Single stage or progressive ?

Niko-PG

Niko-PG

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I'm pretty sure this question has been asked already but I can't find it :redface:

I'm looking at buying a press to reload 10 mm, 223 and 308. My main objective is mass production. Not really interested in precision reloading for now, I just want the big numbers.

My last experience (6 years ago) in reloading was with a single stage RCBS and I hated every minute of it :bangHead:

I was ready to order a progressive kit when I started hearing that a progressive press isn't good for rifle ammo (specially for AR15).

So what system would you advice me to pick for some reliable ammo at 150-200 rnds / hour mini ?
If caliber is really a matter, my priorities are 223 and 308

thanks

Nick
 
I have an older RCBS 4x4 progessive press, and I find it works fine for all my pistol and small rifle calibers, up to a 308. (I can do 30-06 but have to disengage auto advance, and just turn the turret by hand) I've never used my it as a real progressive press, as I don't trust the power dispensors on them. I still prime them seperate, and fill the powder with a normal powder despenser (so I can check the levels, every time). Sometimes the 4x4 can be found on Ebay, other wise you'll be paying big bucks on the newer presses....
 
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Progressives will go thru .223 easily. Make sure the cases are lubed and you'll have zero issues with it. Myself I like single stages. Getting that RCBS chargemaster helped huge though. :)
 
People that aren't really interested in devoting time to the manufacture of quality ammo should buy a single stage press, that way when they screw up, it only happens to a minimum number of rounds.
 
so is anybody use a progressive press regulary for .223 and .308 ?

The only thing I don't like about the single stage press is the fact that it takes me an hour to use a whole day of reloading (in .223):bangHead:

A single stage press is on my list anyway for my 300 WM but for now I need/want crates of 223 and 308 :evil:
 
AGAIN, THE DILLON 550B - mine was set up from the factory in 308 w ( this was back in the day when you PHONED dillon and they sent it out mail- i had 4 m14s and couple of hunting rifles to feed at the time and we could use 20 round mags,so it was nothing to go through 2-300 rounds a session- they set it right up for 150 grain and it was ready to roll when i got it- just had to stick the head in place and fill the tubes-as far as the 223 goes, i use a different press- a lee 1000- mostly because changing the head is a pita and they're cheap realatively- done again, i'd change the 1000 for a loadmaster
 
550B for 223 in an AR works super but if you hate reloading go for a 650 or a 1050 the more you go up the easier they are once they are set-up right an all out 1050 will give you ammo real fast
 
I'm biased... (I sell Dillon stuff)
but the 550 is a great press for all 3 cartridges... becuase it's manually indexed you sorta have to best of best worlds if you do screw up it's only the 4 rounds your working on
 
4 rounds is too much for me. Besides. The biggest time spent is tumbling and trimming the freaking cases. When they make a press that will clean, size, trim, prime, powder, seat and crimp then I'll get that progressive :)
 
Jarlath said:
4 rounds is too much for me. Besides. The biggest time spent is tumbling and trimming the freaking cases. When they make a press that will clean, size, trim, prime, powder, seat and crimp then I'll get that progressive :)
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So let me get this straight, for 100 rounds you'd rather put the case in and pull the handle 300 times (Assuming you deprime size & bell in one stage) and manually powder the 100 cases. rather then put the case in once and pull the handle once?????

Ok its your time.


Actually I saw a setup a while ago that a guy had setup that was sorta neat... had setup a little conveyor from a 550 to a 1050... He took the rounds from his tumbler and ran then thru the 550 which deprimed trimmed and lubed & sized the cases when they dropped out they went up the conveyor into his 1050 where he ran them thru all the regular loading steps... Wish I'd had a camera...


Think he said he did about 300 at a time... and he could do both at the same time... Don't know how well it did but it looked neat...
 
bear.23 said:
So let me get this straight, for 100 rounds you'd rather put the case in and pull the handle 300 times (Assuming you deprime size & bell in one stage) and manually powder the 100 cases. rather then put the case in once and pull the handle once?????

Ok its your time.
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I'd rather be 100% sure of every loaded cartridge going BANG without having errors such as too little or too much powder. If you run outta primers or have a jam in that primer feeder, yet another error to occur. Case split during sizing, all of these are tough to find as you crank out on a progressive. Considering that I find reloading relaxing and almost a form of meditation, yeah. I'd rather pull the handle 300 times and come out with zero errors ever, meaning that I catch an error as soon as it ocurs, not after 4 or more cartridges have been finished (hopefully), then pull it only 100 times and have an issue due to a single lack of a component (powder, primer, bullet). Mind you I do use 2 single stages side by side, usually one for seating, and the other for crimping.

If you run outta powder, how fast would you notice if you are "in the zone" cranking away, (Not all of us have the money to spend on powder level alarms and Dillons). Run outta Primers or have a primer feeding jam, how many rounds will you crank out before noticing that you have powder dribbling out the flash holes while you continue to crank out rounds?

Do you use your dillon 650 to 'work up' loads or just mass produce?
I would like to have a progressive mind you, but until I finish finding the magic loads for my firearms and their specific applications (Close range, deer, varmint, long range paper shooting, plinking, etc...) I'll stil stay with my singles. I just finished 150 .223 with all the same components except I have varying powder charges in them (Sets of 15 rounds) to find the loads that my one rifle likes. That load goes into my log book for that rifle.
Those 150 rounds from the sized, trimed, primed condition took about an hour to finish including varying the powder loads, seat & crimp.

I have no issues with progressives (As I would take a Dillon if I could afford it) providing that you are almost anal about ensuring everything is 100% operational and has sufficient supplies for your batch of cartridges. I only load in batches of 50 at a time, but I have loaded 1000 .40 on my single stage presses in a unbroken string (No die swaps and resetting of measures etc...) Time consuming? Yes. Satisfying? Everything except cleaning out primer pockets (and trimming rifle brass)
 
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If you run outta powder, how fast would you notice if you are "in the zone" cranking away, (Not all of us have the money to spend on powder level alarms and Dillons). Run outta Primers or have a primer feeding jam, how many rounds will you crank out before noticing that you have powder dribbling out the flash holes while you continue to crank out rounds?
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If you have never used a progressive, just say so.
 
I use my presses (Sorry I now have 2 SDB's a 550 a 650 and a 1050) for everything from working up a load to "mass production" (PS a 1050 with a bullet feeder and primer loader can do 10K of 9mm in 4-5 hours!)

I've loaded maybe 200K rounds in the past 10 years.. (some years back I believe I loaded 40K just for 1 summer of PPC and I don't remember any squibs that year)... I've had bad primers but that isn't the presses fault....

Running out of powder is stupidity the power measure is clear... not priming you can feel it seat the primer....

Split case again you can feel....

And anything else is very much the same as on your single stage....

I'm not saying that single stages are useless they have their place... For those that really are anal about control they are great... And some people only load very small quantities and can't justify the price or a progressive...

Working up one-off's again but most people don't do just one... Maybe 5 or 10...
 
For mass production you should invest more $$$ and buy Dillon 650 or Hornady LNL (flip a coin and choose one ;).
Dillon has outstanding service, so myself I would go with Dillon. You can buy press in USA, I do not think is on the restricted list, so no special permits require, you save yourself around 30-35%.
As for being sure that every load has a powder I solved that with little light above the charger pointing down towards the case that I can visually check for powder and not being surprise later.
It may slow me a bit, but still without sweat I roll 100 rounds in around 12 minutes.

Good Luck
 
bear.23 said:
I use my presses (Sorry I now have 2 SDB's a 550 a 650 and a 1050) for everything from working up a load to "mass production" (PS a 1050 with a bullet feeder and primer loader can do 10K of 9mm in 4-5 hours!)
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A fair investment in equipment.
Running out of powder is stupidity the power measure is clear
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Agreed, but not everyone bothers to check.
... not priming you can feel it seat the primer....
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I've only ever used a hand primer despite having the accessories for my single stages.
I'm not saying that single stages are useless they have their place... For those that really are anal about control they are great... And some people only load very small quantities and can't justify the price or a progressive...
Working up one-off's again but most people don't do just one... Maybe 5 or 10...
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Don't get me wrong, I don't find a thing wrong with progressive presses. I just cannot justify the cost realization for my own usage. Some people, like yourself, load a few thousand rounds in at a sitting. (2K of 9mm per hour on a single machine is impressive.) If I was to suddenly find some extra funds I'm sure I'd get a progressive and still be anal about checks and such. I also like to sit in front of the TV and size deprime pistol brass, and prime them using the hand primer.
If someone were to offer me a Dillon for $100, I'd jump on it, but I budget my spending on equipment cause the components cost enough without me shooting more often. (Reload more to save more, shoot more because you reload more. It is a vicious circle of logic that I keep falling into :)).
 
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