Same primer, different powder

Traxxas13

Traxxas13

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Question for the more experienced folks on here. Long time lurker, first post.

I’ve been reloading for about a year with pretty good success in multiple calibers and just started dipping into loading cast for my 30-30’s. Today while out trying some new loads for my Savage 219 I had something happen that I haven’t experienced before. Starline brass, Remington 9 1/2 primers, 165 grain plain base cast and multiple charges of titegroup from 5 to 6 grains. These all shot wonderfully and I was pretty happy with the results. I then tried same brass, bullet and primer but loaded with trail boss between 8 and 9.5 grains in half grain increments. These would not fire from the 219, seemed as if I was having light strikes. I got 1 to fire out of 15, I even tried firing the same round multiple times giving it a little spin each time I cracked the barrel. I then tried them in my Steven’s 325 and they all shot just fine.

Has anyone ever experienced something like this? I know the 219 firing pins can be a little finicky but it fired the 15 rounds loaded with titegroup just fine. Same brass, bullet and primer between all rounds loaded, only difference was the change in powder. Anybody know what could possibly cause this? Only other large rifle primers I have on hand are CCI’s and I’ve heard they have a harder cup than the Remingtons. I use CCI’s in all my other rifles and loads requiring LR primers without issue but haven’t tried them in the 219. Is it even worth trying the CCI’s if they are harder then the Remingtons?

Thanks all!
 
One thought... Are the primers fully seated? That's a must for sensitivity. Stand a primed cartridge upright on a hard surface... the case should not rock, if it does the primer is not seated deep enough.
 
guntech said:
One thought... Are the primers fully seated? That's a must for sensitivity. Stand a primed cartridge upright on a hard surface... the case should not rock, if it does the primer is not seated deep enough.
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I just double checked a few and they are fully seated. The Remingtons do seat much harder then the CCI’s in the Starline brass, I noticed that from previous loads but they are indeed seated fully.
 
Take a couple primed piece of brass, insert in chamber and pull the trigger. Wear ear pro it will be loud. If it doesn't go bang you know you have a problem igniting the primers.
 
OP, one solution for those light loads is to use "Pistol" primers. They would be fine in your application with those loads.
 
bearhunter said:
OP, one solution for those light loads is to use "Pistol" primers. They would be fine in your application with those loads.
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I have CCI 350’s on hand. Do you think the magnums would be okay in this situation? Also are the pistol primers softer than rifle? Just going back to the issue of CCI’s being a tougher cup then the Remingtons and running into the same issue?
 
Gatehouse said:
Take a couple primed piece of brass, insert in chamber and pull the trigger. Wear ear pro it will be loud. If it doesn't go bang you know you have a problem igniting the primers.
Click to expand...
I’ll give that a try. I was just trying to figure out why they ignited fine for the titegroup but wouldn’t ignite at all with the trail boss. I took all the light striked rounds and fed them through the model 325 and they fired just fine.
 
I had a bad batch of Remington 9 1/2 prisoners a while back, none would light up, I tried in different rifles, same thing, looks like light strikes but it wasn’t. All my primers were fully seated. Brought the leftover to my LGS and the reimbursed me, I bought some CCI and never had a problem again same with federal never had an issue.
 
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primer seated flush may not have enough 'crush' to be completely seated
try 3-4 thou deep

checking p pkt depth with a p pkt uniformer is always a good idea
 
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cci350 primers should be fine.

OP, have you pulled any of the rounds that failed to fire???

With such light loads, the powder may have been positioned too far forward to ignite. That being said, most primers generate enough pressure to force the bullet into the barrel, where it usually gets stuck. So, I'll go along with your failure to fire.

You stated Remington 9 1/2 primers were softer than CCI, but I find it the other way around, and they're very hot burning.

Check the tip of the firing pin on your Savage for pitting, as this can also create issues.
 
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bearhunter said:
cci350 primers should be fine.

OP, have you pulled any of the rounds that failed to fire???

With such light loads, the powder may have been positioned too far forward to ignite. That being said, most primers generate enough pressure to force the bullet into the barrel, where it usually gets stuck. So, I'll go along with your failure to fire.

You stated Remington 9 1/2 primers were softer than CCI, but I find it the other way around, and they're very hot burning.

Check the tip of the firing pin on your Savage for pitting, as this can also create issues.
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It seemed as if the Remingtons were harder then the CCI’s but the few other forums I checked it seemed like the conclusion was that CCI’s are harder but I’m not convinced. I’ll try the same loads but swap the Remingtons for CCI’s and see if that changes things.

I never pulled any of the rounds that failed to fire in the 219 because I fed them through the Steven’s 325 right after and they fired just fine.

I don’t believe the trail boss loads would have a powder position issue as all 3 powder charges I tried were fairly full being such a bulky powder. That’s an issue I would expect with the tite group loads but they fired just fine in the 219 with all other components being the exact same minus the powder.
 
boxhitch said:
primer seated flush may not have enough 'crush' to be completely seated
try 3-4 thou deep

checking p pkt depth with a p pkt uniformer is always a good idea
Click to expand...
I might give that a shot. I may need to ream the pockets a touch as the Remingtons seat significantly harder in the new Starline brass then CCI’s. It takes a fair amount of pressure to seat the Remingtons flush while the CCI’s seem to seat relatively easy.
 
DGY said:
I had a bad batch of Remington 9 1/2 prisoners a while back, none would light up, I tried in different rifles, same thing, looks like light strikes but it wasn’t. All my primers were fully seated. Brought the leftover to my LGS and the reimbursed me, I bought some CCI and never had a problem again same with federal never had an issue.
Click to expand...
I use CCI primers almost exclusively but stopped in to another little shop close to me and they only had Remington primers so I bought a couple hundred just to have on hand and decided to use them for these light cast plinking loads. I just find it weird that they ignited fine for the titegroup loads but wouldn’t ignite at all for the trailboss loads with all other components being the exact same and shot in the same rifle. I fed all the light striked rounds through my Steven’s 325 right after and they all went bang no problem.
 
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Traxxas13 said:
I use CCI primers almost exclusively but stopped in to another little shop close to me and they only had Remington primers so I bought a couple hundred just to have on hand and decided to use them for these light cast plinking loads. I just find it weird that they ignited fine for the titegroup loads but wouldn’t ignite at all for the trailboss loads with all other components being the exact same and shot in the same rifle. I fed all the light striked rounds through my Steven’s 325 right after and they all went bang no problem.
Click to expand...
Well that is weird, mine wouldn’t go at all, like I said tried them in different rifles and no go, so I decided it wasn’t worth it and I don’t think I will try them again.
 
Traxxas13 said:
Question for the more experienced folks on here. Long time lurker, first post.

I’ve been reloading for about a year with pretty good success in multiple calibers and just started dipping into loading cast for my 30-30’s. Today while out trying some new loads for my Savage 219 I had something happen that I haven’t experienced before. Starline brass, Remington 9 1/2 primers, 165 grain plain base cast and multiple charges of titegroup from 5 to 6 grains. These all shot wonderfully and I was pretty happy with the results. I then tried same brass, bullet and primer but loaded with trail boss between 8 and 9.5 grains in half grain increments. These would not fire from the 219, seemed as if I was having light strikes. I got 1 to fire out of 15, I even tried firing the same round multiple times giving it a little spin each time I cracked the barrel. I then tried them in my Steven’s 325 and they all shot just fine.

Has anyone ever experienced something like this? I know the 219 firing pins can be a little finicky but it fired the 15 rounds loaded with titegroup just fine. Same brass, bullet and primer between all rounds loaded, only difference was the change in powder. Anybody know what could possibly cause this? Only other large rifle primers I have on hand are CCI’s and I’ve heard they have a harder cup than the Remingtons. I use CCI’s in all my other rifles and loads requiring LR primers without issue but haven’t tried them in the 219. Is it even worth trying the CCI’s if they are harder then the Remingtons?

Thanks all!
Click to expand...
check your headspace while sizing your brass. It is possible to oversize brass if you have a sizing die that can oversize brass or if you have a loose chamber in the rifle.
 
thelongranger said:
check your headspace while sizing your brass. It is possible to oversize brass if you have a sizing die that can oversize brass or if you have a loose chamber in the rifle.
Click to expand...
I have a headspace comparator set on my list next time I head to the city for components. Thanks for the response.
 
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