Safe Storage Question

T

tomjc

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Hello everyone.

Is it okay to store my restricted handgun in the following manner:

- In a locked safe (SentrySafe) opened by pin code or key, bolted down
- Gun without a trigger lock, but unloaded (RCMP website says "Attach a secure locking device so the firearms cannot be fired and lock them in a cabinet, container or room that is hard to break into; or Lock the firearms in a vault, safe or room that was built or modified specifically to store firearms safely.". Is it saying a 'vault, safe, or room modified specifically to store firearms' or just 'room modified specifically to store firearms'.)
- Loaded magazine in safe with firearm, but not in firearm itself
- all other ammunition in a separate, locked box

According to the material on the RCMP website this should be okay, but I want to see what others think/are doing before I go ahead.

Thanks for your input!
 
It is poorly worded and open to interpretation but most here will say yes, as long as it is a safe you do not need a trigger lock on a handgun.

There was a recent case where an Ontario judge ruled even a stack on cabinet is a safe and the guy was storing automatics without trigger locks so you should be fine.
 
Why not do *more* than the bare minimum? What if the judge says "how do you know that's a safe? I think it's a metal box." Trigger locks are cheap insurance.
 
dresden_k said:
Why not do *more* than the bare minimum? What if the judge says "how do you know that's a safe? I think it's a metal box." Trigger locks are cheap insurance.
Click to expand...

#### more than is required. Its quite simple. If the container you use is sold and marketed as a safe or vault then it qualifies as a safe or a vault.

Some people here are overly paranoid about nothing.


Tdc
 
I think you might have a key to one of my trigger locks and maybe on the new locks that funky cheap u-type key. but if you forget your key there is someone who always has one at your club. or hey just use a butter knife or for the new ones small needle nose pliers. and if you forgot your case keys, all you need is a really sharp nife on the plastic ones and a screwdriver on the combo or key cast latch on the aluminum ones. I just do not get it?
 
My instructor told me about this during my CFSC. He said that a safe is in no way a vault, and by vault they mean something closer to a bank vault. (obviously not to full event tho..)
 
A proper sentry safe should be fine for a handgun. Anything locked with a solid steel dead bolt (the heavy round type) would fit the description but the flimsy cabinet type "gun safes" I wouldn't take a chance on. A vault would be something more hardcore than your standard gun safe, as mentioned above, you could run a small bank out of it. Modified rooms are probably the most dangerous territory in the storage regs as it does not define how much security is enough. Steel plated walls? Iron window bars? Reinforced doors? My instructor told me, define the regs as you please, but don't do anything you don't think you could defend in court.
 
tomjc said:
...
- Gun without a trigger lock, but unloaded (RCMP website says "Attach a secure locking device so the firearms cannot be fired and lock them in a cabinet, container or room that is hard to break into; or Lock the firearms in a vault, safe or room that was built or modified specifically to store firearms safely.". Is it saying a 'vault, safe, or room modified specifically to store firearms' or just 'room modified specifically to store firearms'.)...
Click to expand...

That phrase refers to the room and not to a safe or vault, based on my conversation with the lawyer who wrote that section.
 
Eddy_bullpoo said:
Yes I would say that is legal. If the firearm is in a safe it does not need to have a trigger lock on it, also the ammo can be stored with the firearm. I keep a glock in a similar safe, un loaded with a loaded mag beside it. From all the research I've done that is totally legal.

This is all you need. Keep a copy of it handy

http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/PDF/storage-entreposage.pdf
Click to expand...


Nice little resource.

It made me think of another related question.
I'm currently waiting for my RPAL

I was thinking of buying a bag to carry my pistol when I am finally able to purchase one.

I drive a SUV so there is no lockable trunk.

If the bag is well made and lockable, is it sturdy, per the criminal code? I contacted the Ontario CFO office and they declined to have an opinion. They said they did not have a definition for "sturdy".

So Is a pistol bag or a range bag sturdy?
 
I'd say this is where you get to more of a gray area. So long as you have a trigger lock and keep the bag locked as well, you should be following the regs, but I can't say for sure. However do give your definition of "carry", you mean just to the range and back or more then that?
 
You might want to compare that PDF to the law site posted above. As the RCMP one adds things that are not required, at first glance they say this is required for restricted transport, Remove the bolts or bolt carriers from any automatic firearms (if removable), on top of the secure locking device.

Which is for prohib transport not restricted.

That is not required by law, they are making up their own BS. Dont use the RCMP website, go to the source.

http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-98-209/page-4.html#h-9

Shawn
 
bristow84 said:
I'd say this is where you get to more of a gray area. So long as you have a trigger lock and keep the bag locked as well, you should be following the regs, but I can't say for sure. However do give your definition of "carry", you mean just to the range and back or more then that?
Click to expand...

Now that's a scary ambiguous use of words.
I totally meant "carry" as in, transport from the gunsafe to the gun range via the most direct path or however my eventual ATT specifies.
 
Here's a question I haven't seen around here yet.....What if one goes to the range via bus/subway........What are the rules for that? I personally don't drive, and use public transportation.....
 
SniperX said:
Here's a question I haven't seen around here yet.....What if one goes to the range via bus/subway........What are the rules for that? I personally don't drive, and use public transportation.....
Click to expand...

Its still just transport federally.

But you need to look up the regs of the organizations you will be traveling on and see if their regs allow it.

Shawn
 
Not true. Safes must be classified as a safe. So called gun safes, gun cabinets, made from gauge steel do not qualify as safes. The minimum industry rating for a safe is "B". The "B" class safe must be made with 1/4" solid steel body fully welded, with 1/2" solid steel door reinforced by a 1" steel frame to prevent sledge hammer attacks. Anything short of those specs can not be classified as a safe, regardless of what the seller wants to call the junk he is trying to sell you.
Having said all that, safe storage laws are designed to keep you from having quick access to your firearms in The heat of an argument with you wife, or if someone breaks into your house and you should need it to save your family. God forbid that a home invader should get shot inside your home, they have rights you know.
 
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