Teach me to shoot better!! Which Milsurp?

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thepitchedlink

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So I've decided that I'm not that good a shot yet and need some serious practise. I've just gotten back into the shooting sports and hunting this year, just missed a beautie buck the other night. Been shooting a 22 and my Ruger 30-06, but need to shoot more and better. The Ruger bugs me a bit for practise as the barrell heats so much and needs to cool between shots. Not that eager to shoot out the barrell of my good hunting guns either. I was thinking of getting a milsurp and would be good pracitise and cheaper to shoot. I am learning to reload as well.
I was all set to order a Norinco 305 but I'm wondering if that really is what I want. Looks like a gun that requires lots of maintenance to keep it going, yet it has quite a following in the shooting world. How 'bout a K98 or Swedish Mauser in 6.5, they look OK and are fairly cheap. I'd like to shoot open sights as well as with optics . Any thoughts...gotta get better.
 
I think you are right on with the m305. There are multiple options for it regarding optics as well as good iron sights already on it. As well, you have a wide selection of components for .308 to reload for it or you can (usually, not now) find reasonably cheap 7.62 Nato surplus for plinking. I don't think they are that bad as far as maintenance, not any worse than any other semi auto milsurp. Maybe a Garand in .308 also?

You could also grab an SKS for the cheapest ammo out there but the M305 will more than likely shoot much better than it.

I love K98's but mounting choices for optics for them are limited besides IER scout mounts. I find K98 irons very accurate and great for target shooting but a lot of guys hate them. If you did like the feel and the sights on K98's, I would go with one that was converted to 7.62 Nato by the Israeli's post war. You would get all the benefits listed above for the M305 regarding ammo that way.
 
Most milsurps are not going to come set up for a scope - especially not inexpensively.

One gun you might want to look at is a Swiss K31. They shoot great and if you reload, ammo is not a problem. Also, there are decent receiver-mount scope setups available aftermarket that just go right on without gunsmithing.

For most Mauser-style guns you'll either have to pay for a drill and tap job (shudder) or get a long eye relief scope and a scout mount - not the best solution for a beginner.
 
Your 30-06 will go 4000-5000 round before you wear out the barrel to less than minute-of-deer accuracy. Just don't get the barrel too hot. You may be better off going with a .223 that is more likely to shoot accurately than any milsurp rifle. But then again you won't be much cheaper shooting then your .22
 
there are plenty of bubba'd rifles out there already set up for otics. sportered P14/M17 or a bubba'd No.4 would be a good bet.
 
If you want to shoot more than a few hundred rounds and not reloading, then consider the price of ammo. Count on $15 to $20 per box of 20 unless you find surplus.

Milsurps are only cheaper to shoot if you can find surplus ammo. If you really want to do a fair bit of shooting then find a source of ammo FIRST and then get a rifle for the ammo. If you shoot a lot (of commercial ammo) then the cost of the rifle is minor compared to the ammo cost.

Right now that tends to limit you to 7.62x39. As I understand, even 7.62x54R is becoming difficult to find and there is almost no 303, or 8mm Mauser anymore.

Get a 223 or stay with a 22LR
 
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To improve your shooting, you need a rifle and ammo combination that has the following characteristics:

- Very accurate. You must have confidence in your equipment and know that you can judge you progress from what is happening on the target rather than chasing errors that are actually the gun or ammo.

- Cheap to practice with. Usually, the difference between a good shooter and a mediocre shooter is well-spent trigger time, and a truckload of ammo.

- Low recoil. Perfect practice makes perfect and you will be teaching yourself bad habits if you are getting beaten up by your rifle, are flinching and anticipating recoil. Most milsurps are heavy recoiling rifles. The marksmanship skills you develop on a light recoiling rifle will come natural when you have to fire shots from the heavier caliber gun.

Based on these criteria, I agree with robsmith and maynard about the .22 or .223 being good choices.
If you must shoot a milsurp, there are many sporterized Swedish Mausers out there at reasonable cost that are both accurate, have low recoil and already have scope mounts or aperature sights put on them. These could be affordable to shoot if you reload.
 
Quiet said:
To improve your shooting, you need a rifle and ammo combination that has the following characteristics:

- Very accurate. You must have confidence in your equipment and know that you can judge you progress from what is happening on the target rather than chasing errors that are actually the gun or ammo.

- Cheap to practice with. Usually, the difference between a good shooter and a mediocre shooter is well-spent trigger time, and a truckload of ammo.

- Low recoil. Perfect practice makes perfect and you will be teaching yourself bad habits if you are getting beaten up by your rifle, are flinching and anticipating recoil. Most milsurps are heavy recoiling rifles. The marksmanship skills you develop on a light recoiling rifle will come natural when you have to fire shots from the heavier caliber gun.

Based on these criteria, I agree with robsmith and maynard about the .22 or .223 being good choices.
If you must shoot a milsurp, there are many sporterized Swedish Mausers out there at reasonable cost that are both accurate, have low recoil and already have scope mounts or aperature sights put on them. These could be affordable to shoot if you reload.
Click to expand...

Good suggestions here.

The Swedish mauser barrel is really quite heavy compared to other milsurps chambered in the 30 calibers (or .310, .311, or 7.92's) and should be able to shoot for longer without overheating.
 
Well I will add my 2 cents


You can get a P17, the same .30-06 that you are shooting now, and just reload to keep the cost down. The only thing is that a bubba P17 is not a pretty rifle.

The other option is something like a Swiss K31 that uses the same .308 diameter bullets you are using now. They are very accurate, fun to shoot, and brass would be the only thing different then what you are using now.


The only other piece of advice I can give you to become a better shot is, use the bench to sight in a scope on a rifle, or to test a load only. Stop using the bench for practice. Shoot prone, sitting, and kneeling. There are no benches in the bush.

I have seen many shooters at milshoots get great groups during the sight in off a bench. But when it comes time to shoot the match, standing, kneeling, prone, or sitting, their shots are all over the page like buckshot.

One shooter at the end of a match said it best, " I gotta stop being a bench #####!"

Sticker
 
This last piece of advice from STICKER is actually what I think I was really getting at. I need to shoot more and from different positions, not always off the bench. The recoil of the '06 goes down quite a bit off the bench too. Might have to get a Swede 6.5 just 'cause they look like fun!!
 
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