Paul Harrell and AR-7
- Thread starter cyclone
- Start date
My own experiences with the AR-7 (including an early Henry variant), left me unimpressed; the 10/22TD in a Backpacker stock does almost everything that the AR-7 was supposed to do, and it does it better. That said, many years later, Henry is still making and selling the AR-7, so it begs the question: "What's up?" I, too, have noticed that most reviews of the current-production Henrys have been superficial, and not very useful. This kind of attention (of the modern Henry AR-7 variant) is long overdue, and I'm not surprised that Paul Harrel is the one to (finally) do it.
I have one of the new Henrys, probably about 2 years old now, and I love it.
It's truly fun to shoot and reliability has been just fine for me. I can't quote specific ammo brands or recall specific feed issues but the rifle probably isn't 100% but with .22LR, I'd be hard pressed to claim any semiautomatic .22LR would be 100% reliable. It can be so ammo brand specific. Some are rile/ammo combinations are better than others but my AR-7 certainly isn't a jam machine. It feeds well with the ammo I've fed it.
I wouldn't plan on trying to take game a long distances with my AR-7, the sights just aren't that great but in a survival hunting situation I'd certainly rather have the AR-7 with than nothing. Personally if I was planning to use a .22 rifle for hunting I'd grab my Ruger 10/22 takedown in stainless with a red dot but that's because I can count on its accuracy over the AR-7. This would be primarily because of the traditional stock feel and the quick pick up on the red dot.
I think the biggest improvement over early versions is the magazine design. From what I've seen online (I can't compare new versus old magazines personally because I don't have any of the old magazines) this is where the reliability has been addressed.
It's a great rifle for plinking and fun target use.
That's my opinion for what it's worth anyway.
It's truly fun to shoot and reliability has been just fine for me. I can't quote specific ammo brands or recall specific feed issues but the rifle probably isn't 100% but with .22LR, I'd be hard pressed to claim any semiautomatic .22LR would be 100% reliable. It can be so ammo brand specific. Some are rile/ammo combinations are better than others but my AR-7 certainly isn't a jam machine. It feeds well with the ammo I've fed it.
I wouldn't plan on trying to take game a long distances with my AR-7, the sights just aren't that great but in a survival hunting situation I'd certainly rather have the AR-7 with than nothing. Personally if I was planning to use a .22 rifle for hunting I'd grab my Ruger 10/22 takedown in stainless with a red dot but that's because I can count on its accuracy over the AR-7. This would be primarily because of the traditional stock feel and the quick pick up on the red dot.
I think the biggest improvement over early versions is the magazine design. From what I've seen online (I can't compare new versus old magazines personally because I don't have any of the old magazines) this is where the reliability has been addressed.
It's a great rifle for plinking and fun target use.
That's my opinion for what it's worth anyway.
GREAT to see Paul Harrell is still going strong ! ! At the end of that vid is a link to a July 4th message from him, too.
I have both the Armalite (ca 1962 per SN) and the Henry and have found both reliable and 'acceptably accurate' for what they are. When I got the Armalite in '21, I found 'online advice' on action assy indicating the 'Hammer Spring' should be 'crossed' over the trigger pivot. Experimenting I found that is incorrect in that it 'functions erratically' like that, but w/o crossing is more reliable and the trigger is Lighter! The Armalite does NOT cycle semi 'all the time' with SV but is 'deadly' with Rem Golden HV. I cut ONE coil off Each Recoil Spring attempting to improve cycling SV - Not Helpful. The Henry will cycle SV as well as HV. I just got it this Spring. NO Feed problems with either rifle Except for the Armalite SV-thing.
Both are accurate enough for 'Survival Hunting' except around here in NB & NS the squirrels are tiny ! Not like 'grown-ups' further West of here.
"Wrong way" for Hammer Spring, b4 I found out !
Armalite with Rem Golden @ 25-yds 12/19/2023
Henry AR-7 with CCI-SV @ 25-yds - slightly over 1" group, plus One Bull
Henry AR-7 w/SK-Magazine & Savage 64 w-irons & 'sg' =Hatsan 14" w-Slugs ('s' is w-slingshot ^O^ )
I have both the Armalite (ca 1962 per SN) and the Henry and have found both reliable and 'acceptably accurate' for what they are. When I got the Armalite in '21, I found 'online advice' on action assy indicating the 'Hammer Spring' should be 'crossed' over the trigger pivot. Experimenting I found that is incorrect in that it 'functions erratically' like that, but w/o crossing is more reliable and the trigger is Lighter! The Armalite does NOT cycle semi 'all the time' with SV but is 'deadly' with Rem Golden HV. I cut ONE coil off Each Recoil Spring attempting to improve cycling SV - Not Helpful. The Henry will cycle SV as well as HV. I just got it this Spring. NO Feed problems with either rifle Except for the Armalite SV-thing.
Both are accurate enough for 'Survival Hunting' except around here in NB & NS the squirrels are tiny ! Not like 'grown-ups' further West of here.
"Wrong way" for Hammer Spring, b4 I found out !
Armalite with Rem Golden @ 25-yds 12/19/2023
Henry AR-7 with CCI-SV @ 25-yds - slightly over 1" group, plus One Bull
Henry AR-7 w/SK-Magazine & Savage 64 w-irons & 'sg' =Hatsan 14" w-Slugs ('s' is w-slingshot ^O^ )
The US Survival Rifle or AR-7 has gone through several modification since Henry Repeating Arms started producing them, so not all Henry rifles perform to the same standards. There maybe other modifications that I am not aware of. I contacted Henry to try to confirm the development history but they could not provided any details.
Generation 1 rifles were produced in Brooklyn, NY and are identical to the original Charter Arms design.
Generation 2 rifles were produced in Bayonne, NJ and the serial number is etched into the receiver.
Generation 3 rifles were produced in Bayonne, NJ and the serial number and other markings on the receiver are white. This is when the stock was modified to permit 2 magazines to be stored in the stock and the receiver can be stored with a magazine inserted.
Generation 4 rifles were produced in Rice Lake, WI and have a modified trigger and hammer which reduces trigger pull slightly.
Generation 5 rifles are produced in Rice Lake, WI and have a modified barrel with a solid metal breach end. I have not been able to examine one of these barrels so I don’t know if there are any additional modifications to improve feeding. These rifles came with orange from sights.
Now there are rifles being produced with black front sights. I haven’t had a chance to examine one so I don’t know if the only change is the front sight or if additional modification have been made.
The rifle in the video has white markings and a black front sight so I assume this is one of the newest versions.
I do find reliability is dependant on ammunition selection. In the video they are using CCI Mini Mags which I have found to be the most reliable ammunition. Any copper plated ammunition is more reliable than lead bullets. I had two Henry rifles, a Gen 3 and a Gen 4. I put thousands of rounds of all types of ammo through the Gen 3. Failure rate was about 5%. I only used CCI Mini Mags in the Gen 4 and the failure rate was about 1%. I ran these against a 10/22 and the 10/22 was slightly more reliable. 3% failure rate with mixed ammo and around 0.7% with CCI Mini Mags.
The US Army had .22 FMJ at one time and I have often wondered in the original Armalite AR-7 was designed for the FMJ ammo and if using FMJ would improve reliability overall in the different versions of the rifle
Generation 1 rifles were produced in Brooklyn, NY and are identical to the original Charter Arms design.
Generation 2 rifles were produced in Bayonne, NJ and the serial number is etched into the receiver.
Generation 3 rifles were produced in Bayonne, NJ and the serial number and other markings on the receiver are white. This is when the stock was modified to permit 2 magazines to be stored in the stock and the receiver can be stored with a magazine inserted.
Generation 4 rifles were produced in Rice Lake, WI and have a modified trigger and hammer which reduces trigger pull slightly.
Generation 5 rifles are produced in Rice Lake, WI and have a modified barrel with a solid metal breach end. I have not been able to examine one of these barrels so I don’t know if there are any additional modifications to improve feeding. These rifles came with orange from sights.
Now there are rifles being produced with black front sights. I haven’t had a chance to examine one so I don’t know if the only change is the front sight or if additional modification have been made.
The rifle in the video has white markings and a black front sight so I assume this is one of the newest versions.
I do find reliability is dependant on ammunition selection. In the video they are using CCI Mini Mags which I have found to be the most reliable ammunition. Any copper plated ammunition is more reliable than lead bullets. I had two Henry rifles, a Gen 3 and a Gen 4. I put thousands of rounds of all types of ammo through the Gen 3. Failure rate was about 5%. I only used CCI Mini Mags in the Gen 4 and the failure rate was about 1%. I ran these against a 10/22 and the 10/22 was slightly more reliable. 3% failure rate with mixed ammo and around 0.7% with CCI Mini Mags.
The US Army had .22 FMJ at one time and I have often wondered in the original Armalite AR-7 was designed for the FMJ ammo and if using FMJ would improve reliability overall in the different versions of the rifle
I had a Henry AR7 for a short time. Bought it used off someone else who claimed it shot fine for them. When I got it and took it to my club, it shot way high - 18" over point of aim. This was at 25 m. Had some range buds try and same thing. We were adjusting that sliding peep and it didn't make a difference. I didn't think it should be THAT bad and I wasn't about to flip that peep piece the other way (which would have made it worse). Yes, the barrel was put on properly and secured properly.
Pretty unhappy with the performance but part of the reason I bought it is knowing Henry has a lifetime warranty on their products, so I contacted Gretsch in Canada, who put in a warranty claim with Henry. No questions asked, Henry sent me another barrel right away from the Rice Lake factory. Took me about a month to receive it, only because it sat at Canada Post Mississauga "clearing customs" for 2 weeks. Only difference I could see with the new barrel was that the front plastic sight blade was black instead of the previous orange.
When I got the barrel, brought it to my club and voila, it was the barrel. New barrel shot superb. I wasn't Annie Oakley or anything, but it was much better, with decent groupings. That said, I had a long contemplation about for what I can practically use this rifle. I had to count all my rounds since there was no bolt hold open and I didn't want to pull and empty click on a rimfire.
The chance of me using this in a practical survival scenario is pretty close to zero - if if came down to that type of situation, I have more and better options. Ended up selling it to someone who needed something to hunt squirrels in the bush.
Pretty unhappy with the performance but part of the reason I bought it is knowing Henry has a lifetime warranty on their products, so I contacted Gretsch in Canada, who put in a warranty claim with Henry. No questions asked, Henry sent me another barrel right away from the Rice Lake factory. Took me about a month to receive it, only because it sat at Canada Post Mississauga "clearing customs" for 2 weeks. Only difference I could see with the new barrel was that the front plastic sight blade was black instead of the previous orange.
When I got the barrel, brought it to my club and voila, it was the barrel. New barrel shot superb. I wasn't Annie Oakley or anything, but it was much better, with decent groupings. That said, I had a long contemplation about for what I can practically use this rifle. I had to count all my rounds since there was no bolt hold open and I didn't want to pull and empty click on a rimfire.
The chance of me using this in a practical survival scenario is pretty close to zero - if if came down to that type of situation, I have more and better options. Ended up selling it to someone who needed something to hunt squirrels in the bush.
FatCatsDad
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I can't part with almost $600 after taxed for a new one.
They seem priced like a finely crafted gun but are just sh.it.
For an ATV gun I'm happy with my 14" Side x side with a 44 mag. Chamber adapter in the left barrel and shot size or slug of my choice in the right.
They seem priced like a finely crafted gun but are just sh.it.
For an ATV gun I'm happy with my 14" Side x side with a 44 mag. Chamber adapter in the left barrel and shot size or slug of my choice in the right.
The Henry ar7 is for people who want a survival gun without the size and weight. It's very packable, probably the most packable rifle on the market and it will get you food if you're stuck.
Being modern times, there are really no more practical applications for it but it's a cool piece of history. Currently cost about $480 CAD +tax. Imo it's a $3-400 gun.
Being modern times, there are really no more practical applications for it but it's a cool piece of history. Currently cost about $480 CAD +tax. Imo it's a $3-400 gun.
Interesting coincidence in reading this as probably an hour or so ago I was watching a recent Paul / Roy Harrell video in which they are comparing the accuracy of a Henry Survival Rifle to a Ruger 10/22. All in all the Survival Rifle had comparable groupings. It had one feed issue with Mini Mags, and Paul Harrell looked like Annie Oakley with it.
There are enough take down / folding guns that have more enhanced applications that would be a more compelling proposition at this point, so I agree with your statement.
While some people may say, well, we should be counting our rounds as a standard practice, one of the things I see that detracts from the utility of this rifle is the combination of the default 8 round magazine as well as no last round bolt hold open. When I had mine, anyone who had a chance to try it out, I told them to count the rounds as I don't really want them dry firing a rimfire. Without fail, everyone probably forgot to count and then there was a click after 8 rounds. I wish they made it 10 or have a last round bolt hold open.HA ! I just watched that y-dayI've got an Armalite and a Henry and both give similar groups to Paul's. The Armalite doesn't cycle SV very well but otherwise No Probs with ammo. They're an odd-feeling rifle but do the job they're made for.
The idea is neat - I don't think I ever tried to test whether the thing floats, but it is an innovative design, I will give them that.
