The Genesis 8.6mm PDW TriggrCon 2023

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The Genesis 8.6mm PDW [TriggrCon 2023]


JR is at TriggrCon 2023 speaking with the guys at Genesis about their 8.6mm PDW, which is ultimately both competition with the Q Boombox, but also a complimentary platform that will make 8.6mm more attractive for potential buyers as more manufacturers start supporting this revolutionary new caliber. Bottom line, this is an insanely powerful, low-recoiling rifle in a package about the same size as an H&K MP5.


 
Subsonic, the 6.8 is is no more effective terminally than 300 Blackout.

Subsonic 30 caliber rifle bullets don't expand and wildly overpenetrate. Making the bullet slightly bigger and considerably heavier only increases the amount of energy wasted out the back side of the target.

Garand Thumb did some gel testing with 8.6 and it blew right through more than 36" of gel blocks without even slowing down. Basically if you shot a deer in the ass, the projectile would come out its head, which is just a bit over the top.

300 Blackout is considerably less expensive and has better support at this time.
 
greentips said:
Possible bear defence in subsonic. Don't think a bear skull can survive that 1/3 twist in 250gr offering.
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Not that I'm willing to try it in person, but I highly doubt a bear skull would survive the typical subsonic 30 caliber bullet. I've done some subsonic terminal testing and the penetration of a pointed subsonic rifle bullet is nothing short of impressive.

That super fast twist rate actually plays against terminal performance because it prevent loss of stability upon impact. Terminally it is better if the bullet is unstable after impact, which causes it to tumble in flesh. A 208gr 30 caliber bullet is over 1.5" long. Image the damage caused by a 1.5" projectile tumbling through flesh.
 
Sakonut said:
8.6 blackout is a stupid round, and i won't change my mind
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I somewhat agree. Basically it takes advantage of people who are fundamentally ignorant of subsonic 30 cal terminal performance and think that with velocity capped at 1000 fps, a bigger bullet equals more energy .... it doesn't if the bullet wildly over penetrates
 
Sakonut said:
8.6 blackout is a stupid round, and i won't change my mind
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It's a stupid round WITHOUT SUPPRESSORS. If we could hunt with suppressors in Canada...

I Dont Care About You said:
I somewhat agree. Basically it takes advantage of people who are fundamentally ignorant of subsonic 30 cal terminal performance and think that with velocity capped at 1000 fps, a bigger bullet equals more energy .... it doesn't if the bullet wildly over penetrates
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That's a problem with bullet choice not the cartridge. Ian at forgotten weapons has one, and using hollow point ammo it went through 1 gel block and just into the second. So like 18" penetration.

And look at this bullet. I'm not volunteering to stand infront of that! Even without a massive temporary cavity that you'd get with a fast cartridge that is gonna do some damage.
7RtJh7M.jpeg


I would never buy one in Canada. But I would be interested if I ever moved stateside to a state that allows suppressors for hunting.
 
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300 Blackout penetrates just as well and there are expanding bullets available for subsonic velocities. I know guys have used long bullets like the 208 AMAX to hunt deer and those lose stability and tumble on impact, creating a much larger wound channel.

300 BLK is way easier to live with and way cheaper.

WRT bear defence. It is my guess that the noise of the shot coupled with a painful sting that deters a charging bear. Take the noise away and the bear may not understand it has been shot. I don't think a very quiet suppressed gun is a good idea for animal defence.

John Plaster told a story about using a suppressed Swedish-K in combat. Normally when an advancing soldier hears a burst fired at him, he ducks or goes to ground. Plaster kept firing bursts of suppressed 9mm at solders during a fire fight and quickly realized they had no idea they were even being shot at so they never ducked and they kept coming. That can be a bit of a problem.
 
I Dont Care About You said:
300 Blackout penetrates just as well and there are expanding bullets available for subsonic velocities. I know guys have used long bullets like the 208 AMAX to hunt deer and those lose stability and tumble on impact, creating a much larger wound channel.

300 BLK is way easier to live with and way cheaper.
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Sure, but if they both expand the same % then a 338 bullet is gonna leave a bigger hole, which is gonna bring game down faster. I wouldn't expect DRT results from either of course.

Sure 300 is cheaper, but the cost of ammo is largely irrelevant to hunting where you are spending hundreds or thousands on everything else involved - tags, licenses, gas, etc.
 
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