Swedish mausers
- Thread starter Saskabush25
- Start date
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They are in demand, but the supply is pretty robust which means sale prices are not particularly high. I'd ballpark it around $400. Actually, looking at what Intersurplus has for sale, $400 might be too high.
https://intersurplus.com/collections/6-5-x-55
https://intersurplus.com/collections/6-5-x-55
- Location
- Western Manitoba
I have several Swede Mauser's here in various stages of building into "sporters" - most all of that got put on "pause" when I got a Winchester Model 70 in 6.5x55
I have owned a few over the years and currently have two in military configuration. As sporters go, even with a good aftermarket stock, 3=4 hundred is not out of line. As versatile as the calibre is and if it is truly a 1/2 moa rifle, I would keep it. Getting something else that shoots that good could be a bit of a challenge.
As much as I like Swede Mausers, once I went to a "modern" action, then loaded the cartridge to its full potential, the milsurps became safe queens as far as hunting rifles go.
I had over thirty different variants, of Swede Mausers, most of the variations were miniscule, such as SA stamps, sights, stock wood, band stamps, models, etc.
I thought I was over "collecting" them, because I sold all of them off, due to lack of use/interest, but Huskydude, had one in Salmon Arm at a reasonable price, so purchased it "just because I liked it"
I wouldn't feel the least bit undergunned with a sporterized Swede Mauser, chambered for the 6.5x55, but the Tikka T3 shoots as well or better than most of them, fits extremely well and just does the job a bit better all around.
I had an export M94 chambered for the 7x57 Mauser, which I later regretted selling, but most folks don't even realize those rifles were made.
I've seen the actions used to build 8x57, 30-06, 7x57, 9.3x57 and a myriad of other cartridges. I even saw one converted to the venerable 22 Hornet, by some European craftsman. I would have loved to purchase that beautiful rifle, but its owner was passing it on to his son.
Swede Mauser variants are what they are. When they are in new or fresh FTR condition, they are dreams to shoot and handle. When they're well used and have worn bores, they can be tedious beasts at best.
We've been spoiled in Canada with having the best of the Swede Mausers to choose from, before they were dispersed to the rest of the world surplus market, other than a "special batch" International sent on to the US. Most of those were M96 configuration rifles. Nothing special about them, other than they were all very early "Mauser" marked variants, which had been stored in their crates since received by Sweden from German factories.
Sadly, we got the lesser grades of those, but we got first dibs on all the other variants, even the early M94s and M40s.
International brought everything into Canada, first, for grade selection, refurbishment if needed and stripped many new in grease rifles down to "sporterize" them.
Beautifully machined and finished, they rivaled many of the commercial sporters of the time back in the mid seventies.
Yupp. If it shoots half-MOA I wouldn't part with it. Not gonna find another half-MOA rifle for that price, you can't even get a Savage Axis for that cheap these days.
I agree with you regarding the early rifles. I have a 1900 Obendorf, everything about it is "just like new" from the condition of the stock to the blueing and satin polished bright bolt. Best trigger I have ever experienced on a military rifle. My M38 is is a great rifle in fine condition also, but the trigger is what you would expect: Long two stage, heavy, but crisp. My hunting rig is a Zastava M70 6.5 x 55 SE. While it is designed for modern, high pressure loads; the standard loads I have been making for years have ample power and give me exceptional accuracy from it as well. Interestingly, I load Sierra 85 gr HP (now discontinued, but I still have a box left) for groundhog, and I load PP 158 RNSP to the upper end of the "standard" loads. Both shoot within a 1/2" of each other at 100 yards without adjusting the scope. I have used 110 and 140 gr bullets as well, and they all shoot to the same point of aim at 100. How many other calibres can do this?
- Location
- Western Manitoba
Other calibers - not sure if it is the cartridge or the rifle? When my Dad passed about 15 years ago, his 30-06 rifle and the ammo stash for it came to me - I fired off all the rounds at 100 yard target - two or three rounds each weight - all factory rounds - various brands - Remington, Winchester, even some elder Imperial - the 165 grain and 180 grain spitzers, and the 200 grain and 220 grain round nose all clustered about size of palm of your hand - all landing "close enough" together to be about deer heart size group at that range - the 3 or four shots with Remington factory 150 grain made their own group a bit higher and to the right of the rest. The rifle had been "farmer sported" in 1948 - including hack sawing about 4 inches off the barrel - it was an M1917, so originally made in WWI - 1917 or 1918. The maker logo had been ground off at some point - I have no clue if it was made by Eddystone, Remington or Winchester. Is likely a bazillion similar across Canada - no doubt they were "very cheap" to acquire after WWII. I had installed a Weaver side-mount base to it, and we installed a Tasco 1.5-5 variable scope on it circa 1980 - I do not think Dad ever changed that thing from 3X in all the years he used it. The original rear sight mount had been removed with angle grinder - likely when the top of front receiver ring was also ground and the maker logo went away. Serial number still there, though.
Similar or overlapping 100 yd POA and POI points with various weight bullets is not that uncommon, no matter which caliber or bullet weight used, as long as velocities are close.
That's not surprising.
If your rifle is shooting extremely different POIs at 100, then something else is awry, such as extreme velocity differences between the different bullet weights.
Once you stretch that out to 200yds, then the different POIs become less subtle, and increase as range increases.
I do agree with Meroh, the 6.5 caliber does seem to behave itself very well and for the most part, in good rifles doesn't deviate unless there is a relatively extreme change made to the loads.
When we used to load "light" for caliber bullets into our rifles to use on Grouse or Bunnies, we were very careful to hand load those rounds to be as close to the velocities of our regular hunting loads as we could manage. This usually produced very reliable/consistent results so we could use the same sight settings on our scopes or irons, without having to involve "Kentucky windage"
Potashminer, the ammo your father had, very likely shot to POA or close to it with factory loads, simply because those loads were regulated for specific twist rates at similar velocities with all of the bullet weights. This used to be a common practice throughout the industry.
The commercial loaders pretty much used very similar, if not the same components for their loads and they were put together to perform well, for the standards of the day, in most rifles. They did the job quite well, as you noticed.
Over the past 15-20 years, commercial ammo has come a long way, pressures and velocities are still relatively similar across the board, but components are mostly much better than they ever were and getting better every year.
As this continues, we no longer appreciate rifles or hand loads that are "acceptable for hunting purposes out to reasonable ranges"
Many of us here can still remember the days when 4 inch groups at 100 yds indicated a pretty good hunting rifle. Then that standard changed to 2 inches and now it's down to 1 inch at 100yds or in many cases less. I know folks who refuse to own rifles which won't shoot into less than a minute of angle at any range.
Today's modern machine processes on CNC machines or the one offs by skilled tradesmen have made all of this possible.
However, there are still a lot of the older firearms out there, which just aren't capable of such accuracy and never were, with standard commercial components. I can still see my old friend Walt, swaging his own bullets for his beloved No1 MkIII Lithgow, with a .316 bore, because it was almost impossible to find bullets of that diameter, and CIL only made them to .315, then jumped to .318 diameters.
His swaging dies were homemade, back in the day when he was a REME. He didn't make his own bullets, but swaged down .318 diameter bullets, intended for the 7.9x57J round. They were only available in 196 grain.
Now bullets are made to much closer tolerances. Even thick jacket, heavy hitters have jacket thicknesses so consistent you can set your micrometer by them.
The 6.5x55 Swede is not immune to these improvements and just gets better with every positive development.
The Swedes and other manufactures, especially European, figured out that if they kept tolerances as close to zero as possible, their rifles would shoot consistently well.
I've never run across a Swede Mauser, chambered for the 6.5, which had an oversize or undersize bore from the factory. That doesn't mean they don't exist. I've got a couple of NOS M94 Swede Mauser barrels with 1915 dates, which measure out perfectly.
I've found the same with many 8x57JS Mausers, French Lebels, Kropatscheks, etc.
That's not surprising.
If your rifle is shooting extremely different POIs at 100, then something else is awry, such as extreme velocity differences between the different bullet weights.
Once you stretch that out to 200yds, then the different POIs become less subtle, and increase as range increases.
I do agree with Meroh, the 6.5 caliber does seem to behave itself very well and for the most part, in good rifles doesn't deviate unless there is a relatively extreme change made to the loads.
When we used to load "light" for caliber bullets into our rifles to use on Grouse or Bunnies, we were very careful to hand load those rounds to be as close to the velocities of our regular hunting loads as we could manage. This usually produced very reliable/consistent results so we could use the same sight settings on our scopes or irons, without having to involve "Kentucky windage"
Potashminer, the ammo your father had, very likely shot to POA or close to it with factory loads, simply because those loads were regulated for specific twist rates at similar velocities with all of the bullet weights. This used to be a common practice throughout the industry.
The commercial loaders pretty much used very similar, if not the same components for their loads and they were put together to perform well, for the standards of the day, in most rifles. They did the job quite well, as you noticed.
Over the past 15-20 years, commercial ammo has come a long way, pressures and velocities are still relatively similar across the board, but components are mostly much better than they ever were and getting better every year.
As this continues, we no longer appreciate rifles or hand loads that are "acceptable for hunting purposes out to reasonable ranges"
Many of us here can still remember the days when 4 inch groups at 100 yds indicated a pretty good hunting rifle. Then that standard changed to 2 inches and now it's down to 1 inch at 100yds or in many cases less. I know folks who refuse to own rifles which won't shoot into less than a minute of angle at any range.
Today's modern machine processes on CNC machines or the one offs by skilled tradesmen have made all of this possible.
However, there are still a lot of the older firearms out there, which just aren't capable of such accuracy and never were, with standard commercial components. I can still see my old friend Walt, swaging his own bullets for his beloved No1 MkIII Lithgow, with a .316 bore, because it was almost impossible to find bullets of that diameter, and CIL only made them to .315, then jumped to .318 diameters.
His swaging dies were homemade, back in the day when he was a REME. He didn't make his own bullets, but swaged down .318 diameter bullets, intended for the 7.9x57J round. They were only available in 196 grain.
Now bullets are made to much closer tolerances. Even thick jacket, heavy hitters have jacket thicknesses so consistent you can set your micrometer by them.
The 6.5x55 Swede is not immune to these improvements and just gets better with every positive development.
The Swedes and other manufactures, especially European, figured out that if they kept tolerances as close to zero as possible, their rifles would shoot consistently well.
I've never run across a Swede Mauser, chambered for the 6.5, which had an oversize or undersize bore from the factory. That doesn't mean they don't exist. I've got a couple of NOS M94 Swede Mauser barrels with 1915 dates, which measure out perfectly.
I've found the same with many 8x57JS Mausers, French Lebels, Kropatscheks, etc.
Use to have a soft spot for these 96's, then picked up a few S&L M69's, basically a K98 with their barrel on it, which got me looking into the history of Scandinavian target shooting.
Swedes did everything they could to modify these to compete against the Danes, CG63, CG80, even using S&L barrels, couldn't match the Danes.
Lock time was a big difference, receiver design as well, but yes, in original not modified condition, very sweet shooting issued rifle.
Then zee Germans got serious, and they all shoot Anschutz since the 90's.
Swedes did everything they could to modify these to compete against the Danes, CG63, CG80, even using S&L barrels, couldn't match the Danes.
Lock time was a big difference, receiver design as well, but yes, in original not modified condition, very sweet shooting issued rifle.
Then zee Germans got serious, and they all shoot Anschutz since the 90's.
I have a "Turk" large ring 98 receiver with small ring threads, which just happen to match the threads on the tenon of Swede 96 Mauser barrels.
I torqued it up and took it out to the range, just to see how well it would do. In that receiver, it handles much higher pressures easily and is quite accurate.
