The Crapiest Garand

[student of history]

Paul's recent thread has given me the inspiration to post a few images of a rifle that's been in my collection for a little while.

This particular example is 1 of about 38,000 which was sent to the English during the lend lease program before the United States entered the war. It is manufactured in September of 1941 and for this reason, displays a number of early "obsolete" parts which were quickly replaced on later examples. The vast majority of M1 Rifles which were manufactured at this time were lost in the jungles of the Pacific Theater so the lend leased rifles are often considered to be the closest thing we have today to snap shots of M1 production during late 1941 to early 1942.

For the most part, I'll let the pictures do the talking, but there are a few interesting characteristics worth noting. First is the early GHS cartouched stock. These were used from late 1940 to mid 1942, but what makes this one especially interesting is that it is a long channel stock. The transition from long to short channel was made at around s/n 400,000 (or so we think).

The next few interesting bits are the short pinion flush nut rear sight assembly, with checkered elevation knob (this pre-dates lock bar sights). The half rounded firing pin in the 2 SA bolt, the uncut 3SA operating rod, grooved rear hand guard clip, narrow base gas cylinder with front sight seal intact and early trigger guard with drawing numbers.

Finally I'll note that this rifle does not have any red paint on the hand guard, but is easily recognized as a lend lease when the operating rod has been pulled back. Here you'll find a slew of British markings.

So without further delay, here are some photos.

- Chris

 

[Steve1987]

-Steve

 

[buckbrush]

very nice

 

[CanadianAR]

Nice all original rifle!

 

[purple]

On the Brit proof marks, foreign weapons weren't proof tested and proof marked when they came into British military service, altho British military ownership markings were frequently applied to them. British proof tests and the associated markings were, however, applied to any rifle that was exported from Britain whether or not it saw British military use. This was a requirement under British law.

For example, I own a Dec 1943 produced Garand with original barrel which has the mandatory Brit export proofs on the barrel. This was well after Garands were provided to the Brits on Lend Lease. I also have a byf44 M98 mauser which was re-barreled to 7x57 in West Germany and which is stamped with the Brit export proofs.

A lot of surplus WW2 weapons were sold through INTERARMS when they were operating out of the UK in the 1950s/60s. All of these will show the Brit export proofs. There are a gazzilion Lee Enfields which were surplussed out of the UK and which bear the required Brit export proofs.

In the absence of the red painted stock and the non-standard ammo ID markings on the stock one can surmise that a Garand might have been a British Lend Lease piece on the basis of its early s/n range and originality of parts appropriate to the date of receiver production. The Brits were never into overhaul of their lend lease Garands so by and large they should still retain their original finish and parts.

SoH is showing us a very nice early Garand here. Chances are high that this may be an original Lend Lease rifle.

 

[live4therut]

What a fantastic rifle SOH, your very lucky to own this amazing rifle. You don't see them original and correct like this all that often. Thanks for sharing

 

[jbmauser]

Great pics Chris! Nicely done. Nice rifle as well.

 

[mb9]

Very cool! Thanks for sharing!!

 

[kjohn]

Ahhh. That can't be the crappiest Garand! But it is close! Very nice, indeed!

Thank you for taking the time to post this beauty. A fine example of the rifles from a dark time in recent history.

kjohn

 

[CODFan]

Most Excellent.

Thank you for sharing.

 

[purple]

A bit more on the Brit proofs. These are the standard postwar export proof marking as applied by the Birmingham Proof House. If we saw a closeup of the last stamping ( the one with the inverted swords) there is a possibility of establishing the date that the proofing was done.

One thing is for sure, this is a very nice example of a Sept 1941 Garand. It could well have been a Brit lend Lease rifle, but we don't know for sure.

When these Lend Lease rifles were imported some collectors found the red paint offensive and removed it, eliminating the rifle's lend lease provenance in the process. Sometimes there will be some residual red paint inside the stock or front handguard.

 

[Coyote Ugly]

A bit more on the Brit proofs. These are the standard postwar export proof marking as applied by the Birmingham Proof House. If we saw a closeup of the last stamping ( the one with the inverted swords) there is a possibility of establishing the date that the proofing was done.

One thing is for sure, this is a very nice example of a Sept 1941 Garand. It could well have been a Brit lend Lease rifle, but we don't know for sure.
When these Lend Lease rifles were imported some collectors found the red paint offensive and removed it, eliminating the rifle's lend lease provenance in the process. Sometimes there will be some residual red paint inside the stock or front handguard.

With any Garand that looks convincing, how can a person really tell if it is an unmolested, untouched original or just a rifle assembled from NOS parts a month ago? Or can you?

How does that affect the price of a Garand when you can prove an original untouched rifle versus a NOS parts rifle just assembled yesterday?

 

[purple]

That's always the dilemma with a restoration vs an original or arsenal rebuilt rifle. Parts matching to the receiver only goes so far. After that there are more subtle clues in wear patterns and finish. The reality is that one could quite easily put together a rifle that would be indistinguishable from an unissued post-war arsenal rebuild. Parkerizing is parkerizing and there are enough color and surface texture variations among arsenal rebuilds to make it very hard to tell the difference from a current refinishing. Its a lot tougher to mimic a rifle with its original finish though.

I suppose there's always something of a leap of faith involved, especially if you are trying to filter out the speculative part of things. There were rules in building and rebuilding Garands, and there are always exceptions to the rules.

One area of Garand lore that needs a lot more documentation concerns the US production of new rifles in the 1950s. There was considerable parts swapping done among makers and some collectors have hurt things by swapping parts to get a "manufacturer correct" post war rifle. The CMP brought in quite a few new/unissued HRA and Springfield made rifles in recent years and people have found some interesting things among them.

 

[6167]

An awesome snap shot in the History of the Garand!

 

[student of history]

A bit more on the Brit proofs. These are the standard postwar export proof marking as applied by the Birmingham Proof House. If we saw a closeup of the last stamping ( the one with the inverted swords) there is a possibility of establishing the date that the proofing was done.

Hi John,

As always, I appreciate you stopping in! Here's a photo of the area you've requested to see. Typically I try not to photograph my firearms with the camera flash on, as it usually misrepresents the true colour of the finish, but I did so in this instance in hopes of getting a clearer shot for you. I assume you are going to be looking for the letter that's located at 9 o'clock in relation to the inverted swords? If it were more legible we'd be able to figure out the year this Garand was exported, but it doesn't seem to have been struck very well so my eyes can't seem to make it out. I didn't resize this image so feel free to click on it to zoom waaay in.



I always thought this rifle was a lend lease, no questions asked, but I bow down to your knowledge on the subject. That said, a buddy of mine was told by Bob Seijas that the rifles which are proofed in the chamber area, just behind the op-rod, are from the first group of rifles purchased from the British by Sam Cummings of InterArms. Rifles marked in this area are *typically* regarded as lend leased pieces while the examples marked on top of the barrel above the gas cylinder are from a later batch which were likely not true lend leases. Here's a picture of one of the later ones for comparison.

- Chris

 

[student of history]

I don't mean to go overboard on this subject but another point worth noting is that this rifle shows signs of the BNP stamp on top of the receiver and bolt, but as Scott Duff outlines in Garands in the King's Service:

"The proofing dies were no match for the hardened steel of the M1 Garand's receiver and bolt, and wore out in short order. Only a small fraction of L.L. rifles show these proofs or parts of them; most carry only a dent or smudge. Many show no evidence at all, suggesting that both proof houses eventually gave up the attempt."

Here are a couple pictures of my attempt to capture the BNP "smudges" on the bolt and receiver. The outline of a crown and a partial "B" can be seen but that's the best I can do in artificial light without a macro lens.

- Chris

 

[live4therut]

Hi John,

As always, I appreciate you stopping in! Here's a photo of the area you've requested to see. Typically I try not to photograph my firearms with the camera flash on, as it usually misrepresents the true colour of the finish, but I did so in this instance in hopes of getting a clearer shot for you. I assume you are going to be looking for the letter that's located at 9 o'clock in relation to the inverted swords? If it were more legible we'd be able to figure out the year this Garand was exported, but it doesn't seem to have been struck very well so my eyes can't seem to make it out. I didn't resize this image so feel free to click on it to zoom waaay in.



I always thought this rifle was a lend lease, no questions asked, but I bow down to your knowledge on the subject. That said, a buddy of mine was told by Bob Seijas that the rifles which are proofed in the chamber area, just behind the op-rod, are from the first group of rifles purchased from the British by Sam Cummings of InterArms. Rifles marked in this area are *typically* regarded as lend leased pieces while the examples marked on top of the barrel above the gas cylinder are from a later batch which were likely not true lend leases. Here's a picture of one of the later ones for comparison.

- Chris

Chris,

From what I have known and observed to be correct for lend lease rifles, your rifle is correct in where they are typically stamped lend lease, some are not easily seen like yours and the rear hand guard has to be removed but all lend lease rifles that I've seen are stamped close to the receiver, and the Birmingham proof marks done in the 60's were all done by the gas cylinder.

 

[purple]

Chris, you certainly should take Scott Duff's opinions before mine. He has been among the leading Garand researchers for decades and has written books on the topic. Its interesting to hear about the placement of the Brit export markings on the rifles and the pattern of LL Garands having the markings stamped at the rear and side of the barrel. This, combined with the early s/n and the originality of finish and parts, would help to ID a LL Garand, even in the absence of the red paint.

Incidentally, my non-LL Brit export marked rifle has the export markings of the London Proof House stamped on top of the barrel above the gas cyl.

As always, there are rules and then there are exceptions to them. One well documented deviation from the Brit export marking system is with the so-called "Red Star" Springfields (named for the retail store that sold them, not the commies). In this case a US military officer purchased 200 Remington made M1903 rifles from the Brit MOD in 1955. These rifles were all LL supplied and were used by the Brit Home Guard. All had the red paint designating non-standard ammo, on the forends, but none had the expected mandatory Brit export proofs. The only Brit markings on them, other than the red paint, were the occasional ordnance inspection mark stamped on the stocks.

Unfortunately we can't make out the full stampings on the last Birmingham proof stamp on your rifle.It took a long time for folks to puzzle out the meaning of the number/letter marks in this stamp, but a German collector eventually broke the code for the date/year marking.

 

[WW2GURU]

Going to have to pull out my lend lease and have a close look

 

[Smitsauce]

Interesting! I'm going to have to pull out my two Oct. and Nov. 5 digit 1940's M1's to check this out with them! The Nov. one is about 80% correct for the original parts that are still there with the original 1940 barrel.

Ian