S&W M2.0 .40 shoots low.

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Kosmonument

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Hey

Had this problem since I bought the gun. Shoots way to low. At 25 yards, it shoots so low that several rounds will hit the dirt under the target board. I have to aim at the top of the board to get the thing to print in the general vicinity of where I want the rounds to go. Ammo used was Blazer and Winchester Ranger. I've heard S&W will send replacement sights to people that have this issue, but who would take care of this in Canada?
 
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Most combat sights on modern quality handguns shoot to point of aim.
Are you an experienced handgun shooter?
Shooting low left is indicative of a typical flinch especially with a .40. Can you bring the target to 5 yds and try again? 25yds is ambitious if you’re not an experienced shooter with great eyesight!

Before you go incurring cost and changing things, have a good shooter or instructor try the gun just to be sure it’s the arrow and not the Indian.
 
If you’re not an experienced pistol shooter, have someone at your club who has a lot of rounds down range put a mag through it to confirm before you change anything. I went through the same thing years ago when I first started. Likely not the gun to be honest.
 
I'm not an experienced shooter, so I'll have to do that. I have a Ruger .357 6" and I did better with that at that distance. When I first got my range membership they made me go through their own Restricted firearms course and they let us shoot off about 30 rounds from various calibers at 25 yards indoors. I printed all those on the paper, so I didn't automatically assume that I was to blame when dealing with this M&P. The calibers I used then were .22, .40, .45 and .357.

But before I change anything I'll do the five yards if possible. I don't know if my range has anything that close. Closest I've seen is 15.
 
Kosmonument said:
I'm not an experienced shooter, so I'll have to do that.
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I would set up close at 3-5 yds and see how you pattern. At that range, if you can group 10 rds into 2” consistently, then it’s a start. Don’t chase your shots. Always aim at the same spot regardless of where your rounds hit.
Watch YT videos on proper grip and sight picture. You’re at the perfect time to learn so don’t get into bad habits. They’re hard to break!
I see you just got a G17 also. The trigger is similar to the M&P. If you need help, find a competent instructor. Will be the best money you ever spend to shoot properly.
 
I’ve got an M&P9 original and 2.0. Have you zeroed the sights? That’s the first thing I do at the range with a new gun. It should be easy enough to adjust the rear sight to bring the point of impact up to where the sights are registered. This is all in the manual. I use a rubber rest block and hand hold the gun but if you can get/borrow a gun clamp that's even better.
 
A pistol can shoot a bit differently for different people. Our hands are different shapes and sizes and we grip tighter/looser than others.

One you can shoot a decent group, you then adjust the sights to suit you.

MY M&Ps needed a shorter front sight and I got a narrower one, too.

But this assumes you can shoot. Have others had the same experience of your pistol shooting so low? That does not sound right.
 
How high is the center of the target above the ground? A few feet?
If the pistol is shooting a couple or three feet low at 25y, something is badly wrong.
To raise the point of impact 24" at 25y would require a rear sight about 3/16" higher.
The suggestions to try at 5y, or let someone else shoot the pistol are good ones.
 
Practise dry firing at home. Sounds like the exact results I had when I first jumped into the M&P 40. Dry firing you'll also be able to see how your sights move when you pull the trigger. If it is you then you need to create a new neural pathway from your brain down your arm and into your hands and fingers. This can be achieved by several weeks of dry fire practise. If you have a flinch you need to erase it using this method . Now another thing.. the stock trigger on the M&P has a long pull. Another reason it's harder to correct this.

Dry firing in a room with NO AMMO in the same room of course, facing a blank wall. Touch the barrel to the wall and back up a few inches . Keep practising until those sights do not budge at all when you pull.

I've never once had to adjust factory sights on any modern pistol. It's always been my error if the shots are off target until I've learned proper technique .
 
Still alive said:
I would set up close at 3-5 yds and see how you pattern. At that range, if you can group 10 rds into 2” consistently, then it’s a start. Don’t chase your shots. Always aim at the same spot regardless of where your rounds hit.
Watch YT videos on proper grip and sight picture. You’re at the perfect time to learn so don’t get into bad habits. They’re hard to break!
I see you just got a G17 also. The trigger is similar to the M&P. If you need help, find a competent instructor. Will be the best money you ever spend to shoot properly.
Click to expand...

The G17 is being paid for, but I don't have it yet. Right now I just have this .40 and a .357 wheelgun.
 
The fixed sights used on guns like the M&P are set for some sort of "average" or widely available load. So they might shoot a bit off for some other brands of ammo or bullet weights. But we're talking a couple of inches at 15 yards, not a couple of feet to the point where the gun is putting rounds into the dirt. That sort of behavior only comes from one thing unless the gun literally has some broken parts.... and that is the shooter.

And I've seen more than a few folks that started out just fine in this regard and "learned" to flinch badly. Likely you're one of those. Either that or you're "snatching" at the trigger in a sort of reflexive pull of the trigger which is mirrored through the rest of your hand. And that's typically just as bad as a flinch.

Some dry firing helps. But you KNOW it's not going to go BANG! so you easily learn to dry fire wonderfully yet you still flinch with real loads. A .22 helps as well. It's still not perfect but at least it makes a "bang" and kicks a bit to help train you to not flinch. But in the end the really big one seems to be to learn to pull the trigger smoothly and fully each time. Try some dry firing where you smoothly build up the pressure where the trigger moves as it wishes and keep building it until the trigger is at the rear travel limit. Work on this so the full action from start of pressure build (NOT the start of travel) to trigger at the rear limit takes about a half second or a touch more.

And when shooting live ammo COMMIT to this same pressure build to the rear travel and for now HOLD the trigger back until the recoil is all done. Because another way we "train" ourselves to flinch is letting go of the trigger right at the "BANG!". So your job is to smoothly build pressure and let the trigger move as it wishes and keep building the pressure right through and past where the trigger breaks and the shot goes off. And you should still be holding it back after all the noise and kick. Once stable again release the trigger pressure with the same degree of focus and easing of the pressure. Feel that little reset "click"? If you're shooting repeated shots once you feel the click you can reverse things and go for another shot. But you'll never feel it if your finger jumps off the trigger.
 
The single best training drill may be "live and dry".
Work with a coach. The coach watches the shooter. The shooter passes the pistol to the coach, who may or may not load one round. He then passes it back to the shooter, who fires the shot, while the coach watches the shooter. This routine continues; eventually the coach loads a live round. A round is never loaded until the shooter is firing perfect dry shots. Over the course of the practice, 20 or 25 dry shots may be taken with only a few live ones The whole point of the drill is to train the shooter that there is no difference between a live shot and a dry shot. All shots are the same, and the goal is for all shots to be perfect ones, fired without anticipation/flinch/dipping. Firing perfect shots becomes the routine.
 
tiriaq said:
The single best training drill may be "live and dry".
Work with a coach. The coach watches the shooter. The shooter passes the pistol to the coach, who may or may not load one round. He then passes it back to the shooter, who fires the shot, while the coach watches the shooter. This routine continues; eventually the coach loads a live round. A round is never loaded until the shooter is firing perfect dry shots. Over the course of the practice, 20 or 25 dry shots may be taken with only a few live ones The whole point of the drill is to train the shooter that there is no difference between a live shot and a dry shot. All shots are the same, and the goal is for all shots to be perfect ones, fired without anticipation/flinch/dipping. Firing perfect shots becomes the routine.
Click to expand...

This is a great idea. I think it would work well with my own advice on the focus on the pull and hold and not the bang to go along with it. The focus on a smooth pressure build combined with not knowing if the gun will go BANG! or not would be a great combo.
 
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