Over-scoped or NOT?

Bushwack

Bushwack

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I hope this posting is in the right section of this forum...:cool:

I have been taught that if you cannot be sure of a shot, you must rather not shoot at all. I believe that high magnification scopes delude infrequent hunters into taking risky shots they should not take.

In the hunting field an x12, or x24 or even a scope that magnify by x30 can create an unrealistic confidence about one’s own shooting ability. Why hunt game on 400 or even 600 meters; and I not even talking about the ‘machos’ that only take head shots at a certain impractical distance.

Silhouette shooters and snipers might and probably can reach those distances and even can go beyond, but I am a hunter and I still cannot see what the skill in that is…

I believe that a hunter must have skills such as the ability to approach game silently and close enough to shoot from a reasonable distance.

How do you feel?
 
Thankfully, shots at extreme distances usually result in an equally extreme miss...and no chance of getting closer......EVER. It's always a good practice to shoot in your comfort zone, but I don't discount higher magX scopes as they are also helpful in load development, species identification, and determining legal shooting size (enough exposed bone).
 
I guess I agree - I have a Legend Ultra HD 1.75x - 5x with a D.O.A. reticle, on my .308 BLR, and it is certainly PLENTY for any shot I'm gonna take in the bush. Maybe more than that is needed if you hunt open spaces, but regardless of the scope power I frankly don't have the ability to take really long shots safely and humanely. Maybe not true for others, but that's my take on it.
 
If you are thinking in this regard, you are a hunter of high conscience.
Others, I hate to admit, give little thought to a quick trigger pull on the off chance of
hitting fur, regardless of a flop right there or chasing a blood trail.
Some don't even bother even looking.
It sure does boil my blood.

Bushwack said:
I hope this posting is in the right section of this forum...:cool:

I have been taught that if you cannot be sure of a shot, you must rather not shoot at all. I believe that high magnification scopes delude infrequent hunters into taking risky shots they should not take.

In the hunting field an x12, or x24 or even a scope that magnify by x30 can create an unrealistic confidence about one’s own shooting ability. Why hunt game on 400 or even 600 meters; and I not even talking about the ‘machos’ that only take head shots at a certain impractical distance.

Silhouette shooters and snipers might and probably can reach those distances and even can go beyond, but I am a hunter and I still cannot see what the skill in that is…

I believe that a hunter must have skills such as the ability to approach game silently and close enough to shoot from a reasonable distance.

How do you feel?
Click to expand...
 
The magnification of the scope has NOTHING to do with the mentality of the shooter. If the shooter has an elevated opinion of his or her skills bad stuff will inevitably happen.
I was to S.A. a few years ago on a hunt and got the P.H. all in a tizzy when I requested a cardboard box with a target be placed at 100 yards and then increased in 100 yard increments out to 1000 yards so I could re-zero my rifles. Thankfully I brought my own targets with me as the P.H. had none. I wondered at that point how he judged what a hunter was capable of but did not ask.

There are some people that take the time and invest in the gear to make long shots not only possible but repeatably possible. Like any SKILL it takes a TON of practice, as in several thousand rounds per year, using rifles and optics that are specifically built for the task as well as ammunition engineered to perform at long range. I don't golf and think it a silly game, HOWEVER I can recognize that it takes a lot of skill to play the silly game well.

"but I am a hunter and I still cannot see what the skill in that is…" Therein lies the problem. You should open your mind try shooting long range. You may be very humbled to learn what the skill level required is to be proficient at long range hunting. The skill level required increases exponentially when you are looking to cleanly kill an animal, assuming you plan to do so ethically, as most LR hunters I know of live by. There certainly is a different skill set required to purposefully get up close to game in a free range environment. Many simply stumble around the bush until luck puts them in close proximity to game and they claim THAT as hunting.

Long range hunting requires much more scouting, and surveying of the area for not only a spot to set up but also to know what your bullets will be in proximity to.
Taking into account distance, wind, mirage and all the other environmental factors require skills not required by close range shooters.
Knowing the EXACT location of the vital organs is also an important skill, given that as the distance increases so does group size, hence the 1 shot you get having to hit vitals and drop the animal pretty much on the spot is much more critical. To track or follow a wounded animal shot at close range is much easier than trying to pick it up once you have gotten to where you are sure the animal was when you shot.

Something I have learned from game shot here is that animals harvested at longer distance tend to taste better. Adrenalin does not taint the meat when an animal is at rest and not concerned about threats. Deer that have been pursued for miles, even leisurely have a much stronger game taste that 1s that were peacefully eating then dropped dead from a shot sent from afar. The same can be said for using blinds and tree stands. Unfortunately blinds and tree stands are not as practical out here on the bald ass prairies.
 
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personally all my hunting rifles are "overscoped" why? because i use the same rifles to hunt that i do for LR precision shooting, the area i hunt the shot can be from 10-350yards. and im 100% confident in my rifle and my shooting to take a shot on an animal at any of those distances and have a good ethical kill. as at 350yrds. as ATRS said, its taken lots of scouting, ranging known landmarks and survaying to know where my shot will come from and where it needs to go. Now it doesn't even start to become any form of test of the skill set i have spent years practicing. long range precision is and always has been where my true passion in the shooting sports lies. if the elements are so bad that im not comfortable making a 350yd shot, they are probably at that point that i have no desire to be out in them any way.. being able to stalk and approach pray is a very vital asset, but that comes with practice just like the ability to make those longer kill shots. the equipment needs to match the skills that need to match the style of hunt

do i care about carrying a 14+lbs rifle around all day? no 14lbs is a HELL of a lot lighter then the 90+lbs pack for extended hiking trips
 
Bushwack said:
I hope this posting is in the right section of this forum...:cool:

I have been taught that if you cannot be sure of a shot, you must rather not shoot at all. I believe that high magnification scopes delude infrequent hunters into taking risky shots they should not take.

In the hunting field an x12, or x24 or even a scope that magnify by x30 can create an unrealistic confidence about one’s own shooting ability. Why hunt game on 400 or even 600 meters; and I not even talking about the ‘machos’ that only take head shots at a certain impractical distance.

Silhouette shooters and snipers might and probably can reach those distances and even can go beyond, but I am a hunter and I still cannot see what the skill in that is…

I believe that a hunter must have skills such as the ability to approach game silently and close enough to shoot from a reasonable distance.

How do you feel?
Click to expand...

I agree that high power optics may encourage some hunters to delude themselves that they can take longer shots because the animal looks so big and close in their scope. But I won't hold that against the fellow who realises the inherent accuracy of his rifle and his own ability to shoot it to its potential are not directly improved by higher magnification. You can use more magnification in practise to get a better grasp of what the rifle can do and whether you are consistently able to make it do its best at longer ranges.

I am a hunter and I can see what the skill is in that long distance shooting. It takes less stealth to approach but more shooting skill. I prefer to put time and effort into practise to make the effort to stalk to within 100m and I know I usually shouldn't take shots much beyond 200 because unless conditions are ideal I am not usually in practise for them. But if you can kill humanely at longer ranges you must have worked for that so if you are hunting ethically and not wasting the animal, to me it means your hunting is different from mine, but not better or worse.
 
No matter what tool of harvest I have in my paws, I only take low percentage shots if:

-punching paper targets
-protecting someone else's livestock from predation (weasels/foxes/coyotes/wolves)
Anything else short of a close range emergency, is asking for trouble to some degree.

This is my opinion only.
 
IMO as you get more skilled you will get more comfortable with higher magnification and you may start to prefer having it.

If I am sitting in a bush line watching deer and decide to take one at say even 200 yards my scope will be on max power, I have become accustomed to visualizing EXACTLY where I KNOW my bullet will strike and with much practice and range time it has become second nature and I feel that high magnification has helped me with this.I do however know how far my target is before the scope gets up to my eyes.Again this is my preference. I also hunt with open sights and archery and don't take shots I am not comfortable with.

Right tool for the job sometimes comes into play.

Reticle configuration also becomes a factor.Thick, thin , post , cross hair etc...........

But once again this comes down to personal preference and comfort level, and a bit of optical quality.Can I make my 200 yard shot with a fixed 4 or a low power variable, of course, but personally I prefer magnification.Sometimes that extra X will show you a set of spikes that you may have thought was a doe with low power. ;)
 
Now that I am getting older my eyes are not as keen as they used to be. I appreciate good optics and higher magnifications. Where I use to use 4X I now use 9X to 12X. However, as has been said one should not overshoot their abilities. I do shoot a lot out to 500M and feel confident however, rarely if ever do I end up shooting that long.

One of the best things I've ever done is to bow hunt in the Sept season . This has totally changed how I hunt and if I don't fill my tags with the bow I hunt the same way in rifle season and end up usually getting opportunities at 100M or often much closer.

Can high power optics in the hands of a skilled and practiced shooter consistently take game way out there ? You bet
Is it a tough skill to master? You bet
Can optics make up for poor skills ? No f'ing way


If I was to give any advice it would be to master the gun you have scoped or not. Focus on improving your hunting skills ( I recommend bowhunting ) and if you want to shoot long distance invest time and money at the range and not in the woods.

It may sound weird but the more I shoot with my bow the better I get with my rifle.
 
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