re : manufacture of Candian Hand Grenades

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x westie

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I have just finished reading " The Damned",the Canadians at the Battle of Hong Kong-Dec 1941, written by Nathan Greenfield, in the introduction, he writes that both the Royal Rifles of Canada, & Winnipeg Grenadiers were well equiped & trained in the use small arms, including the Bren & Thompson SMG,but their greatest lack was live hand grenades,the # 36 grenade...i was wondering if anybody could shed more info this,...Canada had several manufactures of small arms ammo, Dominion Industries,Dominion Arsenals,..would they not have the capability of manufacture of hand grenades.

Thanks for your feedback
 
Frost and Woods of Schmit (Smith) Falls Ontario was one of the larger No. 36 makers.....As a matter of interest, I have a copy of a letter from a gentlemen to the British Department of Muntions and Trench Warfare about a little invention he has that would revolutionize trench warfare during WW I. The letter is signed: "your obedient servant: Mr. Mills"
 
@Wheaty:

I have a book here in which Ian Hogg refers to the author of your letter as "the dark, Satanic MILLS"!

Verily, verily,
It is a Pun
In far more ways
Than simply one.

I is a Poet
Who likes eating Chickens;
My feet are Longfellows
And stink like the Dickens!

Oh, my!

Enough of that!

Anyone wanta read Sidney the Profound's poem about Auk Stew?

Back into the Sock Closet, hope no-one finds me after those.
.
 
hand grenades don't get talked about very much in the history books. I recall reading a Japanese soldier's account and he commented on how unreliable theirs were. A lot of duds. This might be because of they way the Japs packed munitions. They did not use watertight containers.


And I recall a Allied soldier talking about German grenades being thrown into their position and them throwing them back. Sounds like they had a long fuse.
 
There were books published right after the war that itemized and examined "munitions" production. That included everything from roofing shingles to high explosives and armoured vehicles. You never know where the answer will be found.
 
Anything you want to know about grenades, dig up something by Norman Bonney. Norm is probably the best man on the planet on the subject and also one h*ll of a great guy. I've seen Norman's collection of ordnance and one is speechless in trying to comprehend the magnitude of it
 
I don't know who manufactured all of them but They went out of service in 71 in Canada. I was posted in Petawawa at the time as a weapons tech. We went out with the Engineers for a solid week and disposed of all the 36 grenades by tossing them one at a time. We went through so many crates I don't remembre how many. It was fun at first but anything gets old after a while.
 
points said:
I don't know who manufactured all of them but They went out of service in 71 in Canada. I was posted in Petawawa at the time as a weapons tech. We went out with the Engineers for a solid week and disposed of all the 36 grenades by tossing them one at a time. We went through so many crates I don't remembre how many. It was fun at first but anything gets old after a while.
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the alternative method of building up a strong right arm
 
x westie said:
I have just finished reading " The Damned",the Canadians at the Battle of Hong Kong-Dec 1941, written by Nathan Greenfield, in the introduction, he writes that both the Royal Rifles of Canada, & Winnipeg Grenadiers were well equiped & trained in the use small arms, including the Bren & Thompson SMG
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Interesting that he says that. I wrote my thesis on the Battle of HK, and most of the literature available, and discussions with veterans indicated that most of the men were terribly ill prepared, with something like 60% not even having completed their basic rifle proficiency trials. I'll have to pick up that book and give it a read. "No Reason Why" is the authoritative tome on the subject if you are interested in further reading. Sorry to derail your thread!

Those guys were heroes sent to slaughter and did remarkably well considering the circumstances. Their postwar treatment by the Canadian government is something to be ashamed of.
 
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Those guys were heroes sent to [the]slaughter and did remarkably well considering the circumstances. Their postwar treatment by the Canadian government is something to be ashamed of.
"Hear, Hear". The Canadian Government abandoned these guys and then most, of those who did survive, had to fight like h*ll for a pension after the war.
 
revilo said:
Interesting that he says that. I wrote my thesis on the Battle of HK, and most of the literature available, and discussions with veterans indicated that most of the men were terribly ill prepared, with something like 60% not even having completed their basic rifle proficiency trials. I'll have to pick up that book and give it a read. "No Reason Why" is the authoritative tome on the subject if you are interested in further reading. Sorry to derail your thread!

Those guys were heroes sent to slaughter and did remarkably well considering the circumstances. Their postwar treatment by the Canadian government is something to be ashamed of.
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I understand what you are saying about the troops being unprepared, i have read the book "No Reason Why", and it is a very good book ,..there is various paragraphs in "The Damned" that mentions the Canadian troops were not as poorly trained as various historians claim they were.

No aircover or artillery support, incompetent British commanders,outnumbered by the Japanese,lack of sleep& food,their trucks & universal carriers never arrived, i believe these factors had more to do with the fall of Hong Kong
 
WHEATY has it 100%.

That doesn't even address the shameful fact of the Welsh Camps in which the Canadians were kept for a year before being sent home, finally.

There was "no shipping available" to bring them home, although there certainly had been shipping enough to SEND them to the slaughterhouse in the first place.

But Europe was starving and Western Canadian WHEAT was $5 a bushel in a day of $20 Gold, so every available bottom was busier'n a one-armed paperhanger, running over to Europe loaded to the gunwales and running back empty at top speed to load up again. The Right People, who had cornered the grain market at FAR cheaper prices, made a mint.

It was bad enough in the Camps that there actually were revolts in a couple. This was portrayed incredibly graphically in the BBC/NFB/CBC film "Going Home" about 30 years ago. Most incredible bayonet sequences ever filmed: Redcaps against unarmed men. Interestingly, neither the BBC nor the CBC will even admit that such a film was made, but I have seen it; it was aired only ONCE. Good Ross Rife sequences, too.

The Red Scare was incredible. Everyone has heard of the General Strike in Winnipeg, broken up by the police with machine-guns. Things such as that happened right across the country. I knew a returned veteran in Brandon who still had his One Big Union card; he told me about the FIVE 1919 Strikes in Brandon, not mentioned in any history books.

And when my old friend Capt. George Dibblee DCM was coming home, the ship he was on had a mutiny. Capt. Dibblee issued each of his men (5th Batt., CMR) 10 rounds, told them to fix bayonets and posted them along the main deck, directly above the keel, the full length of the ship. Mutiny over.

My own grandfather (54 Batt., "The Kootenay Regiment") was gassed twice and hit 3 times. He was awarded $26 a month for 100% disability. TRY raising 5 tubercular kids and looking after a tubercular wife on that. He coughed blood into half the ditches he dug in Vancouver.... until he could no longer even stand up to go to work.

Canada has a TRADITION of treating its Veterans abominably. I really do not think it is a tradition in which we should take a lot of pride.
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My Grandfather got back from Europe to Winnipeg just in time to take part in the 1919 stuff. He was a hardcore union man.
 
smellie said:
WHEATY has it 100%.



Canada has a TRADITION of treating its Veterans abominably. I really do not think it is a tradition in which we should take a lot of pride.
.
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Sadly true. It has always be thus. Polititians in Canada seem to have a pathological hatered of the military and the civilian population until recently have never been aware that Canada even had an army.
 
points said:
Sadly true. It has always be thus. Polititians in Canada seem to have a pathological hatered of the military and the civilian population until recently have never been aware that Canada even had an army.
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The disposable part of society. Use em up and throw em away. :D War widows were treated no better.

Grizz
 
smellie said:
WHEATY has it 100%.

That doesn't even address the shameful fact of the Welsh Camps in which the Canadians were kept for a year before being sent home, finally.

There was "no shipping available" to bring them home, although there certainly had been shipping enough to SEND them to the slaughterhouse in the first place.

But Europe was starving and Western Canadian WHEAT was $5 a bushel in a day of $20 Gold, so every available bottom was busier'n a one-armed paperhanger, running over to Europe loaded to the gunwales and running back empty at top speed to load up again. The Right People, who had cornered the grain market at FAR cheaper prices, made a mint.

It was bad enough in the Camps that there actually were revolts in a couple. This was portrayed incredibly graphically in the BBC/NFB/CBC film "Going Home" about 30 years ago. Most incredible bayonet sequences ever filmed: Redcaps against unarmed men. Interestingly, neither the BBC nor the CBC will even admit that such a film was made, but I have seen it; it was aired only ONCE. Good Ross Rife sequences, too.

The Red Scare was incredible. Everyone has heard of the General Strike in Winnipeg, broken up by the police with machine-guns. Things such as that happened right across the country. I knew a returned veteran in Brandon who still had his One Big Union card; he told me about the FIVE 1919 Strikes in Brandon, not mentioned in any history books.

And when my old friend Capt. George Dibblee DCM was coming home, the ship he was on had a mutiny. Capt. Dibblee issued each of his men (5th Batt., CMR) 10 rounds, told them to fix bayonets and posted them along the main deck, directly above the keel, the full length of the ship. Mutiny over.

My own grandfather (54 Batt., "The Kootenay Regiment") was gassed twice and hit 3 times. He was awarded $26 a month for 100% disability. TRY raising 5 tubercular kids and looking after a tubercular wife on that. He coughed blood into half the ditches he dug in Vancouver.... until he could no longer even stand up to go to work.

Canada has a TRADITION of treating its Veterans abominably. I really do not think it is a tradition in which we should take a lot of pride.
.
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The reason that POW's took so long getting home was the government's "secret plan" to fatten them up and prepare them mentally and physically for freedom and to try and have them integrated back into a "normal life". It was also feared that there would be horrible reprisals also against anyone resembling their captors such as the large number of Japanese Canadians in western Canada and other nationalities also living in Canada. It was a well orchestrated plan on the part of the government and probably did prepare many for integration back into civilian life. The powers to be thought what was another couple months when they had been POW's for 4 years.
 
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