bushnell’s Elite scopes in a bit more detail.

Firstly, let’s look at the 3200 fixed 10x – this scope which can be had for under $300 is one of my all-time favourite ‘value for money’ scopes and it is the only 1” tubed scope I’m covering in this review. This scope, like the others I will comment upon, forms part of Bushnells ‘Tactical’ line and that means it has exposed target knobs and some other ‘Tacticool” features that may or may not be of real world use but, nevertheless, appeal to many people. The fixed 10x with a 40mm objective is a simple scope with bags of eye relief, good internal adjustment and a mil dot reticle. Light weight and uncomplicated it is a robust scope that I have used extensively on both M14 and AR 15 platforms and I have never had a failure ( M14’s are hard on glass and are a good test of a scope’s durability ). While I no longer own one of these scopes I would have no hesitation is saying that if you are looking for a cheaper fixed power scope then this scope is hard to beat – current Bushnell catalogue reference is ET1040.

Moving up in price to about the $7-800 range is the old Elite 4200 6-24x50 Tactical. This is one of my all-time favourite scopes and was the one I bought when I upgraded from the Falcon Menace’s. At one time, I had four or five of them I still own one that sits on my .300WM Remington/AICS. Bright and clear glass, 100% repeatable adjustments, good eye-relief, a 30mm tube and easy to use controls with 1 click = ¼ MOA adjustments this scope is also a very good ‘value buy’. One downside to this scope though is the limited internal adjustment – IIRC it is a mere 40MOA – and so this really necessitates the use of a canted rail and even then the LR crowd may find this scope runs out of elevation.

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At the $1000+ price point is the Elite 6500 Tactical 4.5-30x50. I have one of these scopes and, since I plan to sell it, I should bull this one up but I like my reviews to be honest and credibility is one thing that I’d like to hold onto so I have to call it like I see it. This scope is disappointing for the price – using my 1960 eyeball I have to say that the glass is neither as clear nor as bright on these scopes as it is on the 4200 6-24 x 50 and the increase in magnification from 24x to 30x power is not worth the increase in price. Overall, and the 6.5x magnification range notwithstanding, I cannot recommend this scope at the price point it is sold at as there are much better choices available and, as said, I consider this scope to be beaten out by its’ lower priced sibling the 6-24x50. I guess having said all that I will have trouble selling mine now but I'd rather be honest than BS to make an easy sale ;)

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While the Elite Tactical scopes generally have much to recommend them, they do have a weakness common to all and that is the reticule. While a useful and universally popular Mil Dot, the crosshairs are simply too thick – looking through these scopes at distant targets is like looking through a wrought iron fence !. Furthermore, Bushnell - no doubt appealing to the ‘Tacticool’ crowd - did one stupid thing with these scopes; they ‘blacked out’ the controls, replacing the easy to read gold lettering with hard-to-see green lettering. With my 50 year old eyes this makes seeing what I am doing quite tough and reaching for a pair of reading glasses so ruins the image that many of us mall-ninja’s try to achieve lol !

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Sightron Scopes - The 'just over $1K offerings'.

Sightron in the middle
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I was late getting onto these scopes – for quite some time I thought of them in the same category as the Vortex Viper line of scopes that some people think so highly of but which I consider to be much overrated.

Eventually I had a chance to look through the Sightron 10-50x60 used by my good buddy and shooting partner C3ppp0 and was sufficiently impressed to buy my own and I was most impressed. Very clear glass, 1/8th clicks that are not mushy, consistent repeatability, and a very fine crosshair makes this a first class target scope. I have now sold this one to another buddy as I have upgraded further but I would have no hesitation in recommending this scope to anyone looking for a high magnification target scope.

The real gem amongst the Sightron line though is not the 10-50x60 but rather the 8-32x56 with the LRMOA reticule.

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I first saw his scope being used by Jerry Teo (Mysticplayer) at an F-Class match in September of this year and was sufficiently impressed that a month or so later I contacted Jerry and bought that very scope from him. This scope, which retails for more or less the same price as the Bushnell Elite 6500 (or, for that matter, the Vortex Viper PST 6-24x50) is an outstanding value for money riflescope. It has exceptionally clear glass, precise adjustments, more internal range than the same magnification range Nightforce and a very, very good reticule. Jerry and I have bantered back and forth about the merits of Sightron vs. NF and, owning both, I have to eat some crow here and go on record as saying that, when comparing this particular scope to the 8-32x56 NF NXS, the result is too close to call – to my eyes they are the same with the LRMOA reticule proving the superior to the Nightforce MLR reticule. Add cost of the scopes into the equation and the Sightron is the obvious choice.

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Overall, not only are Sightron good value but also they are not outclassed in any way by scopes costing much, much more money.

Nightforce Scopes – NXS and BR

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We have now moved past the $1K mark and all the scopes being commented upon from here on in cost more than $1500 and, in some cases, much more. The question of ‘is it worth it’ becomes much more pronounced once one passes the grand for glass and at this level I really recommend that you take a hands on look at the scope you want to buy before making the commitment. Please don’t rely upon guys like me – my eyes are not your eyes! Having said that, I have three Nightforce scopes and the one thing you can say about them is that they are well built. The NXS scopes are heavy and feel as though they could be used as war-clubs should the need arise. They have a well-deserved reputation for being tough, have excellent glass, precise controls with the very best tactile feedback ( probably developed for those who go in harm's way ), and are 100% repeatable shot-to-shot - as scopes in this price range ought to be.

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The two NF NXS I have are the 8-32x56 and the 55-22x50 and both have the MLR reticule, which I like but not as much as the LRMOA offered by Sightron - though the NXS does offer an illuminated reticule missing on the Sightron. While both my NXS’ are very clear and sharp, I do find that to my eyes the 5.5-22 to be crisper. It should not be the case, but I can only report what my eyes tell me. We are talking in terms on nuanced not substantial difference though.
In terms of internal adjustment it is hard to beat the 100MOA of elevation that the 5.5-22x50 packs and that, combined with a 20-40 MOA canted rail and a flat shooting cartridge, should allow even the keenest LR junkie to get his or her fix.

While the NSX clearly aims at the tactical rifle shooting market the NF Benchrest is geared towards target shooters and if the number of these that are seen on the shooting lines are a good indication, they are indeed very popular.

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I have the 12-42x56 model and I find the glass to be even clearer than my NXS. Making a side-to-side comparison to my old target scope (Sightron 10-50x60 covered above) I prefer the NF for clarity, resolution and sharpness but the Sightron has a bit more internal adjustment and, frankly, better (albeit non illuminated) reticule choices. Still, in this head-to-head the NF is, in my opinion, the winner.

No matter what NF you get, the hole in the pocket won’t be much less than $2K. What you will get in return is a scope of proven pedigree that will impress, is most unlikely to break and will do a good job of holding its’ value.

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Schmidt and Bender PMii - Over $2500

S+B have been around for a long time (1957) and all they make are riflescopes. They did for a while make spotters but not anymore. As we all know, scopes depend upon glass quality and I’m guessing that, since scope companies buy their glass from glass sellers, some of the glass found in my Nightforce or Sightron scopes may well be the same glass as found in your Vortex or Leupold. With S+B though they use their own glass – I believe they bought out the company that used to make their glass. Buying a S+B in Canada can be a long process depending upon what you want as they are not carried everywhere and few are made.

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The upside is that pretty much all S+B's are custom orders so you can get what you want 1/4 or 1/8 MOA, clockwise or counter clockwise turrets a wide choice of reticles, First Focal Plane or Second Focal Plane the choice is yours.

I have only one S+B – I have the relatively new 12-50x56 with ¼ MOA and SFP. I chose the P4F reticule and time from order to delivery was over five months. Cost ? Well if you have over $2500 burning a hole in your pocket add a few more bucks to the pile and you can also be a member of the S+B club. No “if’s and’s or but’s” about it, these scopes are expensive but if you want what is arguably the best scope in the World this is what you need to get.

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S+B optical clarity is, to my eyes, unsurpassed. Unlike the "NF vs. Sightron vs. Vortex vs. Whathaveyou" debate, there is no grey area in this statement: the S+B glass is, quite simply, the best I have looked through. I say this not just based on my scope but having looked through several other PMii's and I conclude that, for my eyes and under various light conditions, I have not seen better light transmission and clarity. If there is a small criticism of the S+B it would have to be in the tactile feedback provided by the controls - like Sightron it is easy to over adjust especially when wearing gloves or under time pressure to make adjustments.

Why no Leupold in this review ? Well, a long time ago and in a land far away Her Majesty paid for me to play with firearms and at that time the marksmen used Leupold scopes and I thought they were the Cat's Posterior but, in more recent years, I have looked through a lot of Leupolds' and think that they are pretty much the same as they were years ago. Frankly I think they let the competition catch up and then pass them. I would still be very confident using a Leupold but in a marketplace full of better choices I would not buy one.

What rings etc - everyone has their own preference but mostly I use TPS steel. I've never been disappointed and the price is good. I also have Burris, Badger Ordnance and Near Manufacturing - all are excellent though the latter two are pricey.

Finally, a pic of the toys that braved the rain and dark low cloud conditions on the mountain today to provide some real-time comparison to the S+B:

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Thanks for reading.
 
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Great review. Thanks for taking the time to type all that out. Have you any experience with the Premier Reticle scopes? I read great things about both Premier and S+B, but I definitely like the Gen 2 XR reticle that Premier has going.

Also, I've read some guys saying that the 5.5-25x56 is good to 1500m, but then why wouldn't you go with the 12-50x56 if it's almost the same cost? Isn't it better to have more magnification available to you, especially for longer distances?
 
Great review. Let me know when you will be sending me the S&B for further study :)

magnification for LR shooting is depending on what you are trying to do. With quality glass, you can see a whole bunch with a 24X scope. I boulder smash beyond 1500yds with a SIII 6-24X50 and have no issues seeing the dust kick up from a 80 or 90gr 22cal bullet.

For F class paper punching, I use my 10-50X60 Sightron mostly at 40X even at 300m.

Fit the scope to the application. There is no one right answer to fit everthing.

Jerry
 
Good write up.

Right to the point.

I just ordered a Sightron 8-36x56LRMOA from Mystic. I hope I'm as impressed with it as you are.
 
In answer to a question about magnification, I will take clarity over magnification any day but if you can have both then why not. You don't have to use the whole range. I know some guys say "all you could possibly need is Xpower to hit the hemorroids outta a gofer at 600" and all that but, really, more magnification than less is always good if the clarity is there.

With respect to Premier Reticles, I have only looked through a few at the range - they look nice and appeared clear but I didn't feel sufficiently experienced with them to really comment.
 
Great review. Thanks for taking the time to type all that out. Have you any experience with the Premier Reticle scopes? I read great things about both Premier and S+B, but I definitely like the Gen 2 XR reticle that Premier has going.

Also, I've read some guys saying that the 5.5-25x56 is good to 1500m, but then why wouldn't you go with the 12-50x56 if it's almost the same cost? Isn't it better to have more magnification available to you, especially for longer distances?
You question is a good one indeed. My answer may be wrong, but I'm going to guess perhaps the internal MOA (UP) is lacking in one or the other.
That's what often stalls optics purchases for long range shooters IMO.

Cheers!
 
Also, I've read some guys saying that the 5.5-25x56 is good to 1500m, but then why wouldn't you go with the 12-50x56 if it's almost the same cost? Isn't it better to have more magnification available to you, especially for longer distances?

the 5-25 is easily a 1500+m scope, the fact of the matter is the 5-25 is better "all around" scope, a minimum of 12x mag is quite high for any thing other then shooting long distance ALL the time, it rather limeted in its applications compared to the 5-25..

clear glass makes up HUGE for magnification, id take a 15x super clear scope over any high mag scope with s**tty glass any day. so huge amount of magnification isnt need, and chances of useing the 50x mag on the SB is pretty slim, onces u get that high up mirage is goin to come imto play no matter how good your glass is


You question is a good one indeed. My answer may be wrong, but I'm going to guess perhaps the internal MOA (UP) is lacking in one or the other.
That's what often stalls optics purchases for long range shooters IMO.

Cheers!
both the 12-50 and 5-25 have 65MOA internal, with the doubl turn turret, the 12-50 is avail with 1/8th moa adjustments and in a multi turn turret and has 75moa
 
Another good one! Its very interesting that with your range of experience the two scopes you mentioned as "all time favourites" were Bushnell 4200s. This is good info for guys on a budget, to know they can get into the sport and have reasonable glass without spending mega bucks. I concur that the 4200s are good value for money.

I also concur that to my eyes Sightron and NF glass is comparative, at least that was the case of the few I have looked through. I'm just talking about vision quality here.

The Elite 6500 4.5-30 is actually more reasonable value than suggested. While I chose to buy the Sightron. That model 6500 tactical can be had for $749 new. Which makes it appealing when compared to the 8-32 Sightrons at $900 plus. Especially if the 6500 has all the features your looking for.


Thanks for taking the time to write this up.
 
Always feel thankful when a fellow nut takes the time to share his or her wisdom ane experience with those of us just learning. Your time is not wasted.
 
Another good one! Its very interesting that with your range of experience the two scopes you mentioned as "all time favourites" were Bushnell 4200s. This is good info for guys on a budget, to know they can get into the sport and have reasonable glass without spending mega bucks. I concur that the 4200s are good value for money.

Please note that Tomochan is likely refering to older 4200's. I have also had a love affair with these scopes and were by goto 1" tube scope for years (see my website). The front AO versions 6-24 and 8-32 were great. Not much for elevation adj but that could be dealt with using careful shimming.

Optics were as good as NF given they were both made in the same place. Tracking was dead on and reliable. For the money, these oldies are still goldies.

Unfortunately, Bushnell is now on a bling binge and optical quality is taking a backseat (no more Bausch and Lomb).

I stopped using Elites several years back when I noticed many items, including the 4200's starting to faulter. Luckily Sightron came in to fill that void and must say, done it better then expected.

If you go by dollars spent vs features on paper, the Bushnell continue to impress. Which is the whole point. Vortex has done an even better job.

BUT both companies are faultering on what I consider the most important part of a scope - optical quality.

Bells and Whistles, knobs and lights get real boring real quick when you can't see the target you want to shoot at.

ALOT of consumers are siding with the bling for dollar products as we have seen a great growth in this segment. Whatever floats your boat.

however, I sense they will drift away from all this stuff once they mature as shooters and consider the process of shooting more important then standing in front of a mirror ;)

YMMV

Jerry
 
Jerry is correct - I am referring to the slightly older Elites. Both the old 1" tube and the earlier Elite 4200 Tacticals with the 30mm tube were/are excellent. I began to fall out of love with the product when I took delivery of the 6500 ( which was, at that time $1100 - now at about $800 ) and then, again, when they went to the stupid stealth green markings that are all but impossible to see.) These innovations (6.5 mag range and tacticool markings ) coincided with a dropping off of optical clarity.

For $1000, which is not an unreasonable sum to spend on a scope, the Sightron Siii has to be my pick and, like I say, even though I own a NF in the same mag range as my Siii ( 8-32x56) the difference in clarity is too close to call. The NF has an illuminated reticule and better tacticle adjustments but the Siii has a better reticule choice and is $800 or so less money. This mag range will perform double duty - F-Class and Tac Rifle and is my all around favorite mag range. If you need more internal MOA then drop down to a NF 5.5-22 or similar.

If you need higher magnification, then of the two scopes I have tested that are within a reasonable budget, I would give the nod to the NF benchrest 12-42 over the Siii 10-50 but it is a close race and the Siii is cheaper by about $400 or so and has a higher top end magnification and, again, better reticule choices.

Obviously, but in the stratospheric price range , the S+B is the best I have looked through and my 12-50 did not disappoint. A richer-than-me shooting buddy pointed out yesterday that the danger of owning a S+B is that one will become spoiled and will want to upgrade all one's glass to that level. I see bankruptcy in my future......
 
If you can find one of the discontinued Bausch & Lomb 10X (fixed) Tactical scopes that were offered in the late 1990's, they are a great optic!!!!!

I paid $950.00 for mine from Wolverine Supplies...............They were as high as $1500.00 at one point........

The Navy SEALs used them on their M25 rifles.........

Only scope I regret selling.........:(

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http://www.snipercentral.com/bl10x.htm
 
Tomochan, thanks again for taking the time to write up the review. Nice to hear varied comments on a variety of gear. One thing I would point out is sightron has different levels of optics. I have some s11's and would recommend guys pay more and go with s111's
 
Tomochan, thanks again for taking the time to write up the review. Nice to hear varied comments on a variety of gear. One thing I would point out is sightron has different levels of optics. I have some s11's and would recommend guys pay more and go with s111's

Thanks for the compliment. You are correct - Sightron certainly has different levels of optics; I have only used the Siii's though. Likewise I think people really like the higher end Vortex but I haven't seen them and I'd be reluctant to spend a couple of grand on something that I haven't at least seen. The Vortex I have seen are the lower end and I am not a fan.
 
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