Reloading a lee metford

[ebruder]

Hi

I have a lee metford carbine. My understanding is that these rifles used the 303 British casing but a black powder charge. The Lee enfield long lee was the same rifle but used a smokeless 303 British load with a new barrel.

Do any of you guys load for these rifles? Is it as easy as putting black powder in a 303 case? Or is there more to it?

EB

 

[Evanguy]

You could use black powder, but if it was me, id use a low pressure smokeless load, i guess the barrels still lasted upwards of 5000 rounds. But if you wanted to use black powder that would be cool, i want to try some in my 71/84 mauser. I believe you just fill the case, stack a wad and lube card on top and seat the bullet to compress a bit.

id look into H4895 powder it can he loaded down to 60% the max load. Hodgdons reloading has loads for it.

 

[englishman_ca]

The Metford Mk.I rifle was introduced before the development of the cordite round was complete. The black powder rounds were a stop gap until the smokeless loads were ready. The rifle went into production in 1889 and there had to be ammunition. The Mk.I Cordite round was introduced in 1891.

It is difficult to compress enough black powder into a 303 case to duplicate the original performance.
Modern black powder is not as strong as the original stuff, apparently.

Modern smokeless powders do not have the same destructive properties of cordite. Nitro cellulose propellants won't erode the throat of the Metford rifled barrel like cordite, they do not burn as hot.

A light plinking load is a lot of fun with a cavalry carbine.

I have some black reloads made up to duplicate gallery rounds. It helps clean up if you have a cleaning funnel to pour hot water down the bore.

 

[Incurable Collectoer]

I make a very mild load for my Long Lee rifle. It is 16 grains of Alliant 2400 with a .313" 180 grain hard cast bullet from the Bullet Barn. The velocity for this load is between 1520 to 1540 fps. This is well under original velocity but fun to plink away with. A friend who has a Lee Metford rifle with an Enfield barrel makes his loads with IMR 4227 with cast 215 grain bullets and brings the velocity up closer to military spec.

 

[bearhunter]

The Metford Mk.I rifle was introduced before the development of the cordite round was complete. The black powder rounds were a stop gap until the smokeless loads were ready. The rifle went into production in 1889 and there had to be ammunition. The Mk.I Cordite round was introduced in 1891.

It is difficult to compress enough black powder into a 303 case to duplicate the original performance.
Modern black powder is not as strong as the original stuff, apparently.

Modern smokeless powders do not have the same destructive properties of cordite. Nitro cellulose propellants won't erode the throat of the Metford rifled barrel like cordite, they do not burn as hot.

A light plinking load is a lot of fun with a cavalry carbine.

I have some black reloads made up to duplicate gallery rounds. It helps clean up if you have a cleaning funnel to pour hot water down the bore.

I pulled apart several of those black powder loaded rounds about 35 years ago. The powder was very fine and severely compressed. It was similar to pistol powder but finer. The ammo cases were deteriorating badly and were getting to the point where they would be dangerous to shoot. I cleaned them up without polishing them in a dry media tumbler and sold the reasonable cases with bullets inserted to a head stamp collector. All of the cartridges had three crimp stamps to keep the bullets in place.

I saved the powder from those cases and tried to get it back into some commercial cases with some surpluss 215 grain bullets. I couldn't do it. I managed to get about 90% back into each case with enough room on the neck to hold the bullet in place. If I compressed the charge any more the case would start to bulge.

The results were impressive IMHO. The recoil was every bit as stout as the later loaded Cordite rounds. Velocities were good as well. I didn't have a chronograph back then but calculated velocities by bullet drop at two hundred yards. I seem to remember around 1750 fps for my hand loads and a bit faster for the factory rounds. I was shooting these out of a No1 Lee Metford sporter with a 29 in barrel. The powder charge was around 70 grains.

I understand the Cordite rounds were loaded with the Cordite before the case was formed and the strands were counted rather than weighed at first. I am sure that later changed for faster production.

Now, one thing I have always wondered is if the black powder charge wasn't a shaped pellet that was put into a non formed case and formed after???

Anyway, a 215 grain bullet at 1800fps is nothing to poo poo especially in 1890. This round must have been considered the laser of its day.