Three shot or five shot group?

kombi1976 said:
After shooting a 0.77" 5-shot group @100m
........
I found more success with picking a target and hitting it once than trying to put shots on a piece of paper.
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Your "targets" were all larger than 0.77" ne'cest-pas?

but ...

target shooting at a bullseye is for "sighting in", and training of breath control, sight picture etc.
Once that is at an acceptable level, your right, maybe more can be learned by single shots at targets at various angles and distances .... hard to do at a crowded range, however.
 
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target shooting at a bullseye is for "sighting in", and training of breath control, sight picture etc.
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I actually do far more target shooting off of the bench for load development than for any other reason.My next common reason for target shooting off of a bench is for determining the trajectory of a load at various distances.Lastly,I use a benchrest to sight in my rifles,but I do not use a benchrest for practising after the load is developed and the rifle is sighted in.
 
yesterday, with one of my M14 rifles, I shot a five shot group of 2" @ 100 yds.
BUT,
four of these were into 1/2".

Since I was watching each shot through a 10X scope and could see the holes, I know it was the third shot in the string that pulled out to 2".

If I had shot only a three shot string, and walked up 100 yds to check the target, I would have been disappointed with a 2" group.

But because I shot 5 shots [ and could see each individual shot ] instead I am very pleased with the grouping, and can legitimately suspect that the third shot was a flier. Completely different perspectives brought about by spotting each shot in as it was fired, and by firing 5 instead of three. Of course, a lot more range time with a lot more shots fired will provide a much better statistical basis for my assumption that this rifle is "accurate".

When I used to build "target" M14 rifles [ and there is an OX riding a moron if ever there was one ] I guaranteed 2" accuracy at 100 yds. To be just a bit more specific, I guaranteed that if you couldn't shoot a 2" group with one of my target rifles, I would bolt on my 24X scope, grab some 168 Gr HPBT match ammo, bolt on a bipod, and prove that the gun would shoot 5 shots into 2" for me. This was my base line for "mechanical" accuracy.

I didn't guarantee that every brand of ammo would shoot into 2", or that every shooter would shoot 2" groups. And in fact, the very best grouping I've ever personally seen out of an M14 rifle was shot by one of my customers ... 10 shots into 3/4" with iron sights from prone with a sling. I personally could not get that gun to shoot that well, but the customer just happened to be an ex-Brit sniper.

No matter how mechanically accurate a rifle may be, it is usually the loose nut pulling on the trigger that determines PRACTICAL accuracy.
LAZ 1
[;{)
 
But because I shot 5 shots [ and could see each individual shot ] instead I am very pleased with the grouping, and can legitimately suspect that the third shot was a flier.
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The question is why was it a flier?It may be shooter error,but it may be actually telling you something about the load.I have used loads that did throw a flier every few groups although the rest of the shots were very consistent.In each case,it was a problem with the load,and the flier had some significance.Then again if this flier was an isolated incident,it may mean nothing at all.
 
VERRRRRRY hard, VERRRRY creepy trigger. On follow through, it looked like it went to the right place ... I certainly would not have called it a flyer.

Of course, a lot more range time with a lot more shots fired will provide a much better statistical basis for my assumption that this particular rifle is "accurate". AND a trigger job before the next range session. FOR SURE!!

Loads were Win Ranger 168 Gr HPBT Match [ ex-RCMP sniper issue ]. These loads are the most consistent for accuracy [ on average through dozens of M14 type rifles ] that I know of, so I don't suspect the load ...

At this point I suspect operator error [ PEBCAK ].
No matter how mechanically accurate a rifle may be, it is usually the loose nut pulling on the trigger that determines PRACTICAL accuracy.
LAZ 1
[;{)
 
One of my pet peeves is the guy that can't hit anything at the range but claims that he is a very accurate shooter on live game.If you can't hit a target off of a solid rest with plenty of time,and no distractions,how can you be more accurate under field conditions with the excitement of an animal in your sights?:D
 
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