Stoking the Lee Metford

Noel

Noel

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I would like to use this old girl. It still retains alot of the rifling, considering it was built in 1892 and it even has the full 30" tube.
I did a quick search of the net and found some info saying smokless powder will eat up the barrel in short order, which is why they switched to the Enfield barrel. It has seven light lands in the barrel which are not perfect but should still put a spin on things.
I would like to duplicate the origonal load for at the range as well as a nostalgia hunt once in awhile since it has been in the family for four generations now.

Will cast lead with a gas check work better than a jacketed patch?
I would sure like to stick with smokless powder to avoid the pain of cleaning the bore after every use.

Any help is greatly appreciated!
Noel
 
you should be alright with light loads of quick powder. I'm in the process of restoring an 1871 vetterlli rifle and I have found loads for it driving a 305 grain cast paper patch with 8-12 grains of unique. I relalize that this isn't a definitive answer but it shows that these old girls can be made to shoot! Good on you for wanting to!:)
 
The original cordite consisted of 58% nitroglycerine and 37% nitrocellulose. This was about the hottest burning propellant ever used which caused the rapid erosion of the Metford barrels. The formula was later changed to 58% nitrocellulose and 37% nitroglycerine (Cordite MD) which prolonged barrel life. Current smokeless burns much cooler than cordite.
In my experience cast bullets no matter how hard strip at velocities over 1200fps in Metford barrels.
 
Thanks gents, just the info I needed to hear!
Looks like I will try to find some 215 jacketed bullets and put some 3031 behind it.
I cant wait to try the volley sites with a real big target and a good rest, it is hard to imagine hitting anything with them mounted off to the side of the rifle like they are. I guess it was a strength in numbers equasion.

If there are any other load ideas out there I am all ears.

Cheers,
Noel
 
Noel said:
I would like to use this old girl. It still retains alot of the rifling, considering it was built in 1892 and it even has the full 30" tube.
I did a quick search of the net and found some info saying smokless powder will eat up the barrel in short order, which is why they switched to the Enfield barrel. It has seven light lands in the barrel which are not perfect but should still put a spin on things.
I would like to duplicate the origonal load for at the range as well as a nostalgia hunt once in awhile since it has been in the family for four generations now.

Will cast lead with a gas check work better than a jacketed patch?
I would sure like to stick with smokless powder to avoid the pain of cleaning the bore after every use.

Any help is greatly appreciated!
Noel
Click to expand...
The origional L_M loads where black powder. This is how it is described in "The Lee Enfield Story":
The charge consists of 71.5(+ or- 2.5) grains of the ordinary description of gunpowder, and is pressed into the form of a pellet with both ends slightly rounded.
Click to expand...

A smokeless propellant was not approved untill Nov. 3/1891.
Hope this helps!
 
From Rifle Magazine (Wolfe Publishing), March 2000 issue, ".303 British and .30-40 Krag: Turn-of-the-century classics" article by Ross Seyfried, wherein is describesd a mathematical formula for converting charge weight of cordite to the appropriate charge weight of Reloader 15: simply multiply the cordite charge weight (in grains) by a constant of 1.19 to get the appropriate charge weight of RL15. This is the same formula that knowledgeable handloaders have been using for years to load for the old Nitro-Express rounds. And one gets the added bonus of using a very temperature stable, cool-burning smokeless powder, namely RL15.

Seyfried goes on to detail that the original 215gr .303 service round contained 31 grains of cordite, which using the above noted formula, results in a substitute charge of 36.9 grains of RL15. The article adds that depending on the barrel, this charge can result in velocities of between 1950 and 2125 fps with a 215gr Woodleigh bullet. If need be, the charge can be increased up to 38 grains to get the specified 2050 fps of the original service load.

I hope this will help.

jc
 
Once again the boy's pull through!
I have some 174 bulk bullets to shoot for the interm and will try out the new recipe as soon as I can.
Gibbs505, I would assume since this rifle here is stamped 1892 it would be approved for the smokless powder, am I right? From what I have read it was developed to be used with the new smokeless and still burn black powder, hence the shallow rifling lands designed to resist the fouling of black powder.

Jaycee, I seem to recall that article, now that you have mentioned it. Sure is handy to have a modern powder that can still do an old job.

Thanks guys!
Noel
 
Noel said:
Once again the boy's pull through!
I have some 174 bulk bullets to shoot for the interm and will try out the new recipe as soon as I can.
Gibbs505, I would assume since this rifle here is stamped 1892 it would be approved for the smokless powder, am I right? From what I have read it was developed to be used with the new smokeless and still burn black powder, hence the shallow rifling lands designed to resist the fouling of black powder.

Jaycee, I seem to recall that article, now that you have mentioned it. Sure is handy to have a modern powder that can still do an old job.

Thanks guys!
Noel
Click to expand...
Not Necessarilly!!Some of the Metford barreled rifles were never rebarreled! If your rifle is not rebarreled please do not shoot the smokless rounds in it as there could be damage to the rifleing!
Even though the action should be strong enough!
If you read Skennerton's book, there was a long drawn out 'growing' process for these rifles!
 
Gibbs, is there any specific place I can go to find out about this Skennerton Book?
Any particular stamps I should look for?
This rifle has so many markings on it I would not be suprised if they used it for the testing of the loads and marked it for what tests they put it through.

Or maybe they were just trying out new style stamps on it to see which ones looked better.;)

Uncle Den had been firing factory loads through it for most likely it's whole life, I recieved a 1/2 full box of Winchester silver tips with the firearm. I doubt it was ever fired much, the box is from the 60's or 70's I am guessing.
 
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