quick twist .223

ultimate_monkey

ultimate_monkey

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SO long story short im parting ways with my weatherby vanguard in .223 simply thats its a 1:12 twist, plenty accurate for the lighter bullets, but id like to stretch out a bit with a .223. so i figure sell this and get a more precission oriented rifle

im hopeing you guys can point me in some sort of direction lol, iv looking into the 700 series and the SPS tac. seems like a good choice with a 1:9 but the barrels short at 20" , acceptable for up to 4-500yds? or will i be giving up to much velocity / accuracy? i dont need 1/4moa accuracy out to 500, just somthing that will even hold 3/4-1moa will be fine for this rifles purpose

yes yes i know, buying an action, then a comp barrel and sending it to a smith it the only way to build a true "precission " rifle but well its not in the budget, just simply looking for a replacment for my weatherby.

im hoping to come in at 800 or less for just the rifle, since the majority of the cost will be covered by the sale of the weatherby plus a bit of cash, to busy saving for a S&B.


just so my bases are coverd, i already own a .308 and .338lm so .223 is the only caliber id be into getting

thanks for the input!
 
Well I sure like my savage VLP in 1:7. I bought it used off the EE for around 800.00 with a near 20 MOA rail. I'm consistently shooting .300 5 shot groups at 100M, 1/2 MOA at 300, and after that the rifle can definately do .75 or less out past 700M. I have good days and bad days. The bad days are mostly just trying to dope the wind at those distances. Also I only have a fixed 10X 3200 tactical on it for a scope so out at 500 and beyond the cross hair is covering a lot of the target. When the tax cheque comes I'll be talking to Jerry about a Sightron with more magnification. I can still shoot 1 MOA out to 700M, but definately have shot 1/2 or .75 out past 600M. I'm using 69 GR SMK's and 25.1 GR of RL15.
 
Remington 700 are a slow 1-9 twist generally will not stabilize heavier bullets. Savage 1-9 is a bit faster and may stabilize heavier bullets. A tikka 1-8 will stabilize up to 80 grains.

If I were buying with the intent of hopefully getting decent accuracy without spending any extra I would go with the tikka varmint.

If you are planning on eventually replacing the barrel the savage 12bvss is a good starting point.
 
hmmm well i am a fan of my tika t3... didnt even think to look at them for a .223 1:8 was about the twist i was hoping to find that should do damn fine ! any idea on the price?
 
the rifle im selling is a lite contour barrel, so by the time i bought barrrel, sent to a smith, and replaced the stock, then did somthing about the 5lbs trigger, it would probably end up costing more then just selling buying somthing else.

as i said im more just looking to get somthing that will stableize a heavier bullet, with out putting out a bunch of cash. so selling my weatherby and tossing in a few hundred bucks is more of an option then putting out 1000 cash
 
The Vanguard is a $500 ish rifle.

If you spend another say $500 ish on a barrel of your choice, I would think that you would be awsomely further ahead than buying another factory rifle.

I have a bunch of factory rifles that are giving me factory results. I'm starting to think that I will buy a factory rifle and install an aftermarket barrel on it.



On Edit: you got posted before I did......
 
Question:

How well will the faster twist barrel stabilize lighter bullets at say 200-500 yards? Or are you limited to the heavier weights only?
 
dastt said:
Question:

How well will the faster twist barrel stabilize lighter bullets at say 200-500 yards? Or are you limited to the heavier weights only?
Click to expand...



the faster twist will stableize lighter bullets at a slightly lower velocity, shoot them to fast and you risk throwing them off their center axis, but out of a .223 for those rangers you probably want a hevier bullet.. a 52gn amax at 500 yards isnt goin to be your best option thats for sure

RON, thanks for the link, ill deffinatly look into them, see what the local price will be, its a little more $ then i wanted to put out at the moment but buy ones cry once right...
 
dastt said:
Question: How well will the faster twist barrel stabilize lighter bullets at say 200-500 yards? Or are you limited to the heavier weights only?
Click to expand...

The lighter (shorter) the bullet the easier it is to stabilize it. So, no problem with stability. On distance the bullet is generally most unstable right at the muzzle. From the muzzle the forward velocity slows down much more than the rotational spin. So the bullet actually becomes more stable as it goes down range.

You are not limited to heavy bullets based on stability. But, the throat may be longer in a fast twist gun to allow for the heavy bullets. Light short bullets may not be able to be seated close to the lands and can suffer some in accuracy as a result.

Last a fast spin on a bullet can make it wobble due to bullet unbalance. This is not instability, but just wobble due to the off center, center of gravity. The poorer the quality of the bullet the worse this effect is. But, the magnitude of the high spin wobble is not huge, and probably only of concern to serious target shooters. They will use a barrel with the very minimum of spin. Here is a link that gives some idea of the significance of the effect.

Effect of Bullet Imbalance on Accuracy
 
I have a 1 in 9 Savage 12 VLP DBM LH .223 rem. It actually measures 1 in 8.75.

Re barrel will be a 1 in 8 I think. Only 1500 down the pipe this year(total). Should have a few more good years in in.

Video below link of 822 yards, about .75moa.

As for stability of .224 bullets PM me an e-mail address and I'll fire off an excel spreadsheet that allows you to look at stability for numerous bullets changing temp pressure, muzzle velocity and twist rate. May help with your selection process. (will send it to anyone wanting it)

Cheers
 
1:9

hifly78 said:
I have a 1 in 9 Savage 12 VLP DBM LH .223 rem. It actually measures 1 in 8.75.

Re barrel will be a 1 in 8 I think. Only 1500 down the pipe this year(total). Should have a few more good years in in.

Video below link of 822 yards, about .75moa.

As for stability of .224 bullets PM me an e-mail address and I'll fire off an excel spreadsheet that allows you to look at stability for numerous bullets changing temp pressure, muzzle velocity and twist rate. May help with your selection process. (will send it to anyone wanting it)

Cheers
Click to expand...
Great video
Curious what sort of loads (powder, grains) were you using with the Amax?
 
DsrtRat said:
822 is great. Ask him how he does on fur up closef:P:2::D
Click to expand...

Up close my ass. We guessed it was 350 yards but later found it to be more like 480 yards. (24" more drop)

My 1.25 pound trigger wore to a 10 oz trigger. I never even felt it through the gloves as I was settling on the dog. (its up to 2.75 pounds for the dogs now)

And Yes I was excited. ####. Still play that over in my head. Going to be stuck there until I get redemption.

Cheers
 
92FS Inox said:
Great video
Curious what sort of loads (powder, grains) were you using with the Amax?
Click to expand...


For the Video pretty sure that load was Varget 24.0gr COAL 2.440" (0.040" off my lands but max magazine) Kind of my goto load.

About 2861fps. Also my cases measure out at 30.0 grains of H2O for volume. A Little more than the 28.8gr H2O that Quickload kicks out

Very close to a 4th node exit for Optimum Barrel Time. 1.19ms Quickload calcs it at 1.20ms for this combo and 2857fps so reasonable close. (about 52000psi max pressure)

I'd like to try to get it to the 3rd node for the this long range. Going to play with some hotter loads soon. 3rd node is about 1.11ms. IMR-4895 looks like 3050fps 60500psi and 1.111ms. Going to have to work up to that carefully and see if its doable. Spring project to test that accuracy.

It goes without saying, every gun is unique. Work up loads with caution in your gun. Info provided for discussion not a recommendation. (I'm not a lawyer nor do I play one on TV)
 
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