S&W M&P competition trigger and parts
- Thread starter shak541
- Start date
FightingIrish
Regular
- Location
- Central Alberta
tagged for interest.
Also check this out:
htt p://www.brownells.com/handgun-parts/trigger-group-parts/performance-enhancing-kits/s-w-m-p-action-enhancement-components-prod41314.aspx
Also check this out:
htt p://www.brownells.com/handgun-parts/trigger-group-parts/performance-enhancing-kits/s-w-m-p-action-enhancement-components-prod41314.aspx
The competition kit is very light (about 2 1/2-3 lbs) , but I found that it had poor feel, and slow reset so I went with the sear and striker block with the stock S&W springs. It gives a decent feel to the trigger, with a decent reset, smooth take up and a nice break. Dealers include Brownells, Dillon (the reloading press guys) and Canadian Tactical Cowboy.
Don't go half way with the changes. Get ALL of the Apex upgrades, it transforms the gun. The Comp AEK and AEK Trigger remove ALL of the stupid crunchiness in the trigger and make it very light. The RAM makes the reset as positive as a Glock. The failure resistant extractor all but eliminates ejection issues. I'm a bit pissed that this puts me into Standard because in reality, this is just how the gun should have come from S&W.
I got all of mine from Brownell's, had to order a few times with the $100 limit but still faster and easier than finding the stuff in Canada. There are a few dealers that carry this and that but no one comes close to the stock of the big Yank stores.
I got all of mine from Brownell's, had to order a few times with the $100 limit but still faster and easier than finding the stuff in Canada. There are a few dealers that carry this and that but no one comes close to the stock of the big Yank stores.
As long as the order is under 100 yeah, so with the cost of these parts you'll have to submit a few orders to keep each under 100.
BTW if you're within driving distance of Silverdale in Ontario, you're welcome to try my gun, you won't believe how delicious the trigger is.
BTW if you're within driving distance of Silverdale in Ontario, you're welcome to try my gun, you won't believe how delicious the trigger is.
The complete Competition lkit gives you a 2.5 - 2.75 pound trigger with a faster reset then stock. I am not sure what Enefgee is referring to when he talks about a slow reset. The Comp KIt comes with a new sear which reduces the reset from stock. The reset is slightly shorter than the FSS Kit due to a different sear/sear spring set up. The FSS trigger is a different set up and uses a different sear to achieve a shorter reset. I have one installed in a 40 Pro. Frankly I prefer the regular M&P trigger with the Comp Kit over the FSS system. The installation of either kit in some ways depends on what you want to do with the gun.
If you are going to play IPSC in Standard Division either kit will do. I use my FSS 40 in that division but would be comfortable had I only installed the Comp Kit. I really don't think the slightly shorter reset helps me that much B/C Class shooter in IPSC. Both upgrades takes you out of Production Division. The FSS will not make you a Master Shooter nor will the Comp Kit Limit you to B Class either.
For IDPA the Comp Kit leaves you in SSP and you can play in ESP as well. The FSS Trigger system puts you in ESP.
For using the gun as a range gun and infrequent playing at competitions I would just replace the striker block and perhaps the trigger spring with Apex parts and enjoy a smooth, lighter trigger of around 4.5#s.
There is a lot of personal preference in what I have written plus a realization that some of these upgrades really don't change much when it comes to your shooting results. The lighter trigger does help on longer shots but I don't notice any difference in my performance at distances 15 yards and in. Replacing the striker block with the Apex block is the key to a smooth trigger pull in the M&P. The Apex sear will shorten up the reset if you have the skill to take advantage of a slightly shorter reset. We aren't talking very much difference but each kit does reduce the reset over the other.
My suggestion is to decide what you intend to do with the gun, try M&P's equipped with the changes you intend to make and then decide what you want to do.
Take Care
Bob
If you are going to play IPSC in Standard Division either kit will do. I use my FSS 40 in that division but would be comfortable had I only installed the Comp Kit. I really don't think the slightly shorter reset helps me that much B/C Class shooter in IPSC. Both upgrades takes you out of Production Division. The FSS will not make you a Master Shooter nor will the Comp Kit Limit you to B Class either.
For IDPA the Comp Kit leaves you in SSP and you can play in ESP as well. The FSS Trigger system puts you in ESP.
For using the gun as a range gun and infrequent playing at competitions I would just replace the striker block and perhaps the trigger spring with Apex parts and enjoy a smooth, lighter trigger of around 4.5#s.
There is a lot of personal preference in what I have written plus a realization that some of these upgrades really don't change much when it comes to your shooting results. The lighter trigger does help on longer shots but I don't notice any difference in my performance at distances 15 yards and in. Replacing the striker block with the Apex block is the key to a smooth trigger pull in the M&P. The Apex sear will shorten up the reset if you have the skill to take advantage of a slightly shorter reset. We aren't talking very much difference but each kit does reduce the reset over the other.
My suggestion is to decide what you intend to do with the gun, try M&P's equipped with the changes you intend to make and then decide what you want to do.
Take Care
Bob
I was thinking of getting an mp9, and read a lot of crap on the internet about accuracy. How do you guys find the accuracy in the mp9? ideally after 15-20 yards (not feet)
Sorry for the off topic question!
In regards to the parts, I order EVERYTHING from brownells. I am in Canada (obviously) and I never had the problem with orders over $100, with all due respect and not wanting to start an argument, the $100 limit is for A part, not for a group of parts, and there are parts over $100 that do not fall under this category even if they are over 100. For instance, trigger parts, bolts, usually fall in this category (100 limit) but a shotgun forend of $150 will not (can be shipped without importing documents).
There are different categories for parts, some have a limit, some not, but it is the PART that has to be below the limit, not the whole order.
Sorry for the off topic question!
In regards to the parts, I order EVERYTHING from brownells. I am in Canada (obviously) and I never had the problem with orders over $100, with all due respect and not wanting to start an argument, the $100 limit is for A part, not for a group of parts, and there are parts over $100 that do not fall under this category even if they are over 100. For instance, trigger parts, bolts, usually fall in this category (100 limit) but a shotgun forend of $150 will not (can be shipped without importing documents).
There are different categories for parts, some have a limit, some not, but it is the PART that has to be below the limit, not the whole order.
No experience with the 9 but I personally avoid guns that were retrofitted for a caliber (eg I would only buy a Beretta or Glock in 9, and M&P in 40). If I were to get a M&P9 I would get an uncaptured guide rod and a few springs to try. Accuracy is all in the shooter, although the awful stock trigger requires extra talent with the trigger pull.
The 100 limit is for an ORDER, not for a part or group of parts. And they will not split up (ie if a parts kit costs 150 bucks, they won't split it into 2 boxes of parts at 75 each). I was told they would do this, they will not, at least not anymore. I wanted the FSS kit and asked if they could send me the trigger in one package and the rest in another, they said not a chance, they won't open packaging. Yes there are exceptions, you can order as many stickers and ammo boxes as you want. But this thread is about trigger parts, they fall under the limit. Gun parts orders must be under 100. I actually had them recently cancel an order of mine, where I added a part and didn't notice it pushed me over 100. They wouldn't even make two shipments for me by request, simply told me to go make 2 separate orders if I want that.
The 100 limit is for an ORDER, not for a part or group of parts. And they will not split up (ie if a parts kit costs 150 bucks, they won't split it into 2 boxes of parts at 75 each). I was told they would do this, they will not, at least not anymore. I wanted the FSS kit and asked if they could send me the trigger in one package and the rest in another, they said not a chance, they won't open packaging. Yes there are exceptions, you can order as many stickers and ammo boxes as you want. But this thread is about trigger parts, they fall under the limit. Gun parts orders must be under 100. I actually had them recently cancel an order of mine, where I added a part and didn't notice it pushed me over 100. They wouldn't even make two shipments for me by request, simply told me to go make 2 separate orders if I want that.
I should clarify, the reset was kind soft, due to the reduced power trigger return spring - it worked fine, it just didn't feel as robust as I like. As far as accuracy goes - it'll shoot at least as well as you do, unless your last name is Leatham or something. From that perspective, I'm looking at trying to get an oversized SL barrel for mine, and have a few changes in mind to improve the overall accuracy.
Well that's the problem, at least as far as I'm concerned. I concede I could be completely full of crap on this but it's just my gut feeling, and it's somewhat/possibly confirmed by the issues people have with the M&P9 that aren't seen on the 40 (I've heard of ejection issues). But the gun was designed around the 40S&W round and they later released a 9mm version by making the barrel thicker. Timing an automatic for one caliber is hard enough, so trying to make it generic for multiple seems like an idea destined to fail.
My main concerns would be the extractor and the recoil spring tension. But for the recoil spring you can get uncaptured rods and spring sets from Wolff, and try different things until you get that wonderfully consistent 100 foot ejection pattern the M&P is known for. From the anecdotal evidence I heard, the M&P9 becomes much more accurate with 147 gr ammo, which seems to support the idea that it's a gun designed for 40 cal bullets but with a thicker barrel fitted.
Get the RAM, problem solved. The reset is so positive that people across the room will hear it, let alone you feeling it - sounds like the striker went off twice.
I have never heard of the 100 ft ejection nor the 147 gr accuracy statement either. Who measures how far a case ejects. I have never seen a gun eject a case 100'...have you? From personal experience and the fact the guns up until recently had barrel twist rates of 1 - 18 the 9MM guns ware more accurate using lighter not heavier bullets. S&W has, I am told, recently increased the twist rate to 1 - 10 which is a more common twist rate for the 9MM. I have not had any reason to replace the factory recoil spring yet. I am not sure what difference a captured vs uncaptured spring would make either.
I put a RAM in one of my M&P's and couldn't hear any difference and certainly not from across the room. While some may like the RAM I found it to be a waste of money but to each his own.
Take Care
Bob
+1 - no issues approaching 40K.
