Sight picture & targeting: american vs. european pistols

[Pthagoraz]

Hey all. Learned something new yesterday and thought I would share. Might save a newbie or two (like me) some future grief. I kept shooting low with my jericho 941 and was trying to correct my shooting technique. Turns out the "6 o'clock" sight picture for targeting that I was taught is not universal. Go figure. Now I'm a marksman ready to win olympic gold !

"American designed weapons are suppose to hit a POI with the X target on top of the front sight. On the other hand, European designed sight systems are suppose to hit a POI with the top of the front sight COVERING the X target.

If this explanation is not clear look at it this way. If one sights a European designed sight system using the standard American sighting technique, it will generally shoot low. If one uses an American designed sight with the European technique it will generally shoot high."

http://www.ocabj.net/sight-picture-a-primer/

 

[KevinB]

Well not really.

You need to remember that a "zero" is simply a place where the POI converges with POA.

The load you use will impact that, but with what regard to what you talk about the distance your shooting at has a major play due to trajectory of the bullet.

For example - at 25m I shoot POA/POI with the X of the target being cut in half by the front sight
In close for speed I shoot the Tritium Dot that is my aiming mark (once again sights level)

The same manner with my DeltaPoint on my M&P CORE, I shoot the top of the dot hold at 25 - and just aim the dot inside.
At 100 the bottom of the dot is just slightly over my intended POI.

 

[ChiliDawg]

Bullseye shooters aim for the bottom of the black with the POI in the X ring. To much variance if you aim center of black.

 

[BCRider]

It's not "American vs European". It's "Match Bullseye (and similar) vs combat/self defense" use of the firearm.

The reason the 6 o'clock is used for match bullseye work is like that mentioned above. It's just easier to get a more consistent target hold when you "lollipop" the whole black center part on top of the front blade. But to get a consistent POI from this style of POA the gun has to be adjusted for the size of the black portion of the target and the distance needs to be consistent. If you change the size of the black bull portion of the target or alter the distance you shoot the target your 6o'clock hold won't work any longer and the sights will require adjustment.

That's why the combat sight picture is used for combat, defensive and sport shooting where the targets and distances are seldom consistent. It pretty much ensures a decent level of accuracy from 2 to 25 yards. Beyond that some ammo choices begins to require a little to a lot of hold over for elevation due to bullet drop out at the target position.

 

[EdGCNM]

Meh. Most top shooters don't use a 6 o'clock hold because it tends to create both "mid ranging" (the eye tends to flick in focus between the target and the front sight to judge alignment, and the shot may break when the eye is not actually focused on the front sight) and snatching at the trigger when the shooter judges the front sight (which is never perfectly still, after all) to be aligned perfectly with the bottom of the bull. In other words, jerking the trigger. As a result, most who do not shoot centre hold will use a "sub-6" hold, concentrating on maintaining sight alignment with the sights positioned entirely below the black. This does mean that most European target pistols are designed to shoot higher than the average American pistol. I have had to buy extra tall front sights for some of my European target pistols because I naturally shoot high, and I shoot a centre hold, so even with the sights cranked all the way down I could not get the shots to strike where I was aiming.

 

[plinker 777]

It's not "American vs European". It's "Match Bullseye (and similar) vs combat/self defense" use of the firearm.

The reason the 6 o'clock is used for match bullseye work is like that mentioned above. It's just easier to get a more consistent target hold when you "lollipop" the whole black center part on top of the front blade. But to get a consistent POI from this style of POA the gun has to be adjusted for the size of the black portion of the target and the distance needs to be consistent. If you change the size of the black bull portion of the target or alter the distance you shoot the target your 6o'clock hold won't work any longer and the sights will require adjustment.

That's why the combat sight picture is used for combat, defensive and sport shooting where the targets and distances are seldom consistent. It pretty much ensures a decent level of accuracy from 2 to 25 yards. Beyond that some ammo choices begins to require a little to a lot of hold over for elevation due to bullet drop out at the target position.

X2. This^.