The Double Rifle: Share your experience.

tony72cutlass's'

tony72cutlass's'

Member
Rating - 100%
9   0   0
Location
Montreal
Hello All,

So far, i've been into pistols such as the Walther PPK and PP sport, i'd like to get into some classical double rifles (and hopefully not have to pay the big price tag..)

I've been looking at:

1) Baikal

2) Merkel

Is it really worth it to pay the extra 4,000$ for a good used Merkel? I hear they are regulated using an allen key, whereas the baikal's are regulated using some sort of set screw between the barrels.

Thanks for any feedback,

-Tony
 
I have a baikal and love it. It's no where near the same league as a Merkel or Chapuis or vc. Is it worth it? Depends on what you want. If you like fine wood and hand engraving then yes. A big name double is purpose built and balanced well. The baikal swings nice but it's a working gun. I won't cry if I scratch it and if I run out of ammo I can use it as a club. Or paddle. I might not be so inclined to use a $10000 double the same way

I say buy the baikal and save for a better higher quality double if you enjoy them
 
Also depends what you're looking for in terms of chambering. 45/70 is fine in its own right, but its not a true (African) "dangerous game cartridge." In my mind a classic double rifle is in a nitro express cartridge, but that could just be me.... If that's what you're after you'll need to shell out more, and ammo will be far from inexpensive....
 
Holy crap, Baikal and Merkel might rhyme, sort of, but jeez.

I thoroughly enjoyed depleating C-FBMI's .470 ammo supply with his Merkel . . .


Here's the .470 in full song . . .


On my trip to Tanzania I had the opportunity to shoot and hunt with a John Wilkes .500 NE, the muzzles climbed in an impressive manner when I harped the triggers . . .


I could have brought the John Wilkes home for only $40K USD in 2006 . . .


Its not a shotgun, Mark Sullivan's Charles Osborne .577 NE


While I don't have photos of it, I did have the opportunity to shoot a brand new Baikal SXS in .30/06 a fellow brought up here. I might have put the first rounds through it, anyway, the wood was impressive given the cost of the rifle, and when I fired a pair of my handloads, that just happened to be in my pocket at the right time, both barrels hit an 18" rock at about 200 yards distance, off-hand! I was negotiating to buy it right then and there, when my wife says, "Really? You don't even like doubles!" Oh yeah.
 
Last edited:
Careful, ......they're contagious! Get one, use it a few times and you'll be hooked forever! If you start with the Baikal you can enjoy it enough to want to progress into the higher grades and then you're done!
 
Arctic said:
Careful, ......they're contagious! Get one, use it a few times and you'll be hooked forever! If you start with the Baikal you can enjoy it enough to want to progress into the higher grades and then you're done!
Click to expand...

I did, and I wasn't. Shooting a double requires shooting and handling techniques that differ from other rifles. Perhaps I was just too old before I was introduced to them, but I wouldn't trade a $5K bolt gun for a $50K double, it the deal was that I had to keep one or the other.
 
Hi All,

Thanks for your replies! i suppose i should have been a little bit more clear with what i'm looking for is more for taking out to the range and not actual serious hunting.

I really like the classic look of these double rifles, i collect things like Omega watches, war-time walther PPK's.. i figured double rifle would be the logical step into the hunting market :D
 
WOW, those rifles are gorgeous,

do i date to ask what it costs to get into something as cadillac as that..!!

Also, i've been looking at a couple baikal side by sides, what is your opinion between 30-06 and 45-70? I would like to get back into handloading, but i have only ever handloaded pistol cartridges..

While I don't have photos of it, I did have the opportunity to shoot a brand new Baikal SXS in .30/06 a fellow brought up here. I might have put the first rounds through it, anyway, the wood was impressive given the cost of the rifle, and when I fired a pair of my handloads, that just happened to be in my pocket at the right time, both barrels hit an 18" rock at about 200 yards distance, off-hand! I was negotiating to buy it right then and there, when my wife says, "Really? You don't even like doubles!" Oh yeah.
Click to expand...
 
tony72cutlass's' said:
WOW, those rifles are gorgeous,

do i date to ask what it costs to get into something as cadillac as that..!!

Also, i've been looking at a couple baikal side by sides, what is your opinion between 30-06 and 45-70? I would like to get back into handloading, but i have only ever handloaded pistol cartridges..
Click to expand...

It depends what you want to do with the rifle, you specified range use... how far?.....
 
The .45/70 would be fun to shoot at those ranges with iron sights..... More traditional bore size for a double as well....

The Baikal would draw a lot of attention at the range.... They are very nice guns for the low investment....
 
Superbrad said:
The .45/70 would be fun to shoot at those ranges with iron sights..... More traditional bore size for a double as well....

The Baikal would draw a lot of attention at the range.... They are very nice guns for the low investment....
Click to expand...

Cool thanks! Is there anywhere that sells these new?

I suppose it would be nice to start with a low investment (600-700) range and see how I like it, and then maybe save up for a ###y Merkel of sorts
 
tony72cutlass's' said:
WOW, those rifles are gorgeous,

do i date to ask what it costs to get into something as cadillac as that..!!

Also, i've been looking at a couple baikal side by sides, what is your opinion between 30-06 and 45-70? I would like to get back into handloading, but i have only ever handloaded pistol cartridges..
Click to expand...

The .30/06 is one of my favorite cartridges, the question is, is it an appropriate cartridge for someone who is interested in a double rifle? I guess like any rifle, it depends what it will be used for, but the double is at its best as a short range problem solver, where the big bore has a significant advantage over the small. IMHO, the double is a niche rifle, where a bolt action lends itself to greater flexibility.

If you get back into handloading, handloading for either the .45-70 or the .30/06 is straight forward process, and there are all sorts of load recipes for each of them. The reloading tools necessary can be acquired at a modest price, although the sky is the limit when you start looking at some of the stuff from Giraud, Sinclair, Redding, K&M, Wilson, and so on. Start with an RCBS or a Lee outfit, and don't buy more than you need to start. From that point forward, you can buy tools that address bottlenecks in your loading process, and you shouldn't take too big a hit if you decide its not something that interests you. Mostly though, shooting enthusiasts seem to enjoy handloading, and it allows you to load to performance levels that are not available from the factory.
 
Owned both until last week, sold the Baikal, not for lack of quality but lack of time, I've been home four nights this month. There is little comparison between the two, get the Merkel if you can afford to. This said I've spoken fondly of the Baikal recently, and I need to clarify that means it lets you know if you like a double, there are still several light years difference in quality and user experience. If you're just want to test the waters the price of the Baikal is ridiculously cheap, and it's a good option for that, it's tough too.

Some double reading,

http://www.morrisonarms.com/2014/04/lion-rifles-part-ii-why-i-believe-the-double-is-the-perfect-tool/

http://www.morrisonarms.com/2014/11/beautiful-nightmares-and-the-stopping-rifles/
 
The Baikal is a ton of fun for little outlay, I use 16.5 grains of unique under jet hunters 350 gr gas checked lead bullets. Its on point of aim at 50 yds and both barrels hit within an inch and a quarter of each other. The skinner peep is a perfect ghost ring with the removable aperture out and while not something I use for serious hunting , you could if you had too.
The fun factor alone is worth the purchase price
 
I have the Baikal in 45-70. The wood is really quite nice for this price point. My hand loads are 485gr cast at 1650fps, and at that level the recoil is lively in such a light rifle. A Simms recoil pad is a really good idea.
As for regulating the barrels, this can be quite a challenge. Of course adjusting for horizontal dispersion is quite easy. But many guns have fairly significant vertical dispersion as well, and there isn't any adjustment built in for that. On mine the right barrel groups about 5" high at 50yds. I've read people have had success using a strip cut from a razor blade, using it as a wedge at the muzzle, and I don't doubt that can work. Once the weather warms up I will be spending a little time testing that. Point is, be prepared to spend a little time and ammo getting them to hit well.
On most guns the barrel break is very stiff, and this coupled with the gun using extractors rather than electors can really slow down reloading. One trick is to turn the rifle upside down when opening the action. It makes it somewhat easier to open, and most times the brass will fall out.
So there are lots of refinements that separate a Baikal from even mid range doubles, not the least of which is caliber options. But for many of us, a $5000 - $10000 double is nowhere in our future. And the Baikal is a great way to experience a double at a very reasonable price point. And loaded a little stiff it will carve huge holes through any creature we have in North America. All in a gun that is a dream to carry, and is very quick handling to get on target.
 
Fargone4sure said:
I have the Baikal in 45-70. The wood is really quite nice for this price point. My hand loads are 485gr cast at 1650fps, and at that level the recoil is lively in such a light rifle. A Simms recoil pad is a really good idea.
As for regulating the barrels, this can be quite a challenge. Of course adjusting for horizontal dispersion is quite easy. But many guns have fairly significant vertical dispersion as well, and there isn't any adjustment built in for that. On mine the right barrel groups about 5" high at 50yds. I've read people have had success using a strip cut from a razor blade, using it as a wedge at the muzzle, and I don't doubt that can work. Once the weather warms up I will be spending a little time testing that. Point is, be prepared to spend a little time and ammo getting them to hit well.
On most guns the barrel break is very stiff, and this coupled with the gun using extractors rather than electors can really slow down reloading. One trick is to turn the rifle upside down when opening the action. It makes it somewhat easier to open, and most times the brass will fall out.
So there are lots of refinements that separate a Baikal from even mid range doubles, not the least of which is caliber options. But for many of us, a $5000 - $10000 double is nowhere in our future. And the Baikal is a great way to experience a double at a very reasonable price point. And loaded a little stiff it will carve huge holes through any creature we have in North America. All in a gun that is a dream to carry, and is very quick handling to get on target.
Click to expand...

I used peelable aluminum shim material to set my vertical dispersion, it sure helps but I found the way I was holding the rifle was more of a contributor than I would have imagined. Once I settled down to ensure I was holding it level it took very little shim to put them both on the same plane. If you need some shim material shoot me a pm.
 
The Chapuis I want is $14700+ tax and shipping. My baikal I paid $1099 + tax and shipping. I bought one when they first came out. New old stock can be bought for as low as $799+. I love mine. It's perfect for bear baiting and hiking thru thick bush during bear season. I've even loaded shot shells for it for use on grouse
I just loaded 100 rounds of various powders to play with. Any chance I get I like to play with it and everyone on the range loves it. I'd go 45/70. Doubles deserve rimmed cartridges
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom