Short-stroke piston vs Long-stroke piston
- Thread starter Infinity
- Start date
Long stroke guns tend to be smoother because the piston travels within a gas tube for the full travel needed for the bolt group. The gas pressure can be relieved later in the cycle. It is bulkier, and the gas tube must be protected or built strong so it won't be banged up.
Short stroke needs to get enough pressure to build up enough force for the rod to impart enough momentum for the bolt group to finish the travel on its own. It is simpler and lighter, because there is no need to figure out how to connect the op rod with the bolt group, and the disassembly is much neater. It is also probably easier to build a rifle with a short stroke push rod if water is an issue, so there is less to think about water getting compressed inside a gas tube.
Short stroke needs to get enough pressure to build up enough force for the rod to impart enough momentum for the bolt group to finish the travel on its own. It is simpler and lighter, because there is no need to figure out how to connect the op rod with the bolt group, and the disassembly is much neater. It is also probably easier to build a rifle with a short stroke push rod if water is an issue, so there is less to think about water getting compressed inside a gas tube.
A short stroke piston will be inherently more accurate due to a lighter weight op rod, shorter travel distance, etc;
That being said, the realized accuracy difference is going to be completely negligible unless you are doing some very precise shooting.
Eaglelord17
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Sault Ste. Marie
Also remember the SKS is short stroke as well. It is all about the overall design rather than one being inherently better.
It comes down more to barrel quality than operating system from my observations. My PWS with 12 inch barrel and long stroke system has shot sub moa groups with 77gr match grade factory ammo, I've seen better groups from a couple of the DI rifles I've owned but they were also longer match grade barrels.
The claims that the piston systems run cooler and cleaner doesn't really matter much for civilian shooters since we don't get to run them full auto and you can easily run 1000 rounds through either system without cleaning or any worry of failures caused by crud build-up. I know guys that run their DI rifles all summer in 3-gun and service rifle and all they do is give it a little oil once in a while. They clean their AR once a year and don't worry about anything.
If accuracy is your goal then build or buy a DI rifle.
The bad thing about piston systems is they are almost always proprietary to that manufacturer so getting parts is a pain in the ass, especially if it breaks something a few years after you purchase it and they are two models newer and the retailer you bought it through no longer carries that brand.
My PWS has around 5000 rounds through it, it still looks almost new inside and has never had a failure that wasn't caused by the magazine or how the operator seated the magazine. I'm very impressed with it and it's still my favorite AR I've owned.
I added the DI info because it has the greatest advantage for a civilian shooter, parts availability. You can buy DI parts at any shop that carries AR's and unless there is a specific reason someone wants a piston rifle there really is no need to go that route. The internet makes us think we need to run a piston gun because it runs smoother, cooler and cleaner but in the real world of Canadian civilian shooters the simplicity and parts availability of a DI rifle far outweigh the few benefits of a piston system and all other things being equal a DI rifle will be more accurate than the short or long stroke piston systems.
Don't get me wrong, I love my PWS but when it comes time to buy parts for it I know I'll be waiting weeks or months for parts and I can only order those parts through a couple retailers in Canada. My DI rifles on the other hand would be back up and running within a day or two as I can go to at least three different retailers locally and buy whatever I need.
The biggest advantage I see to a piston rifle is that it won't explode in your hands if you shoot it full of water but since I don't swim with my rifles and abuse the hell out of them I really have no use for that ability.
A piston system on an AR is for the most part is a solution to a problem that was never there to begin with. Certain military groups will see the benefits of it but for the most part a well built and maintained DI rifle will be just as reliable and probably more accurate.
Bolivar
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I don't think anybody is going to make a purchase decision of those rifles based on the operating system. There are no options there.
It's logical to infer the OP is asking relative to a modern rifle platform that can be built with either long or short stroke such as the AR, which also comes in DI.
This is also the Black Rifle forum, not Milsurp, so one would assume that Milsurp rifles are no in the equation.
The OP could weigh in though as my assumptions are just that. I've been wrong before, just ask my wife.
Eaglelord17
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Sault Ste. Marie
He specifically asked not about the AR-15, which leads us to other firearms designs. Some examples of long stroke and short stroke are things like AK-47s, M1 Garands, M14s, SKS, and FN-49s. It doesn't really matter the example as long as it is talking about the short stroke piston vs long stroke piston. If you want to change the name of the firearm and still not really have a effect on the debate you would say Tavor or XCR for long stroke and a VZ-58 for short stroke, which by the way all the ones listed except for the XCR are milsurps (even the AR-15), even if you like to sub-divide them into the 'black rifles' catagory.
i dont realy understand the comparison
The only firearm that I am aware of that is avalable that can use either a long stroke or a short stroke is the ar-15.
So the idea of comparing the two piston types on different firearms is pointless.
We just end up comparing different firearms designs.
The only firearm that I am aware of that is avalable that can use either a long stroke or a short stroke is the ar-15.
So the idea of comparing the two piston types on different firearms is pointless.
We just end up comparing different firearms designs.
