Ross Bayos

[H Wally]

Ok, so a very partial primer on ross bayonetes and another question for you ross guys.

Firstly - I have figured out that the MkI bayo has a spring in the barrel lug, which is visible and identifies it as a mkI bayo that only fits the 1905. Seems most of these had butcher style blades as well.

Exhibit A:

Secondly - a questionable set of blades. They don't have the spring lug of the MkI, but they do have the butcher blades, indicating they are from before the order to regrind them to spear points but after the first mkI's with the spring barrel lugs - What are these? What ross are they for? I've read in two different places that these fit either rifle

Thirdly - the most identifiable of them, the spear pointed MkII. It fits the MKIII (thanks for the correction )and the point was ground after production, ostensibly to make it easier to penetrate the german great coats.

 

[tiriaq]

For some reason, your first photo won't open for me. The Mk. I bayonet fits the Mk. II rifles, with the exception of most II** rifles. It has the anti-rattle spring in the ring, which is also stepped in profile.
Your second bayonet is a relatively scarce modification of the Mk. II (for Mk. III rifle); it is the Royal Navy variant, the blade having been reground from the original butcher knife configuration. The frog is missing from the scabbard, but it is different from the Canadian pattern as appears in your photo 3.
Your number three is the most common variant of the Mk. II, the blade having been reground to the rather odd spear point shape.
Mk. II bayonets with unaltered butcher knife blades are uncommon, the overwhelming majority having been altered.

 

[green]

The difference in the MkI & II bayonets is in the diameter of the muzzle ring. The MkI fits Ross MkI & short II rifles and the MkII fits MkII** and III rifles which have a heavier barrel. All MkI bts have the spring and the spring was deleted on the MkII in 1915.
The scabbard shown without the frog could be the Cdn mod to allow the bt to be used with the P1908 web frog.

 

[H Wally]

Photo fixed. Interesting.... Thanks for all the help!

 

[green]

MkI bts are stamped 08 on pommel and MkII 11 for pattern 1908 and 1911 respetively.

 

[Rossguy]

Wally- There is much information available on Ross Bayonet variations-couldn't you find any, or didn't you look? The MkI bayos fit the MkI and all MkII 'short' rifles-readily identified by the small-diameter barrel sleeve and the 'stepped' ring. I have never seen a MkI bayo reground to the 'point'. The MkII bayos- they fit the MkII**'s the MkIII's (the MkIIIB variation has it's own unique dedicated series of bayonets and scabbards).The same bayonet also fits on the .280 Military Match rifles.You say your third example fits the M-10....that would be a first for me- why would anyone want a bayonet on a sporting rifle? Never say never where Ross is concerned, though.

 

[H Wally]

MkI bts are stamped 08 on pommel and MkII 11 for pattern 1908 and 1911 respetively.

Now there's something that's usefull! Thanks!

Wally- There is much information available on Ross Bayonet variations-couldn't you find any, or didn't you look? The MkI bayos fit the MkI and all MkII 'short' rifles-readily identified by the small-diameter barrel sleeve and the 'stepped' ring. I have never seen a MkI bayo reground to the 'point'. The MkII bayos- they fit the MkII**'s the MkIII's (the MkIIIB variation has it's own unique dedicated series of bayonets and scabbards).The same bayonet also fits on the .280 Military Match rifles.You say your third example fits the M-10....that would be a first for me- why would anyone want a bayonet on a sporting rifle? Never say never where Ross is concerned, though.

I appreciate your help, and also the degree of annoyance. I'm sure there is lots of information available in several books, however none of those are available online or in any of the UVic's, UBC's Vancouver's or Victoria's libraries. After page two on the search engine's I have been using the quality of the info drops to near uselessness. Anyways, The M10, I guess I'm wrong in referring to the rifle - whichever is the last make of ross is the one I intended to refer to. I suppose it's the MKIII in retrospect. What I was trying to determine was if there was a mid range of bayos that were not reground to a spear point, but still fit late rosses. I was not sure if there were any MkI bayonetes that were missing the stepped ring, making it harder to identify them in pictures. As I get more of an idea I'll update my original post to get rid of errors.

 

[tiriaq]

M-10 is a sporting rifle. The service rifle built on the 1910 action is the Mk. III.
Yes, there are Mk. II bayonets which do not have ground blades. But they are not common, most were altered.
Mk. II** rifles were assembled using two different stock patterns. Some used the basic stock of the short Mk. II rifle. With the 30 1/2" barrel, the bayonet lug was too far back from the muzzle. Others used a longer stock, and the Mk. II bayonet would fit.