Should I pursue velocity further?

[langfordbc]

Posted here over the reloading sub-forum as I expect virtually everyone here handloads, while not every reloader shoots long-range.

My intention with this rifle is to hone my reloading and shooting skills and shoot to 1000 plus yards. It is a Tikka CTR 260 Remington with 20" barrel in a KRG Bravo stock. I've just started shooting and load developing this week, starting with Berger seating depth method at my chosen starting charge. I initially intended on shooting 140 Hybrids, but due to mag length I was going to have to start at probably 0.100" jump, so I decided on the Berger 130 OTMs. With 41.0 grains H4350, after a couple sighting in and fouling rounds, I shot 10 four round groups at 100 yards. Worst was 1.25", with 3 groups around 0.460". It seemed to prefer closer to the lands, so I settled at 0.010" jump for now. Next session was charge testing at 41.0 to 43.5 grains, 2x 4 round groups each charge at 100 yards. Possible slight pressure signs on a couple cases at 43.5. The groups at 41.0 grains were best at 0.385" and 0.415" with an 8 round ES and SD of 47 and 12. The rest were larger and had higher ES and SD. Average velocity for those was about 2550 fps

Anyways, to my question:

Is it worth it to try some other bullets in an attempt to find something that shoots well, but at a higher velocity? On hand I have the Berger 140 Hybrid, 142 SMK, and Lapua 136 Scenar-L. I understand the 20" barrel handicaps me slightly but is settling at 2550 fps likely going to cause me frustration as I attempt to reach out further? Should I just shoot that round further out and consider those results? Long range is new to me and while I have spent many hours reading on forums, it's sometimes nice to get direct feedback on one's specific situation.

 

[Suther]

Sounds awfully slow. I wouldn't be happy with that velocity.

I'm not sure a different, heavier bullet will be any better? Do you have any other powders on hand?

 

[langfordbc]

Yeah, I kinda figured that too. I have a few pounds of Varget. I know pickings are slim, but do you have another powder you'd suggest?

 

[SND]

N160 works good for 260rem and gave me the best velocity, mainly shot 139gr scenars, great target bullet that doesn't seem very picky.
H4350 is good for the lighter bullets like 123gr but I got into pressure issues before I could get enough velocity, H4831 was a bit on the slow side. 30" barrel.

 

[justmessing]

New rifle? Barrel might speed up, but that seems very slow. My pet load is 42.3RL16 pushing a 130 OTM Hybrid from a 22" .260 at 2865 with an ES of 9fps

I bought a second .260 and threw together the same load, first three rounds were 3/4 MOAish.

It is a phenomenal powder, if you can find it these days. I've had good (but not as good) success with H4350 and RL17 with 140 class bullets.

RL17 should get you some more speed in theory - but not as temp stable as 16. I couldn't find any 16 so I'm testing RL23 right now and saving my old stash for matches this year.

 

[LongBomber]

I would have expected a 130 more like 2750 or better from a 20”. I have driven a 129lrab over 3 k from a 26” which makes me think 2750 should be possible in a 20”. The 43.5gr of h4350 would be near or at max in the 6.5cm’s I have loaded for, what was your speed with that charge?

 

[Suther]

I would have expected a 130 more like 2750 or better from a 20”. I have driven a 129lrab over 3 k from a 26” which makes me think 2750 should be possible in a 20”. The 43.5gr of h4350 would be near or at max in the 6.5cm’s I have loaded for, what was your speed with that charge?

Nosler lists 43.5gr as a max load, 2907fps w/24" barrel. https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/260-remington/

However they also got 2790fps from 41.5gr in a 24" barrel, which seems like quite a bit faster than the OP even if you factor in the 4" of extra barrel and 1/2gr of powder. (thats a 60fps/inch difference, which is more than double the average fps/inch loss on a 6.5CM based on testing done by rifleshooter.com - https://rifleshooter.com/2016/02/6-...l-length-on-velocity-cutting-up-a-creedmoor/; https://rifleshooter.com/2019/03/6-5-creedmoor-effects-of-barrel-length-on-velocity-2019/)

Sounds like the OP has a slow barrel.

 

[langfordbc]

Average velocity at 43.5 was 2720ish fps. It is a brand new rifle, that now has 93 rounds on it. I'm expecting that it could speed up, but I was thinking ~30 fps might be optimistic. So far it is under performing, speed-wise, what I had expected from reading threads on several forums about that calibre/bullet/powder combo, and even several of the exact rifle.

Not being overly knowledgeable on nodes, if I play with seating depth at higher charge, is it possible I'll find something with comparable accuracy (and tightened up ES/SD numbers) to what I've found at the low end so far?

 

[shooter177]

My tikka 260 runs the 143 eldx right around 2650, tikkas are known for slow barrels but 2550 sounds a bit too slow for 130s in my opinion, mine did speed up about 75fps after the first 100 or so shots

 

[chrismc]

My 260 load was r16 over 130 hybrids, 2990
140 hybrids shot great too, but not as good as the 130's. The 140 hybrids liked 120-130 jump!!!! That was their sweet spot
R17 or R16 are good, n550 is good, H4350 is good too.
But, with a 20" barrel, if you wanted velocity, 123 scenar is a real good bullet that is easy to tune.

 

[Tikka223]

I’ve got a T3 in 6.5 Creedmoor that is also on the slow side for velocity. From what I’ve read the Tikkas have a bit of a reputation for being a bit slow. I’ll keep shooting it and see what happens. I’ve decided to stick with consistent ES and SD rather than speed.

 

[Alpheus]

For comparison, at 1000yds with a full value 10mph wind.

MV	Velocity(fps)	Energy(ft-lbs)	Elevation(moa)	Windage(moa)	TOF(s)
2550fps	1237	442	-37.97	8.67	1.68
2750fps	1377	547	-31.73	7.65	1.54

 

[langfordbc]

For comparison, at 1000yds with a full value 10mph wind.

MV	Velocity(fps)	Energy(ft-lbs)	Elevation(moa)	Windage(moa)	TOF(s)
2550fps	1237	442	-37.97	8.67	1.68
2750fps	1377	547	-31.73	7.65	1.54

Yeah, I had done the comparison too. It's not insignificant.

As I already have H4350 and 3 other bullets on hand, I've loaded up twenty of each to see if there is anything that might be worth pursuing. Also ordered some N160 and RL 17 too.

The Berger 140 Hybrid could be loaded at 0.075" off the lands (with 5 thou to spare) and fit the CTR mag.

 

[rugbydave]

For what it's worth, I'd just pick a load that shoots to your accuracy expectation/desire and shoot that till you get over 150 or so rounds. Track your velocity every 50 rounds or so. In my experience, barrels in 6.5 or 6mm tend to speed up till about the 150 rd mark. Then take the bullet you want to try and work up till you hit pressure. you should find something in there that shoots well. I'd expect you to get more speed than that out of 20" barrel with 130s. It's not apples to apples but before the current nonsense I had a 19" 6.5 Creed gas gun and with 42.0gr of H4350 I'd get 2650fps with a 140gr. An inch more barrel, no gas system and the extra head room of the .260, I'd expect more speed out of a 130gr.

 

[Mystic Precision]

Having shot a 6.5 to over 2000yds, I really don't think you are going to face any 'speed' anxiety on your side of 1000yds.

Just take your best combo with low vertical dispersion and go have some fun.... alot of what you are worrying about only is a worry cause you haven't shot at distance. It matters very little this side of a very long ways out.

Starting velocity is far less important then having tight vertical... start shooting way out there and this will become abundantly clear

And start testing at least 200yds out... 300yds is better. Here you can tune for the lowest possible vertical dispersion... and then LR isn't such a big deal

Jerry

 

[HondaVTEC]

Having shot a 6.5 to over 2000yds, I really don't think you are going to face any 'speed' anxiety on your side of 1000yds.

Just take your best combo with low vertical dispersion and go have some fun.... alot of what you are worrying about only is a worry cause you haven't shot at distance. It matters very little this side of a very long ways out.

Starting velocity is far less important then having tight vertical... start shooting way out there and this will become abundantly clear

And start testing at least 200yds out... 300yds is better. Here you can tune for the lowest possible vertical dispersion... and then LR isn't such a big deal

Jerry

What he said !!!