Something I dont understand...

Rotaxpower

Rotaxpower

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I cant for the life of me figure out why some deer hunters shoot spikers. Why not shoot a doe? Is it so you can, say you got a buck?

Around here we have alote of does running around, and the buck situation is starting to thin out, even the spikers. Sure we still have some nice 5 pointers around, but if we got people keep shooting the spikers, what going to replace the big ones in 5 years?
I dunno, maybe I am way off base here. It just seem logical to me.
 
although we dont have a doe season in our area. I feel if we did, guys would still rather kill a 2 point buck, obviously just for the meat...now there is no half mature bucks around :mad:
 
here in quebec we are not permited to shoot a doe with a rifle, unless you get a doe in bow season or muzzle season which will end your deer season cause you are entitled one deer a year. Beleive me I would prefer to take a doe better than a buck cause the meat is better and it would garantee me a deer every year.:dancingbanana:
 
The one thing with shooting a doe is that you've got no idea how old it is. You see a spiker, you know he's tender. I've had a doe or two that might have been as old as I am, and that's 5 months of bad eating.

Fortunately for us out here, you can get a couple of doe tags over the counter - so I save the general tag for bigger deer and let spikes walk.
 
Plan A.......As long as its legal it can be hunted........get over it!

Plan B.......If Plan A is too difficult...I believe there is therapy to help you get over it....


hs4570.................your mileage may vary
 
Rotaxpower said:
I cant for the life of me figure out why some deer hunters shoot spikers. Why not shoot a doe? Is it so you can, say you got a buck?

Around here we have alote of does running around, and the buck situation is starting to thin out, even the spikers. Sure we still have some nice 5 pointers around, but if we got people keep shooting the spikers, what going to replace the big ones in 5 years?
I dunno, maybe I am way off base here. It just seem logical to me.
Click to expand...

If the buck to doe ratio is out of whack them taking a doe is a good idea for sure, but I wouldnt get to worried. I'm willing to bet there quite a few spikers left running around out there that didnt get shot.
 
Time to get mad at me but......

I've always seen taking a doe as killing three deer, the fawn she has and the one she would have had the next spring. Is there any proof that a 6 month old fawn can survive the winter by itself through the weather and predators without the doe being there? Even though they will yard up for the winter with the rest of the herd the fawn is pushed out by other doe's feeding at the same spots, I've seen it. The feeder outside my dads place has about 10 deer come in at the same times every night and theres a pecking order as to who eats first, usually it's the matriarch doe and it's fawn and then on down the list, usually leaving the orphaned does to get the scraps left over. Lately I've been putting out smaller piles in a circle pattern so there won't be so much kicking and chunks of fur flying all over the horseshoe pits.

Anyways, back to the subject. If you live in a well populated deer area then ya, taking does does do some good but the places where the MNR (in their infinite wisdom) gives out to many doe tags (St Joe Island) the herds mass drops like a rock in water and were left with nothing. Guys are actually having a hard time filling doe tags out here nowadays, when back in the day you could sit in your stand a have 12 does mulling around out in front of you and you waited for a buck to come in.

Just my .02 on this.
 
I don't buy doe tags. And if I did, probably wouldn't have gotten the 9 pointer this year as I would have shot the 3 does that walked out before him.

Personally, I've got nothing against shooting does, spikes or whatever. I myself don't shoot alot of deer, but I've been so close to them, I could almost take them with a knife!!

I guess I decided I wanted the ultimate challenge of chasing the old, smart trophys. It seems to be the biggest challenge, outsmarting one of the most in-tune animals in the woods.

NOW....if the freezer is completely empty and it's the end of the season....well....the finger will obviously be a little itchier!!
 
A doe? Why not.

Here in Qc, you need to apply for a doe tag, which I did and was lucky enough to get one :D . I was not fussy as a nice one came my way on ML season and took her. Nice size doe and very tender/tasty meat, it's awesome.

I think taking a doe and/or spike is a good thing especially on public land as you can't keep track of it. When you have a high ratio or does per buck, the rut is not as strong as the bucks have many many to choose from contrary when you have a low ratio of does per buck, then the rut becomes a lot better with more aggressives mature bucks fighting for the does, more rubs and srubs in the woods when you compare with a piece of land that have many does per buck. The calling and rattling also works a lot better with less does in the area.
They should allow more doe tags, maybe not up to 7 like some place in Ont :eek: but at least one extra doe tag on top of your regular (buck) license, that would be super as we have many of them in southern Qc, Outaouais region.

If you have access to a large private land, deer management would be easier and taking a spike would then not be good if you want to increase your "big buck" ratio, say like you take 6 pointers and up, nothing under but still take some does in between.

Understand that this is just my point of view and that I can be wrong but I think that it's a good practice.
 
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I shoot for meat not bone. So a spiker or fork (I think around here a fork is our "spiker" I've never seen a deer with just spikes in this part of the country) is a perfect deer for me. As for does, I tend to shoot the fawns out from under them instead of the doe itself. Otherwise I will shoot lone does who are usually not lactating (never liked the flavor of lactating doe). Between my neighbor and I we shot 8 deer this year -- two forkhorn mulie bucks, a forkhorn whitetail, a 300+ pound 5x5 white tail, a bump-buck mulie, two bump-buck whitetails, and doe fawn (we were looking for one with a glowing red nose to fill out the squadron but no dice).

The only deer that anyone said was a little gamey was the 5x5. I liked the slightly stronger flavor but many don't.

Will I pass up a big buck if it walks out? No. Of course not, but it's not the reason I hunt. I feel just as satisfied with a forker hanging from the rafters as with a large 4x4.
 
You have to consider the biology of your area. It's pretty complex, and you can't make any kind of 'general' statement that covers the whole country.

Consider this:

Any juvinile animal will consume a huge amount of the available food, and cannot reproduce. Many will not survive until the age where they can produce young. IF the population of younger animals is very high - this can dramatically affect the amount of food available for older animals.

A reduction in forage can also lead to weakness and death amongst the juviniles - if you have too many kids, a higher percent of the kids might die off - a few less kids and more may actually survive.

Killing a doe has the largest impact on how many fawns there will be the next year as maddog mentioned.


Now - keeping that stuff in mind, you can see where the ministry will examine the situation in each area.

If there are too many fawns being born - they may well decide to tell hunters to start taking out the does. This can lead to a higher SURVIVAL rate amonst the other fawns.

If there are just a FEW too many fawns, they may encourage people to take spikes. A few less juviniles and things get better, without massivley reducing the juvinile population.

If things are stable, they may restrict it to adult bucks. You can remove a fair number of adult bucks without necessarily affecting the birth rate the next year.

I'm giving the 'quick and dirty' simplistic view of things - but you can see it's a very complicated issue. Less deer born can actually mean MORE deer in the area in many cases - Or it can mean healthier, stronger and bigger deer (better food supply) who are more able to resist a bad winter.

It's up to the biologists and hunters in an area to figure out whats right for that area.
 
Foxer said:
You have to consider the biology of your area. It's pretty complex, and you can't make any kind of 'general' statement that covers the whole country.

Consider this:

Any juvinile animal will consume a huge amount of the available food, and cannot reproduce. Many will not survive until the age where they can produce young. IF the population of younger animals is very high - this can dramatically affect the amount of food available for older animals.

A reduction in forage can also lead to weakness and death amongst the juviniles - if you have too many kids, a higher percent of the kids might die off - a few less kids and more may actually survive.

Killing a doe has the largest impact on how many fawns there will be the next year as maddog mentioned.


Now - keeping that stuff in mind, you can see where the ministry will examine the situation in each area.

If there are too many fawns being born - they may well decide to tell hunters to start taking out the does. This can lead to a higher SURVIVAL rate amonst the other fawns.

If there are just a FEW too many fawns, they may encourage people to take spikes. A few less juviniles and things get better, without massivley reducing the juvinile population.

If things are stable, they may restrict it to adult bucks. You can remove a fair number of adult bucks without necessarily affecting the birth rate the next year.

I'm giving the 'quick and dirty' simplistic view of things - but you can see it's a very complicated issue. Less deer born can actually mean MORE deer in the area in many cases - Or it can mean healthier, stronger and bigger deer (better food supply) who are more able to resist a bad winter.

It's up to the biologists and hunters in an area to figure out whats right for that area.
Click to expand...

Good point Foxer, I didn't thought of that when I replied and it sure can make a huge difference depending where it is in practice.
 
well, unfortunately not all of us have the time or money to hunt all fall. I get one week a year to hunt. I take what comes out to me cause i don't know if i'll see anything else or not. And i have made the mistake of letting a spike go buy in hopes of a larger buck or doe, to not seeing anything the rest of the hunt. I shot at a spike this past season and missed, only to have a nice 8 pointer walk out an hour later in the same spot. I think someone was blessing me to miss the first one.
 
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