Rolling/falling block action home made?
- Thread starter rhino519
- Start date
With the proper know-how, I figure anything is possible. Though I know from hard experience that a project like this is usually a case of "if I knew before how much trouble it'd be, I wouldn't have started in the first place!" That being said, if you can get some decent plans for a good, strong action, and the proper steel with access to heat-treating facilities, then go for it! I know that there are people in Indonesia who produce steel knock-offs of modern firearms with just some hand-tools and a forge. Not sure if I'd want to fire one of theirs, though.
there is a small book by Frank deHaas with plans for a version of the Stevens Favourite and a large frame falling block he calls a "vault lock". The vault lock gun is do able. Worth noting however you would require a metal lathe and a drill press or drill / mill to build it. The favourite (Chicopee model gun) could be built at home but you would require a cutting torch or similar source of heat for the silver soldering
cheers mooncoon
cheers mooncoon
The Upper Missouri Trading Company offers Remington Hepburn kits in various stages of completion if you lack heat treating facilities. http://www.uppermotradingco.com/
All is possible with a drill press and a file, if you are willing to put in the time.
Aside from the DeHaas designs (which were designed both to be simple to make, as well as not copying on other designs too much), Village Press offers a book on building a Falling Block action by a guy named Mueller, IIRC. It is the collected series of articles he wrote for Home Shop Machinist.
If you go through the Mr Single Shot series of books, there are lots to choose from, of varying complexities.
There are several set of plans out there, some quite expensive, that have poor information, or were drawn to be used with casting kits that are no longer available, so tread carefully if buying plans.
Cheers
Trev
Aside from the DeHaas designs (which were designed both to be simple to make, as well as not copying on other designs too much), Village Press offers a book on building a Falling Block action by a guy named Mueller, IIRC. It is the collected series of articles he wrote for Home Shop Machinist.
If you go through the Mr Single Shot series of books, there are lots to choose from, of varying complexities.
There are several set of plans out there, some quite expensive, that have poor information, or were drawn to be used with casting kits that are no longer available, so tread carefully if buying plans.
Cheers
Trev
It can be done if you are determined enough. I would recommend staying at 22rf levels, and looking at laminated frame construction.
Somewhere in cyberspace I saw plans offered for a homebuild replica of the Remington Model 6, or you could spend some quality time and design your own. If you look at the takedown design of some of the old boy's rifles you would see a way of avoiding a receiver ring. Examples would include the aforementioned Remington, the Stevens 14 1/2, the Page-Lewis, and the "Killdeer".
You would need to pick up some understanding of heat treatment and hammer/ trigger/ mainspring geometry but none of this would require more than basic tools. It would be quite a learning experience.
Somewhere in cyberspace I saw plans offered for a homebuild replica of the Remington Model 6, or you could spend some quality time and design your own. If you look at the takedown design of some of the old boy's rifles you would see a way of avoiding a receiver ring. Examples would include the aforementioned Remington, the Stevens 14 1/2, the Page-Lewis, and the "Killdeer".
You would need to pick up some understanding of heat treatment and hammer/ trigger/ mainspring geometry but none of this would require more than basic tools. It would be quite a learning experience.
That Hepburn action in the machined form looks like a good deal. As far as building a falling block from scratch, I lean towards thinking that to cut the square recess, you would (in practical terms) have to make a square broach first to cut the square hole. Make it out of something like 4140 and tapered to enter a round hole then finish up with the last inch or so straight and the dimensions of the finished hole.
While there is a lot you can do with a drill press and files, I think a milling machine and metal lathe in the basement would eliminate a lot of sweat and tears
cheers mooncoon
While there is a lot you can do with a drill press and files, I think a milling machine and metal lathe in the basement would eliminate a lot of sweat and tears
cheers mooncoon
Ayup!
You can do it with a metal lathe and files. A mill or at least a milling attachment will save alot of greif and agony. If you can find an old shaper it will serve you better for alot of stuff and be cheaper to feed from a tooling standpoint then a mill.
Your best bet will probably be a whitney pheonix, its basically a side pivoting block, no deep square hole required.
Be patient, diligent and dont give up.
Your best bet will probably be a whitney pheonix, its basically a side pivoting block, no deep square hole required.
Be patient, diligent and dont give up.
thanks guys for the feed back, got some things to mill about (pun intended
)
i do realise it will consume a great deal of time, so maybe ill just put it on the back burner for now
that whitney-phenix design is actually what i was pondering as less mechanicly complicated then a falling block though it would require sodering/welding
as is it seems im not ready for this major undertaking
)i do realise it will consume a great deal of time, so maybe ill just put it on the back burner for now
that whitney-phenix design is actually what i was pondering as less mechanicly complicated then a falling block
though it would require sodering/weldingas is it seems im not ready for this major undertaking
If you want a little "homebuilt" inspiration, log in on the Homegunsmithing.com forum, and look at the documented builds there, particularly those by a fella of the moniker of alphawolf45, IIRC.
He has some great photos of the process he uses for building guns in sections. There are a lot of other low-tech builds there too, like the Yooper Assault Rifle.
Cheers
Trev
He has some great photos of the process he uses for building guns in sections. There are a lot of other low-tech builds there too, like the Yooper Assault Rifle.
Cheers
Trev
I have a Whitney but don't consider it a very strong action. I think the vault lock would be both strong and within the limits of a home workshop. You would need a lathe for threading the barrel (and receiver) and for making chambering reamers as well as for chambering and crowning. My next up would be a Sharps sidehammer and cut the square (rectangular) recess with a home made broach
cheers mooncoon
cheers mooncoon
I have made and used them for the square hole in the hammer and for sight dovetails. In the case of the hammer hole, I file shallow notches in the appropriate corners and those orient the square. In the case of the sight dovetail I mill a square recess .070" deep and use one with a fast taper to open the recess out to close to the correct dimension then a second broach tapering about .005" per inch to finish. Were I making a square hole roughly 1" square, I would drill a 1" hole and again use file notches to get started or alternately some form of jig indexing on the side(s) to get started. Probably taper around .020" per inch at least to start and depending on practicality, possibly use a series of two broachs but the final one would end with a section about 1 1/2" long to 2" long with parallel sides so that I did not end up with a tapered hole My experiences with the smaller broaches convinces me that the principle could be used on much larger holes and jobs although I would not be surprised to have some hiccups in the beginning
cheers mooncoon
Falling block
I have built 2 vaultlocks one in 6mm BR and one i .308 and I have also built 2 of the chicopee design one in .22rf and one in 30/30, and found that they are really not that difficult to build, just labor intensive.
6mm br
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]
I have built 2 vaultlocks one in 6mm BR and one i .308 and I have also built 2 of the chicopee design one in .22rf and one in 30/30, and found that they are really not that difficult to build, just labor intensive.
6mm br
thanks guys for the feed back, got some things to mill about (pun intended
i do realise it will consume a great deal of time, so maybe ill just put it on the back burner for now
that whitney-phenix design is actually what i was pondering as less mechanicly complicated then a falling block
as is it seems im not ready for this major undertaking
Im just going to be blunt with you here, no offense intended.
99 percent of most of these "build my own gun from barstock" threads dont ever make it to the poster even TRYING to make a single part. Search the net and there are dozens of threads of people who post their musings and never get off their rears and make a part. I see these questions more now and run into lots of people who ask about making some widget or how to shape this metal project when they have no idea how. I can explain till Im blue in the face how they can make their toy, but I can see when they look down and to the side that they don't have the slightest urge to even try out of fear of failing, they just like to talk about it.
Ability, tooling, skills and available finances are immaterial. There is ALWAYS a way to make something. The "no time" excuse is the worst, if people have time to watch 3 hours of tv a night, they have LOTS of free time. People have time to run on a treadmill like a hamster for 2 hours a day trying to burn excess calories for a week of doing nothing. Get a file, vice, a hack saw and a cold chisel and try shaping some metal and you'l throw the gym pass out the window. During my time as a machinist I ran into precious few fat ones, I never worked in a CNC shop mind you.
If you start cutting metal TODAY and maybe bite the bullet and buy some drawings, a book or an old junker action to copy you'l be making a huge step. If you make so much as one solitary screw, you will have accomplished more then most. If you dont finish it, thats fine, put your screw in a coffee can and put it somewhere you can find it again. Sooner or later you will make another screw and another screw and a front sight and it will start to snowball. Focus on tangible things like finished parts, and not on overthinking things. Worried about the strength of a black powder gun? All thats holding a rolling block is that one rear pivot pin.............and they work fine.
For you to get any momentum on your project you need to push yourself to make the first peice, if you screw it up who cares? Try again.
Dont have a lathe? Go build one!!
http://www.vintageprojects.com/machine-shop/hobby-lathe-plans.html
http://www.lindsaybks.com/dgjp/djgbk/series/index.html
Trust me, when I started my first day as a machinist apprentice, I thought I made a huge mistake, I didn't have a clue what I was doing and there are times when thats STILL the case!!. With each more difficult/complex part to make or fix that was flopped in front of me there were times I wondered how I was going to feed myself, put gas in the car, keep my job and not make an arse of myself. But there was one thing for certain, I could never shrug my shoulders and give up, to do that would be to give up on my hopes/dreams, maybe quit/be fired and likely loose everything.
Quiting/giving up on something is a skill that is learned, and takes practice. Its not easy to give up on what you want at first, but it slowly gets easier as you do it more and more. You dont want to be good at quitting at something before you even try.
So you have to try, if you screw up and you probably will once in awhile, you start again. That is how tangible things are built.
There are alot of men I have met, who wish they built things and not necessarily as a living. Many have made lots of money, have nice looking wives, houses and cars but are emotionally unsatisfied because they never fed that creative urge. And many regret it to their dying days. Alot spend their time reading books on the subject or web posts or look at pictures, but they never try and never get to feel the sense of the purest satisfaction that men can feel when they eventually succeed at transforming whatever block of wood, steel, stone or clay that they have bled, cried and sworn over into what they wanted. Some find solace in whiskey, women, family, success, money, credit, medication or denial. But the urge to make something is a very personal thing that only you can satisfy, your brain is your worst enemy in this case, because the urge will not go away if you truly want this.
Go out of your comfort zone and try. Because thats the only way things are built from nothing. You're only a few thousand file strokes away from a finished rifle action!!!
Last edited:
Hickstick, while I do apriciated the words of encouragement, through researching some of this subject, and from my previous work experience, I do realize my limitations at this time
Thanks for the links,I'll check them out for sure
Thanks for the links,I'll check them out for sure
