Terrible groups at 100? Great Group at 200+? WTF

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xopher

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I started reloading with a few buddies and we took a few of our loads out for some testing yesterday. Our plan is to find some to accurate loads for shooting up to 1000 yards on crown land. In the past, we used factory match grade ammo with very consistent results on gongs at 400 yards.

While testing a few of our experimental loads, all 3 of us, using 3 different rifles, performed terribly at 100 yards.

We got fed up shortly after and decided to try testing at 200 yards. Immediately, we noticed the groupings to noticeably close up.

Is it normal for a round to perform better/more consistent at further ranges?
 
I have 2 rifles with fixed 7 power scopes that shoot the same at 200 as 100.
Without reducing parralax or even finer cross hairs(mine are like ropes!) you won't get the full potential of the rifle and load. I like to make targets with printer paper and a black marker. Make one spot to aim at in the middle as small as you can see through the scope.
 
Long, heavy for caliber, high BC target bullets, fired through faster twist barrels, can at times need to fly a ways, before they stabilize and lose their yaw, wobble and begin "going to sleep".

Some of my 6.5x55mm loads print similar size groups at 200 as at 100.
 
Did you clean between the 100 and 200 tests? I've had a several rifles that performed much better when the bore was fouled. If the bore was clean for the 100 tests but fouled for the 200 groups, you may have that condition. I think even David Tubb has said after cleaning it could take several rounds(10+) to get the bore "conditioned". If you're changing components, especially powder, the bore may need to be fouled with that load before it performs to its potential. I've also noticed that my own performance improves as I shoot. I shoot mostly prone and the first 5-10 rounds down the tube are not nearly as good the next 50 or so. I never bench test until I've had at least 10 rounds down the range but perhaps that's just me. Ask some guys that shoot trap it they'd ever go to a competition and not shoot a warm up round first. Just a thought.
 
xopher said:
I started reloading with a few buddies and we took a few of our loads out for some testing yesterday. Our plan is to find some to accurate loads for shooting up to 1000 yards on crown land. In the past, we used factory match grade ammo with very consistent results on gongs at 400 yards.

While testing a few of our experimental loads, all 3 of us, using 3 different rifles, performed terribly at 100 yards.

We got fed up shortly after and decided to try testing at 200 yards. Immediately, we noticed the groupings to noticeably close up.

Is it normal for a round to perform better/more consistent at further ranges?
Click to expand...

This is actually much more common than many realize, you will probably find they shoot even better a 300 mtrs. It is refered to as the bullet "going to sleep". 1000 yrd shooters are very familiar with this phenomenon. I didn't believe it at first when I heard of it but I have seen it with my own eyes. One of our quite accomplished shooters here, who also shoots 1000 yd, shot one afternoon and showed me his targets, 2" at 100 mtrs (no hell I thought), then his 200 mtr target, guess what 2", now that's more like it, then his 300 mtr target and guess what 1.8" now I'm going WOW. He asked me if I'd ever seen anything like that before, and I had to admit I had not.
I have discussed this with several knowlegable people and it would appear that these bullets are over spun and initially unstable but as range increases and velocity decreases they settle in or "go to sleep".
 
Parallax or stabilization or voodoo chickenfoot, could be all of them though DON'T STAB THE DOLL !@#!@#$%!1

At least you're good if zombie dogs start to come at you. You'll have a gun!
 
when you are load developing at short distance it is always a good idea to have your POI lower than your POA by about the same distance as the bore to scope axis. this is also why having a level or anti cant device pays off. there is a lot of controversy over the epicyclic drift theory of bullets going to sleep but flat based bullets are the preferred choice for short distance as VLDs seem to group less tightly at 100.

i have a hard time believeing that you would have a s**tty group at 100 and a good one farther out based just on the bullet. parallax and can have more to do with it
 
Low accuracy at 100 yards and better accuracy at 200 yards is a classic sign riflescope parallax problems.
Simply measure your rifle's parallax at different ranges and magnifications.
The result my surprise (and even scare) you (even Leupold 3.5-10x are not that good optically speaking).

Alex
 
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