Can anyone comment on their personal experience using TiteGroup and how temperature affects the actual velocity of your load? If I chronograph the velocity of a 9mm load when it's +27C out and then check the velocity of the same load when it's 20 degrees cooler out, any thoughts on what the difference might be?
TiteGroup and Temperature / Velocity?
- Thread starter Scott_N
- Start date
Probably 40-50fps? But that's just a guess. What cartridge it's being shot in, barrel length, what grain of bullet, whether is a light or max charge weight of powder. All those things and more, are gonna effect the powders burn characteristics. Only way to tell for sure is to chronograph it at those temperatures.
saskgunowner101
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- near Prince Albert
You could go ahead and make your ammo the temp you want, and test it over a chrono, assuming you can get to your test area quick enough. Put your ammo in the freezer, and then transport it in a lunch bucket with ice packs or the like.
There are too many factors for me to give you a 100% guarantee, but I've found no statistical significance to the variations I've noted in the past, and I've shot a $hit ton of Titegroup. This is in regard to handgun loads specifically. Variations in my charge drops and seating depth, along with the use of mixed brass on a progressive press are more of a factor than the powder's sensitivity.
If you do end up testing it for yourself, share your results to help confirm or deny results like mine.
If you do end up testing it for yourself, share your results to help confirm or deny results like mine.
Thanks for your info. You're right about me worrying about meeting PF, and I was just curious how temperature sensitive TiteGroup is.
Sticking with an average of 130PF is a good idea.
I flew a little "too close to the sun" loading to around 126PF and then initially failed the chrono stage during a cool morning at the IDPA Nationals last year. Held 5 rounds in the sunlight to warm them up and then barely squeaked over 125PF on my re-shoot.
Won't make that mistake again.
I do agree with the comments above that a combination of all of the variables like Campro projectiles, mixed range brass, a progressive press, and using Titegroup in a powder drop, etc etc will all introduce more variables than the temp sensitivity itself.
I flew a little "too close to the sun" loading to around 126PF and then initially failed the chrono stage during a cool morning at the IDPA Nationals last year. Held 5 rounds in the sunlight to warm them up and then barely squeaked over 125PF on my re-shoot.
Won't make that mistake again.
I do agree with the comments above that a combination of all of the variables like Campro projectiles, mixed range brass, a progressive press, and using Titegroup in a powder drop, etc etc will all introduce more variables than the temp sensitivity itself.
I just tested this a few days ago. My theory is that if I load test now with (temp was 5 degrees C) then the load will always make at least 125PF (higher temps in the summer should add a few FPS in theory or at the very least it will be the same)
I made up a bunch of loads with Titegroup and I would find decent variation despite measuring the powder to 0.02gr / same seating depth / same gun / same day. I was using mixed brass (identical prep for all) but that is the variable in my opinion.
Side note which contradicts my above statement a little, I also made some test loads with N310 and saw much less spread.
Yep, 130 is a good target.
To expand slightly further I tested 2 loads in the same "gun" but alternated between 2 different barrels (stock and aftermarket with different rifling on each) and there was a significant difference between the FPS / PF.
If I had to guess maybe one had a tighter chamber (seals better and pushes more gas out the barrel resulting in higher FPS) and differences in the rifling (deeper rifling would add additional resistance and result in lower FPS).
Glad I didnt assume anything as I would have been out to lunch for sure and could have been facing DQ if the chips had fell wrong (ie, smoke a "fast" barrel at a match and replace with the slow "barrel" but then get chronoed using the ammo for the fast barrel - will probably result in the ammo not making PF and DQ)
While not entirely unrelated….
I loaded a sh*t ton 147gr ammo for IDPA where I usually used my P320 Max with a 5” barrel. With the P320 banned from IDPA now, I had to move to my P226 which has a 4.4” barrel. Amazing what 0.6” does to velocity. So basically I have 4,000 rounds of practice ammo as it barely makes 120PF now.
I loaded a sh*t ton 147gr ammo for IDPA where I usually used my P320 Max with a 5” barrel. With the P320 banned from IDPA now, I had to move to my P226 which has a 4.4” barrel. Amazing what 0.6” does to velocity. So basically I have 4,000 rounds of practice ammo as it barely makes 120PF now.
All other things being equal longer barrels will generate more velocity than shorter barrels until a certain point (then the bullet will begin to slow down again if the gas is tapering off before it has left the barrel - not applicable to the shorter barrels you are talking about) but I suspect you are seeing the same phenomenon that I did with my recent testing.
Everything was identical (same ammo / same conditions including barrel length) but switching barrels in the same gun made a dramatic difference in my FPS.
As I alluded to above some barrels are simply faster than others (the two reasons I mentioned before are what I believe are factors in that instance but there could well be others - length being one)
- Location
- Delta B.C.
It is not listed as one of the "extreme" powders, so it will show more variance regardless of your load process. All powders are subject to variance in temperature. Even the powders that are specifically designed to be less sensitive. Here's what a quick search came up with.
mactroneng
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- SW Ontario
In 9mm I've not had issue.
For 45 ACP with Ginex LPP primers, I will be finding a new powder (got a container of W231 to try)... I do not get reliable ignition in colder temperatures, luckily no squids but the bullet gets jammed into the lands while failing to leave the brass and locks the action up completely.
For 45 ACP with Ginex LPP primers, I will be finding a new powder (got a container of W231 to try)... I do not get reliable ignition in colder temperatures, luckily no squids but the bullet gets jammed into the lands while failing to leave the brass and locks the action up completely.
I ran about 40 rounds over my Garmin the other day, it was about 8 or 9 C that morning. I'm using 135gr Campro bullets, 3.5gr of TiteGroup and Remington 1 1/2 small pistol primers, which gave me an average of just over 970 fps and a PF of about 131. All my cases are the same manufacturer, so I'll check some rounds again when it's warmer out, which might mean Chinook weather for me, or might be spring.
