Sheep Changes Coming

sheephunter

sheephunter

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So ESRD promised in 2013 that changes to sheep hunting in Alberta were coming although they still really haven't said why but they unrolled their plan today. In 2016, all WMUs south of the Brazeau will go to full curl and WMUs 400 and 302 will lose the last week of the season. Looks like it's time to dust of the bow or the goose decoys because it isn't going to be worth heading to the mountains. Hopefully the AGMAG groups get together like they did last time and present a unified front to oppose this. Time to let the Minister know your thoughts.
 
Can't say I'm surprised and don't have a problem with it. Unlimited hunters chasing a limited resource, they've just raised the standards a little. Could have made it a draw license which would have really been a Bummer. Like all these management techniques, in a couple of years, the mountains will be full of rams just under legal and guys will be sniping them, like always. ;) You have a counter proposal?


Grizz
 
Gee...maybe leave it as is as we currently have healthy sheep populations with no sign of that changing from the current pressure. Why fix what ain't broke or breaking? This all about trophy quality and nothing else.
 
Brutal, I have zero understanding of the need to change anything. If it's not broke why fix it. Most co's can't age a ram properly anyways. Lots of big rams get killed every year south of the braz.
The area I hunt sheep has a great population of rams if your willing to work for them. I've seen 9.5+ yr old rams that where just legal and I have seen 4.5 yr old that where full curl. We should manage for age if we are to try and manage anything. And also reduce predators in Wintering ranges. My 2 cents.
 
norskie said:
Another case of "herd health" being used to drive a desire for trophy quality. Elk are doing better than they ever have, why limit opportunity to grow horns?
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Why reduce the hunters' opportunity to be successful if the herd is healthy under the current management plan?
 
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sheephunter said:
Why limit the hunters' opportunity to be successful if the herd is healthy?
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The phase I heard out of the bio's mouth was large herds don't mean they are healthy, and the structure of the herd is not healthy. By killing the largest we leave smaller bulls/rams to breed etc etc.

Lets face it - its all BS. Its about growing horn - and beyond that likely about how they can market it. We are in Alberta after all...
 
norskie said:
The phase I heard out of the bio's mouth was large herds don't mean they are healthy, and the structure of the herd is not healthy. By killing the largest we leave smaller bulls/rams to breed etc etc.

Lets face it - its all BS. Its about growing horn - and beyond that likely about how they can market it. We are in Alberta after all...
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That genetic argument has been proved bunk a dozen times. Even the government is distancing themselves from it. I honestly don't get the rationale behind these sheep changes....the only real beneficiary is the resident with a few rams under his belt looking for that one really big ram. There's not much to market....this will have profoundly negative effects on outfitters....at least in the short term.
 
sheephunter said:
That genetic argument has been proved bunk a dozen times. Even the government is distancing themselves from it. I honestly don't get the rationale behind these sheep changes....the only real beneficiary is the resident with a few rams under his belt looking for that one really big ram. There's not much to market....this will have profoundly negative effects on outfitters....at least in the short term.
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I am not discounting your thoughts - but there is a market for Rams in 3-4 years when zones start pushing full curl Rams out. wmu 400 was a wasteland for hunting until the rams started making full curl, now you see some nice rams coming out of there. Short term the outfitters would lose - but my guess is they would benefit quite a bit in the future. And from what I understand, they were lobbying pretty hard for a draw.
And for what it is worth - I don't really see a need for change in sheep regs, perhaps other than to really stick it to guys that shoot short sheep, and protecting some of the range from OHV.

The elk one is a similar conundrum - they want to grow big bulls for some reason. And I don't trust their reasoning here as it has about as strong scientific merit as the sheep argument.
 
400 was a unique situation. It had a major die off and regulations were brought in to help reestablish a population. It was a wildlife management regulation. We are seeing rebounding populations now so sure things look better but it's not like it's pumping out book rams. And if it is working so well, why was 400 singled out for additional hunter restrictions in 2016? This full-curl regulation they are proposing is not a wildlife management regulation...it a hunter management regulation.

The outfitters never really lobbied for a draw but of all the scenarios that were discussed in 2013 it was the one that would benefit them the most. It's not surprising they chose it but in the end, they stood side by side with resident hunter groups to oppose any change in the province.
 
yep its unique - beside a national park too. Also unique because you could drive your pick-up right into the basins. And then there are a few other things make it unique.

Why would full curl help in establishing a population (numbers of sheep)?

I see nice rams come out of there every year now - so I think the rule helps develop larger rams.

And my guess is it will get restrictions because of the anticipated hunting pressure when the other zones go full curl...
 
There's a lot of issues witht this proposal, a lot. Not getting into what this is supposed to accomplish, since my guess is they want bigger horns on these sheep. But to make a sweeping reg changes that covers a vast area, all of which have their own dynamic and issues that could be dealt with is ####ing stupid.

Putting in a full curl rule doesn't mean you're all of a sudden going to see full curl rams in 3 years everywhere. If they want to put in a full curl rulle coupled with predation control and habitat enhancement, then that might work.

I would guess they have a statistic that proves a good amount of rams in WMU 400 are killed in the last week of the season so by shortening it will keep them alive.
 
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