Small Gear Head Lathe Repair in Calgary

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Markit

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I have a Busy Bee Craftex B2227L gear head lathe and there is some bearing noise coming from i beleive is the spindle bearing.

Does anyone know of a shop in Calgary that can replace bearings in the headstock of a small gear head 10 x 18” metal lathe for a reasonable price?

Lathe is approximately 9 years old and i suspect the bearing noise in on me. Last year I stupidly used the lathe in the winter in cold temperatures for turning and then threading a barrel (lathe is in the garage) and it began making some noise this summer.

Sounds like the bearing just behind the chuck. The noise isn’t that bad and has not gotten worse with use - sort of a quiet rumbling - no squeaking. Runout has not changed.

I have changed the oil and there do not appear to be metal filings in it but would like to repair it before it becomes a bigger issue.

If it wasn’t a gear head I would do it myself but I am concerned that i will $#@% up the reassembly and the gear selection won’t work properly if i do it. Disassembly does not look complicated. Reassembly is my concern.

Many thanks in advance.

Markit.
 
You need to join up to the "Canadian Hobby Metal Workers" forum. There is a bushel of info on your needed topic from some very knowledgeable people. There is a very large contingent of machinist (both hobby & journeyman) on there from the Calgary area that will offer immediate assistance I would bet.
 
running in cold weather should not do any damage to the headstock bearings, was the oil low? I have several lathes all gear head, my small one does not like running in the cold and way too much drag to reach full speed but never had a issue after running at 500rpm for 10 mins

is the bearings getting hot when running 1500 for a period of time?
 
fingers284 said:
You need to join up to the "Canadian Hobby Metal Workers" forum. There is a bushel of info on your needed topic from some very knowledgeable people. There is a very large contingent of machinist (both hobby & journeyman) on there from the Calgary area that will offer immediate assistance I would bet.
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I'm thinking Modern Tool would be the place. That forum is great and we had a get together there last year, these guys know their stuff. :)

https://www.moderntool.com/locations/calgary-alberta/

Grizz
 
Oy vey! Get a quote up front!

Usually this sort of thing is a strictly DIY proposition, as the shop rates that the pro's charge are worth more than the lathe.

Does the manual, if any, have the part number for the bearing? If not, a Bearing supply house can get you one (likely a LOT cheaper if you can buy through work or someone that has an account) based on the dimensions, which will be inside and outside diameters, plus the thickness of the bearing, almost inevitably in MM.
 
bearings in lathe are higher quality than regular ones, changed a couple over the years and yes the big guys charge lots and typically want to do more that bearings when they have it apart, had a Lancer lathe the bearings were rumbling, the oil fill was on the top cover and just a rubber plug to seal it, typically I put the chuck key and anything else on the top of the headstock and the rubber grommet popped and allowed a few shavings to get in the headstock

the hard part was getting the spindle out, changing bearings was easy I had to make some plates to sandwich the bearing for installation as I left the headstock on the bed

bearings were special order with a months lead time, I did install regular bearings short term, honestly did not see any difference between the standard or high precision,
 
I'm trying to picture the symptoms. Pity I can't hear the sound.

If it has a high/low spot on a race the sound you're hearing should have a tonal component at the roller pass frequency. A click every time a roller goes over the defenct, I mean.

An a-tonal rumble sounds more like a loose part, as you need non-linear junctions to transform the shaft/roller/tooth drive frequency to a broad-spectrum response.

If assembly doesn't look complicated then you might give it a shot. Take lots of photos to help with reassembly. You may just have something that needs tightening, or a secondary shaft that needs a new bushing.

But a low rumble without runout and no cogging isn't what I'd immediately think of as a spindle bearing issue.

If you turn a test cylinder out of brass with a sharp rounded tool, do you get an optically smooth cylinder?

And shop rate is going to exceed replacement cost quickly.
 
laurencen said:
bearings in lathe are higher quality than regular ones, changed a couple over the years and yes the big guys charge lots and typically want to do more that bearings when they have it apart, had a Lancer lathe the bearings were rumbling, the oil fill was on the top cover and just a rubber plug to seal it, typically I put the chuck key and anything else on the top of the headstock and the rubber grommet popped and allowed a few shavings to get in the headstock

the hard part was getting the spindle out, changing bearings was easy I had to make some plates to sandwich the bearing for installation as I left the headstock on the bed

bearings were special order with a months lead time, I did install regular bearings short term, honestly did not see any difference between the standard or high precision,
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Not very likely in a Chinese Mini Lathe!
I'd pretty much bet on a decent set of wheel bearings at the spindle end of the headstock.
And that for not very much, you can buy a cup and cone bearing set that is of far higher quality from a bearing house.
They certainly are not running precision matched pairs of ball bearings in there.

A sheet of cardboard and lay all the parts down in the order they come off, and then reverse the sequence for assembly.

But even before all that, I'd be all about getting that headstock partly apart, and seeing if the noise was not from wear in the gears. Gotta face the facts, they are not exactly using anything all to special in their products, and there is every chance that the sound is simply a normal noise from that particular machine. Removing the gears from the equation, and spinning the spindle over without anything else in contact, will isolate whether the bearings are the problem or not.
 
trevj said:
Not very likely in a Chinese Mini Lathe!
I'd pretty much bet on a decent set of wheel bearings at the spindle end of the headstock.
And that for not very much, you can buy a cup and cone bearing set that is of far higher quality from a bearing house.
They certainly are not running precision matched pairs of ball bearings in there.

A sheet of cardboard and lay all the parts down in the order they come off, and then reverse the sequence for assembly.

But even before all that, I'd be all about getting that headstock partly apart, and seeing if the noise was not from wear in the gears. Gotta face the facts, they are not exactly using anything all to special in their products, and there is every chance that the sound is simply a normal noise from that particular machine. Removing the gears from the equation, and spinning the spindle over without anything else in contact, will isolate whether the bearings are the problem or not.
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This. If you don't have vibration to go along with the noise, worn bearings aren't likely the cause.

If you have a stethoscope, or access to one, put the point onto the bearing housing and listen to what's going on. Bearings that are bad enough to hear without aid are usually pretty sloppy and sound like gravel rolling around in a can of oil or make crunching sounds when turned by hand.
 
https://www.busybeetools.com/content/product_manuals/B2227L.pdf

Is that the Lathe?

If so, the main spindle bearing is a 32009

The rear bearing is said to be a 320 bearing. In this case, you will need to know the diameter of the Inside, as they spec the bearings in the various catalogs as 320/28, for a 28mm ID, or 320/32, for 32mm.

In any case, despite the fractured Chinglish of the descriptions, they provide pictures suitable for assembly and disassembly use. Might be worth printing out.
 
Yup, that is the lathe.

Thanks all of you for the info. It is greatly appreciated.

I am going to attempt to adjust the bearing backlash first. If that doesn’t work will be tearing it apart as a DIY project. Found a forum online where several people have had the same issue with this exact lathe. It is either the backlash to cheep china bearings and a poorly designed oiling system.

Forum I found info in is here: https://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/forum/general/46606-craftex-b227l-lathe-gearbox-noise-fix

If it isn’t the backlash I have the feeling this is going to suck big time. BOHICA with Chinese tools.
 
Take lots of photos (phone or digital camera) from several angles before and during disassembly and also as the parts are layed out in order as trevj suggests. Sometimes things go bump in the night and it is always good to have reference photos.
 
40-82 said:
Take lots of photos (phone or digital camera) from several angles before and during disassembly and also as the parts are layed out in order as trevj suggests. Sometimes things go bump in the night and it is always good to have reference photos.
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I was going to suggest that, good insurance , no matter what you're doing.

Grizz
 
There is an external oiling point on top of the gear case just for that main bearing behind the chuck,,, squirt some heavier oil in that bearing and see if it will chance the noise level.
Biggest mistake people make with these lathes is to not completely (and thoroughly) clean the gear box when the lathe is new and fill it with a good quality oil.
 
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Markit said:
If it isn’t the backlash I have the feeling this is going to suck big time. BOHICA with Chinese tools.
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It will only suck, if you insist on thinking that it will!
Live the adventure, and accept that you can, and sometimes will have to, do a few things as side jobs, to get there! :)

As for the Chinese tools, they are built to a price point so that guys that normally would never be able to afford a Lathe or Mill in their shop, can.
In the early '80's, South Bend (while they were still barely alive as a company) quoted me over $12K US, for a new basic 9 inch swing lathe, and at the end of their run, a few years after that, Myford was looking at $20K+ CDN for a new Super 7.

My suggestion would be to work through the manuals and any other info sources you can find, and sort out all the bearings you will need to have in hand, so that you can buy some decent brand name(SKF, ###, [<spelled Eff Ay Gee,its the company name!], etc.), and decent spec (not sure if the ABEC series applies to cup and cone bearings, ask the bearing shop guy) bearings so as to have the in hand when you tear the lathe down.

If you did not do so when you first got the lathe, this is a fine time to tear down the headstock and the gearbox, to clean out any of the usual sand and leftover swarf that the guys that put it together in China, did not see fit to properly clean out. Which may be a better explanation for a set of kacked bearings.
 
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These lathes are not difficult to take apart
If you have the skill to use a lathe, I’m confident that you have the skill to take one apart
Busy Bee will also repair the lathe and supply parts
Bearings are easily found. Bring the bearings to any bearing supply house and they will match them for you
If you don’t want the Busy Bee parts
 
Lightning Rod is right.

Busy Bee will supply the parts.

There really isn't a lot wrong with Chinese bearings these days, it all depends on the grade of bearings you purchase.

You can likely get a better grade of bearing at a local supplier than those supplied by Busy Bee, which would very likely be C2s from the factory at best. C1 grade will run much smoother but require a bit more care to set up proper clearances, which will be tighter.

You might want to consider going to a better grade of gear oil as well. I dumped the original oil in my gear boxes and replaced it with a good synthetic gear oil.

The synthetic helps to keep temperatures down when it's warm and remains more viscous when it's very cold.

Even with the synthetic oil, I run my shop at 10C until I'm going to use the machines, then crank up the thermostat to 20C. Mostly for my own comfort.
 
The lathe might not even have Chinese bearings in it. I recently tore my Mill-drill (mid 90's purchase, Chinese manufacture) down for a complete servicing and much to my surprise found top notch SKF bearings in the quill. re-grease & re-set the pre-load and that old Chinese machine has not much more than 1 thou run out on a locked quill (unlocked is around 4-5 thou).
 
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