Shooting off a rucksack as opposed to bi/tripod.
- Thread starter hitch.bd
- Start date
Put it this way... there is not one F Class shooter who uses a ruck sack.
If a ruck sack was inherently better, F Class guys would be using them.
You need to consider the number of shots you are taking into account though.
For example, a hunter is looking to make one shot, likely at close range, meaning inside 300 yards... So pin point accuracy is not really the motivation here.
An F Class shooter is looking to repeatedly make 12-17 consecutive shots inside a 1/2 MOA V-Bull at distances between 300 and 1000 yards... So repeatable pin point accuracy is the need.
There are some (typically military) who feel the soft ruck sac has a certain advantage since it is soft and therefore presumably consistent.... Well that depends on what you have in the ruck sack doesn't it.
Bottom line is creating a consistent base to shoot from which can be created by using soft feet on your bipod or by putting the feet of the bipod on something soft.
I'm surprised actually that someone out there does not produce silicone boots for bipod feet out of silicone casting resin. It would provide the consistent soft footing you are eluding to.
If a ruck sack was inherently better, F Class guys would be using them.
You need to consider the number of shots you are taking into account though.
For example, a hunter is looking to make one shot, likely at close range, meaning inside 300 yards... So pin point accuracy is not really the motivation here.
An F Class shooter is looking to repeatedly make 12-17 consecutive shots inside a 1/2 MOA V-Bull at distances between 300 and 1000 yards... So repeatable pin point accuracy is the need.
There are some (typically military) who feel the soft ruck sac has a certain advantage since it is soft and therefore presumably consistent.... Well that depends on what you have in the ruck sack doesn't it.
Bottom line is creating a consistent base to shoot from which can be created by using soft feet on your bipod or by putting the feet of the bipod on something soft.
I'm surprised actually that someone out there does not produce silicone boots for bipod feet out of silicone casting resin. It would provide the consistent soft footing you are eluding to.
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Personally, off a hard surface, I'll go to my ruck for my latest rifle. Was shooting off a bench with the bipod and I was getting decent groups until an old marine who seen what I was shooting told me to take that contraption off the front and throw my ruck up onto the bench instead. My groups went form about .75 MOA to .5 MOA and sometimes even better.
Now that being said, that was for this rifle. I've shot many rifles with bipods. Bipods will give you the most stable platform if you use the right bipod.
Now that being said, that was for this rifle. I've shot many rifles with bipods. Bipods will give you the most stable platform if you use the right bipod.
Seems it's more important to consider the second point of support, as Iin whatever is used to support the rear of the stock. Whether shooting off a bipod or a proper shooting rest bag or a pack, if there's no support besides one's shoulder at the back end, the heartbeat will play a significant role in shot placement. A small 'squeeze bag' seems the best bet in the field. On a bench of course there are even better options, right up to eliminating all contact but touching the trigger... But for less mechanical precision shooting a squeeze bag long enough and with the right kind and quantity of fill is great for providing a flexible, stable rear anchor, virtually eliminating heartbeat or breathing from the equation. Look to some of 260rips videos on YouTube for excellent results derived by its use. Some of his shots go over 500 metres on targets like magpies and rabbits, with very impressive consistency, using a sturdy bipod OR a backpack as the front rest, and a carefully controlled squeeze bag under the rear stock.
A bipod and rear bag is a much better and more stable solution then shooting off of a backpack.
Shooting off of a backpack/ruck sack was a field expedient way to get a shot off. I don't even think the old USMC rifles even had bipods. Marksman doctrine has changed a lot since Vietnam, especially in the past 10 years.
All modern sniper rifles are equipped with bipods. If they can't shoot off of a bipod, then tripod is the next most stable solution. Rarely would anyone shoot off of a backpack anymore, as there's better solutions.
Like Maple says, those seeking the highest degrees of precision use a bipod or other solid front rest.
Shoot off of bipod and bag. It's much more stable and consistent then shooting off of a pack.
Shooting off of a backpack/ruck sack was a field expedient way to get a shot off. I don't even think the old USMC rifles even had bipods. Marksman doctrine has changed a lot since Vietnam, especially in the past 10 years.
All modern sniper rifles are equipped with bipods. If they can't shoot off of a bipod, then tripod is the next most stable solution. Rarely would anyone shoot off of a backpack anymore, as there's better solutions.
Like Maple says, those seeking the highest degrees of precision use a bipod or other solid front rest.
Shoot off of bipod and bag. It's much more stable and consistent then shooting off of a pack.
rifleman762
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Southern Alberta
When I'm hunting (and practising for hunting) I use a bipod and a daypack under the buttstock. It gives me perfect stability. I hold down the recoil (9lb total weight 300 WM) with my left hand on top of the scope. I've shot animals from 400 to over 500 yards and it feels like a chip shot. Dial in the drop, rifle rock steady, and squeeze off a shot 
. The only variable left is the wind, which usually limits me to under 600 yards in the mountains or on the prairies.
. The only variable left is the wind, which usually limits me to under 600 yards in the mountains or on the prairies.
I have shot in Sniper style competitions with a bipod and off of my rucksack. Didn't really notice any difference.
I did it because I wanted to shoot old school that year.
In the field the rucksack is something you always have with you and makes a great field expedient rest. Some don't want the extra weight/clutter of a bipod on their rifle.
YMMV.
I did it because I wanted to shoot old school that year.
In the field the rucksack is something you always have with you and makes a great field expedient rest. Some don't want the extra weight/clutter of a bipod on their rifle.
YMMV.
- Location
- Muskoka Ontario
^^^^ Why is there not a "like" button on these threads?
I usually use a bipod and rear bag. I have taken front rest "ears" from an adjustable rest and put it through the webbing on my Rush 12 pack, worked good to put the rifle in so it would not slide around. Still need a rear rest to be super solid.
I do not carry a rucksack . For long range hunting ( 400 yds. max.) I use a homemade 3' long X sticks .
They are either 3/4" dowel or maple saplings .
One leg goes inside my belt like a sword & the other lays outside my belt . It just lays there while I'll walking
almost anywhere. I sight my .30-06 for 300 yds off those cross sticks . It shoots approx. + 6" @ 100 & 200 yds.
With elbows on my knees it feels "Rock Solid" & I am above the grass etc. . 300 yd. groups are about 4" .
I have used this for many years & killed a few animals ( Elk , Mulley , white tail & coyotes ) . It works for me !!
I tried shooting sticks for the first time this year while deer hunting......hated them. Not that stable. I dealt with the extra weight of the bipod on the rifle instead. I think sticks would be ok for gopher hunting from a chair.
X2 on the Ruck vs bipod, I'll go either or and it depends on the surface I'm shooting off of as well.
I have used both and prefer shooting off the ruck. That being said I am primarily a hunter and used to shoot competition so I could become a better hunting shot.
As other posters have said about the bipod - It adds significant weight to the rifle (especially a good quality bipod). Another aspect of the added weight is where it's added.
In this case the addition is near the front of the rifle where it is the most inconvenient and noticeable.
The slung weight tends to pull the muzzle backwards on your shoulder so the rifle does not sling well vertically. (It seems you're always fighting it and readjusting so it hangs vertically). It's also very noticeably heavier when taking a shot offhand unsupported although some may say this is a good thing as it dampens muzzle movement.
In the field it may offer some slight advantage over shooting off your ruck but to my way of thinking it's more of a PITA over all. I prefer a good shooting sling over a bipod.
As other posters have said about the bipod - It adds significant weight to the rifle (especially a good quality bipod). Another aspect of the added weight is where it's added.
In this case the addition is near the front of the rifle where it is the most inconvenient and noticeable.
The slung weight tends to pull the muzzle backwards on your shoulder so the rifle does not sling well vertically. (It seems you're always fighting it and readjusting so it hangs vertically). It's also very noticeably heavier when taking a shot offhand unsupported although some may say this is a good thing as it dampens muzzle movement.
In the field it may offer some slight advantage over shooting off your ruck but to my way of thinking it's more of a PITA over all. I prefer a good shooting sling over a bipod.
- Location
- Comox Valley
Yep I agree ... we need a "like " button.
I think shooting off a backpack is a good skill to have. One of my first cheap bipods exploded so I shot off a pack for about 2 weeks while I sourced an Atlas. For sure a good bipod is better but having well rounded skills is important.
- Location
- Alberta, North America
Train for both: you never know when you need to go prone (altitude, obstructions, overhead cover etc.), sitting in a chair + blind a bi or tripod is useful ....
If you have to shoot more than 400-500 yds, your just not a hunter ... the F Class can stay on your ranges
If you have to shoot more than 400-500 yds, your just not a hunter ... the F Class can stay on your ranges
