Parkerizing and blueing questions

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Light Infantry

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I did a search on the board but didn't find the answers i needed.

I am getting ready to do some parkerizing and blueing and need to buy he chemicals/ingredients.

Easy enough to buy a kit, but i do have access to purchase whatever chemicals i need at the industrial level as we use all sorts of chemicals in our processes at work and am tapped into all the chemical suppliers in NA.

What are the base chemicals for parkerizing and for bluing? For the parkerizing I recall that there are 2 different base chemicals/methods that can be used. I am more interested to parkerize with the same chemicals that the used on the Garand.

Is there anywhere that i can download that has a step by step process?
 
Parkerizing solution is usually phosphoric acid and manganese dioxide.

Sometimes zinc is used in place of manganese dioxide...but that's usually when you'll be painting over top. If you want the finished surface parkerized, you want the manganese.
 
For those that are interested, here are pics of my tank:

All stainless construction. Heater element stainless as well. 48" long by 8" by 8"
Temperature probe not installed yet.

GM52Xxq.jpg


JsigKzV.jpg


yjwBTEn.jpg
 
RRH.01 said:
You got that far into your setup with out ever gookng "parkerizing base chemicals"? By the way the first hit is
Brownells manganese and zinc parkerizing how to
https://www.brownells.com/userdocs/learn/Inst-482 Parkerizing.pdf
Click to expand...

Sigh. Always someone. I did look into it. As I said easy enough for me to buy a kit and paying a mark up. However i want to see if i can buy the base chemicals from a chemical company and not a gun related store.
 
Manganese and zinc can be bought from pottery supply stores for reasonably cheap.
Phosphoric acid from hydroponic stores.

I have found that the premade solutions work better than the homemade solutions.

Ymmv
 
Light Infantry said:
Sigh. Always someone. I did look into it. As I said easy enough for me to buy a kit and paying a mark up. However i want to see if i can buy the base chemicals from a chemical company and not a gun related store.
Click to expand...
Sigh, theres always someone who never attempts theire own research aswell, as you could very simply look up brownells or anyones elses msds sheets for the solution and it would tell you exactly whats in it, you already know that working around chemicals though,
https://www.brownells.com/userdocs/...ERIZING SOLLUTION, 1 GALLON - 082_default.pdf.

That original link that was sigh worthy is a general how to, and has a wirte up on parkerizing specifically for the m1 garand.


There all questions answered by googling "parkerizing solution"
 
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ssapach said:
My understanding is that you don't want to use stainless tanks for the actual bluing solution.
Click to expand...

i was at first only looking at parkerizing, but if i can blue as well, that would be great.

I know for parkerizing, you want stainless. Someone told me that for blueing its the same, but will heed your comment and double check that! Thank you.
 
RRH.01 said:
Sigh, theres always someone who never attempts theire own research aswell, as you could very simply look up brownells or anyones elses msds sheets for the solution and it would tell you exactly whats in it, you already know that working around chemicals though,
https://www.brownells.com/userdocs/...ERIZING SOLLUTION, 1 GALLON - 082_default.pdf.

That original link that was sigh worthy is a general how to, and has a wirte up on parkerizing specifically for the m1 garand.


There all questions answered by googling "parkerizing solution"
Click to expand...



Just can't let it go can you? Why the douchebaggery?
I actually debated to state that i just started the research on this, and would get more info in the short period, but thought "Nah, what for". I though what are the odds that a pompous ass would come along?!.

I only checked this board to see if there was any info before i posted asking for help from the (mostly) good people of this board.

I apologize that my enthusiasm got ahead of me and i didn't do my research before posting. I also apologize for sharing something that I thought others would be interested in.

If i did the research, then i wouldn't had to have posted anything. From the looks of it, there are a few people who are interested in what i posted.

As for looking at MSDS sheets, if i knew what specific chemical formulation to use, that would be ok, but i haven't found that out yet. Many acids, chemical etc come in various % concentrations and using the wrong concentration could give one bad results, or worse hurt someone when they mix/heat etc. Also, MSDS sheets do NOT tell you the exact/actual composition. They only provide guidelines and mostly to prevent accidents and injuries. They often list chemicals, but they don't necessarily list all chemicals in them due to trade secrets etc. Your comment is reckless and could potentially harm or kill someone by lulling them into a false sense of security. But i guess you would'nt know that because you are talking out of your ass.
 
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7.62mm said:
Man....this is a cool project! Will be following this for sure.
I have a stainless steel tank at work that has been sitting idle for quite some time, be cool to have a use for it.
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Thanks.

The heater is from McMaster Carr. I tried to get one of the more powerful ones, but in 120 v so no special cabling or connectors. I am hoping it is powerful enough to het the solution. If not, then may need to insulate the tank to retain some heat. going to try with just water first.

I originally debated using a burner unit from a BBQ, but figured the electric heat would be much easier to control and adjust.
 
rgg_7 said:
Nice set up. Somebody on here was fabricating and selling tanks. Don't know who? Ron
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Oh, interesting. I got it built in exchange for some engineering consulting services. They offered to pay and i said, I spent 15 minutes answering your question, so not necessary, but i could use a tank! LOL. Everyone was happy!
 
The finish known as "Parkerizing" is manganese phosphate, as stated the base solution is phosphoric acid and manganese dioxide, however all the commercial preparations are modified somewhat with things like surfactants, corrosion inhibitors, and trace element scavengers. All of them are proprietary so the maker's are unlikely to share any info, but you may find something worthwhile with patent searches.

There is no recipe, but you may find it helpful to have the US MIL spec on hand. There are all sorts of clues as to what constitutes a quality coating and some steps you have to take to get there. MIL-DTL-16232 Rev. G is available at https://quicksearch.dla.mil/qsDocDetails.aspx?ident_number=11691 free of charge.
 
Light Infantry said:
Thanks.

The heater is from McMaster Carr. I tried to get one of the more powerful ones, but in 120 v so no special cabling or connectors. I am hoping it is powerful enough to het the solution. If not, then may need to insulate the tank to retain some heat. going to try with just water first.

I originally debated using a burner unit from a BBQ, but figured the electric heat would be much easier to control and adjust.
Click to expand...

As a electrician you are going to be using a 1500W heater for 120V it might not be enough even with insulating but as long as where you are plugging the bath in has only one outlet on the circuit you can easily change it to a 240v circuit buy changing the breaker to a two pole 15amp and 240v outlet without pulling extra wire allowing the use of a 3000w heater. The breakers and outlets are not that expensive but may require a trip to your local electrical wholesaler to find the outlet they are not uncommon but uncommon enough not to be stocked at most hardware stores.
 
RRH.01 said:
Sigh, theres always someone who never attempts theire own research...


There all questions answered by googling "parkerizing solution"
Click to expand...

I think the OP may have been looking for an opportunity to engage in conversation and show off his nice craftsmanship, more than pester you to do research. Just my take. Also it might be nice to know if other folks have "secret blueing recipes" or if one brand of chemical works better than an other I suppose. Regardless, you are correct it could have been found with searching, and I'm familiar with getting frustrated with redundant questions sometimes as well, but I still try and contribute to the community if I can..


I like your tank build @Light Infantry, let us know your rates when you get it all figured out huh? Not trying to criticize you, but I'm guessing you work in a fab shop and work is a bit slow at the moment? I'm in O&G in Calgary so I'm familiar with the O&G economy or whats left of it.

You may want to heat the tub with gas and electric to get it up to temp, then just turn the gas off. You could probably wrap the perimeter with some fiberglass textile to retain some heat and then still run a propane burner under it to get it up to temp quickly.

Since your handy with a welder, you may want to build a parts tray out of expanded metal or something, may be nice to have something to set the barreled action and parts on above the tank so the fluid can drip back in as they dry.
 
For those who are interested - stainless tanks are no good for hot bluing... you need black iron tanks for that.
 
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