Styer HS 50

ATR
What scopes do you recommend? I was looking to get a Horus vision systems scope the Falcon in particular. Thy claim that it will be able to reach out to 2,500 yards. What about scope rings? I think you cant just go out and buy any rings on the shelf and expect it to hold up.

P.S.
I am sorry if I offended you in my previous post that was not my intention, you are right I need "some sorting out" I know nothing about long range shooting and is some thing I would like to get in to.
 
Try Badger Ordnance, they are supposed to make good strong .50 cal capable rings :)

ETA

their "Max 50 Scope rings" would be it them.

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Awesome pictures. Thanks for posting them. You don't necessarily need to go all out with rings on a 50. The recoil isn't what everyone expects. Though the Badgers are nice, they limit how much scope travel you have for eye relief because of the three screw system, which I think is serious overkill. You're not trying to hold a fighter jet on the ground with the rings. A set of TPS or Nightforce are more then enough to keep a scope on a 50. A lot of people think they have to torque the ever living sh!t out of the scope rings and that's not the case. If there wasn't so much surface contact with these types of 'Tactical' rings, it might be a different story. We don't even use locktight, blue or red to keep the rings on our guns in place. That might be a preference of ours but again we haven't found it's necessary.
 
Scharfschütze said:
ATR
What scopes do you recommend? I was looking to get a Horus vision systems scope the Falcon in particular. Thy claim that it will be able to reach out to 2,500 yards. What about scope rings? I think you cant just go out and buy any rings on the shelf and expect it to hold up.

P.S.
I am sorry if I offended you in my previous post that was not my intention, you are right I need "some sorting out" I know nothing about long range shooting and is some thing I would like to get in to.
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I'll throw out my personal experiences with optics for you to consider.

When I started out shooting, I was very much budget minded. I was furtunate enough that I started out with calibers small enough that using less expensive optics didn't pose a problem with the recoil beating the optics to peaces.

As I gained experience, I also had the opportunity to look through some more expensive, better made optics (Nightforce, Leopold, Schmidt & Bender, etc). First thing noted is that the glass is WAY better (This can be subjective to the users eye so make sure you get behind one before dropping $1500 to $3500 on one). Once you start using a higher end scope you also note repeatability is better (retaining zero etc).

Now, consider that your looking at mounting this on a .50BMG. Muzzle brake or not, that monster produces recoil and thus viabrations.

My personal suggestion would be something in the range of a Leupold MK4, Nightforce NXS series, US Optics, and Schmidt Bender. (USO and Schmidt Bender are about twice the price of the Leupold or NF).


Hope thats some food for thought, :D
 
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If on a budget, the Elite 3200 10X and Super snipers will work. Lots of elevation. Quite useable optics. The Elite is offered by Barrett on their factory rifles.

With more money, the Elite 4200 scopes and Nikon tactical/monarch X work great, have superb optics and reliable mechanicals. All of these are under $1000.

Key is making sure the scope is AIR GUN SAFE.

From there, just bring green....

For rings, if properly installed, the Burris rings are more then adequate for a braked BMG. The actual recoil pulse is like a 12ga SG. The reason for using super mondo rings is because the scopes being held weigh upwards of 3.5lbs.

A typical scope of 20ish ozs can be held with regular quality sporting rings.

Remember that dangerous game boomers have been using standard rings forever (albeit holding down 'light' scopes) and these recoil several times more then a BMG.

As for BMG accuracy, they are now starting to get into the 1/2 MOA range at 1000yds with regularity. This is BR type rifles. Your typical mil spec rifle doesn't have to drive tacks and accuracy reflects this.

Bullets are also typically made to mil specs not match specs. The Hornady Amax, Barnes and a few boutique makers are it for the accuracy nut. Most shooters make do with pulled and reconditioned machine gun bullets.

Given the projectile, they surprised me with how well they did shoot.

Small bore rifles are significantly more accurate due in large part to reasonable costs allowing for proper development and lots of quality match bullets to test with.

But there is something quite devilish in igniting 10 times as much powder as in a 223 with the pull of a trigger.

Jerry
 
F22_RaptoR said:
Try Badger Ordnance, they are supposed to make good strong .50 cal capable rings :)

ETA

their "Max 50 Scope rings" would be it them.

306-11.jpg
Click to expand...

6 screws is very hard to get even torque on, impossible in fact, which is why the race car engine builders use 2 bolt main blocks.
The recoil from a 50 is not significant enough to require HUGE rings, the scopes do vibrate some, probably more than smaller calibers will create, but mounting is the least of the issues. Cheap scopes can and do rattle apart internally far more frequently than mounts ever do.

As for what my preference is on scopes for a 50, all of mine (I own several for some reason) wear Nightforce 8x32x56s.
Yes you can use the Bushnels that Jerry is so fond of, they will work well, but how can you figure to hit something a mile away if you can't see it with 10 power.
Leupolds work well, so do the S&Bs and USOs.
The key to selecting the right optic is getting the right amount of magnification for the job intended, and having enough moa of vertical adjustment to get there.
50s are NOT flat shooting, just very predictable in trajectory, the mistake I see so often is guys buying big magnification without enough elevation, or having the option of plus moa rails available.
 
alberta tactical rifle said:
6 screws is very hard to get even torque on, impossible in fact, which is why the race car engine builders use 2 bolt main blocks.
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HAHA, you have to be kidding. What form of racing are you talking about? For example look at any NHRA car with an engine making 700 or more horsepower, lets say from 10.90 bracket and faster. Pretty near everyone is using splayed 4 bolt blocks. Some 2 bolt blocks might have marginally thicker webs than a 4 bolt block, but we are talking stock production blocks here. I'm perplexed as to how thousands of guys racing using 4 bolt DART blocks manage without any difficulty to get even torques on the mains?? The LS1, LS2, LS6, LS7 etc. all use 6 bolt mains. Coincidentaly Top Fuel TFX blocks use 6 bolt mains holding it together with 7000 hp, and I'm quite certain they get even torques on them as does GM on their LS series motors.

I'm not disputing your knowledge of long range rifles but your statement on race motors is flat wrong.
 
With most BMGs happy to hit 2 moa at far distances, a 10X with good resolution would be plenty to engage such a target. Makes seeing the misses easier too.

I hope you guys wake up real early so we can find out how much mag you really need at extreme distances.

Don't get me wrong, I like higher mag too and usually shoot at 24X but most will never go past 1000yds, let along 1 mile so mag is really moot. I am also aiming at very small objects that far out.

A milk jug at 1000yds is easily viewed even with the lesser optics of the elite 3200.

Considering Barrett offers these as a package scope, He doesn't expect most to shoot that far with his rifles either.

What exactly would be the point of a 20ish long barrel in BMG?

Maybe, it is even shorter....

Jerry
 
757Fixer said:
HAHA, you have to be kidding. What form of racing are you talking about? For example look at any NHRA car with an engine making 700 or more horsepower, lets say from 10.90 bracket and faster. Pretty near everyone is using splayed 4 bolt blocks. Some 2 bolt blocks might have marginally thicker webs than a 4 bolt block, but we are talking stock production blocks here. I'm perplexed as to how thousands of guys racing using 4 bolt DART blocks manage without any difficulty to get even torques on the mains?? The LS1, LS2, LS6, LS7 etc. all use 6 bolt mains. Coincidentaly Top Fuel TFX blocks use 6 bolt mains holding it together with 7000 hp, and I'm quite certain they get even torques on them as does GM on their LS series motors.

I'm not disputing your knowledge of long range rifles but your statement on race motors is flat wrong.
Click to expand...

I confess I am not wholly up on the latest race car engine building, but was told by an engineer who worked for McLaren and Cosworth at various times, I have known this gent for many years and trust his knowledge, that most of the real high revving F1 class engines were 2 bolt, con rods and mains, and that during assembly a matched pair of torque wrenchs are used simultaneously to torque rods and cranks.
His explanation of torqueing bolts in series makes sense to me. If you have ever torqued small torque value bolts or screws as soon as you have 2 or 3 torqued the rest loosen so you continue to go from bolt to bolt trying to get them as close as possible. When dealing with 100 plus FT lbs of torque to be off by a few is not normally a huge deal, but in INCH lbs it can be significant.
I have tried this with assorted multi fastener devices and found it impossible to get exactly the same torque on all bolts at the same time, maybe I am missing something and am open to suggestions.
 
Scharfschütze said:
ATR
What scopes do you recommend? I was looking to get a Horus vision systems scope the Falcon in particular. Thy claim that it will be able to reach out to 2,500 yards. What about scope rings? I think you cant just go out and buy any rings on the shelf and expect it to hold up.

P.S.
I am sorry if I offended you in my previous post that was not my intention, you are right I need "some sorting out" I know nothing about long range shooting and is some thing I would like to get in to.
Click to expand...

No offense taken, I just thought you figured my customs were more expensive than they are.
 
MPI said:
How does the AMSD Nemesis compare to the Accuracy International AW50 (Not the AS50)?
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Not sure I have never had an opportunity to shoot an AW.
I suspect that being as the AI rifles are both battel rifles the tolerances would be more forgiving due to the nature of their intended usage. The Nemesis is more a target rifle.

Jerry I am at a loss on what use a short barrel like that would be as well. I have a 28" barrel 50 and I think that is about as short as I would think useful for any distance shooting.
Maybe a 20" barreled 50 cal rifle is considered an entry or close combat rifle??:confused:
 
Did a quick flip through the Barrett mags and yes, the short barreled BMG's have a very useful purpose.

Short range anti material useage. Things like detonating IED's, stopping approaching vehicle threats, stopping boats.

I see them used at check points, coast guard (even heli's), thrown on top of APC/Hummers next to the 40mm grenade launchers.

Not so crazy afterall.

Also, in the suppressed application, having a shorter pipe with an 18" can makes sense. A 28/30" pipe w/ a can would look like a civil war musket (taller then some soldiers) and make manuevering tough.

I think in terms of LR shooting but most BMG's are used within a city block.

Sometimes you just need a big hunk of lead to get the job done.

Jerry
 
This has sure turned into an interesting debate. The next time I'm looking through my scope at a target at 1000yds, I'm going to take a picture at 10x and then at 22x just so that people can actually see what they're looking at, at that distance.
 
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Currently have a Fixed 10 X Swarovski ontop of the PGW 50 I have. I is quite clear and I managed a 14" group my first time out with it at 1000 with an experimental load. BUT ,,,,,, I'd love to have more Mag. so I can see the bull better, Considering swapping my Tactical Bushnell 24X to see if it,ll take it. I'm currently looking at a nightforce (br) for a 6 PPC and poss. an NXS for the 6 BR.

M.
 
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