training with .22lr and 9mm pistols

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cdndfs

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New pistol shooter here. Now that my RPAL has arrived I have to make final decision on the guns I'm going to buy.

Given that .22lr is 1/5th the cost of 9mm I was considering doing a big chunk of my training on the .22. I've been looking at options where I could use 2 versions of the same gun in different calibers, such as the P226 Classic .22LR and the P226 9mm, or the Walther PPQ M2 .22LR and PPQ 9m (maybe Q5 match). Doing this would allow me to move back and forth without having to get used to different controls, grip, sights, etc.

Do you think this is the best avenue of approach? Or would it be more beneficial to get a more target-oriented .22,like a Buck Mark III for accuracy reasons? Ultimately my goal is proficiency on the 9mm for IPSC competition, but I'm looking for the cheapest way to get there in terms of ammo expenditure and time.
 
cdndfs said:
New pistol shooter here. Now that my RPAL has arrived I have to make final decision on the guns I'm going to buy.

Given that .22lr is 1/5th the cost of 9mm I was considering doing a big chunk of my training on the .22. I've been looking at options where I could use 2 versions of the same gun in different calibers, such as the P226 Classic .22LR and the P226 9mm, or the Walther PPQ M2 .22LR and PPQ 9m (maybe Q5 match). Doing this would allow me to move back and forth without having to get used to different controls, grip, sights, etc.

Do you think this is the best avenue of approach? Or would it be more beneficial to get a more target-oriented .22,like a Buck Mark III for accuracy reasons? Ultimately my goal is proficiency on the 9mm for IPSC competition, but I'm looking for the cheapest way to get there in terms of ammo expenditure and time.
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That approach did work for me. I purchased the M&P 22 and the M&P 9 range kit as my first guns. The 22 has helped me with grip and trigger control not to mention the pocket book. I usually start and end with the 22 when I practice. Since starting I have added the M&P9 Pro CORE so I don't have as many similarities between the 22 and the new 9 but it is still helpful. Plus the 22 still gives me lots more time on the range.
 
Walknby said:
That approach did work for me. I purchased the M&P 22 and the M&P 9 range kit as my first guns. The 22 has helped me with grip and trigger control not to mention the pocket book. I usually start and end with the 22 when I practice. Since starting I have added the M&P9 Pro CORE so I don't have as many similarities between the 22 and the new 9 but it is still helpful. Plus the 22 still gives me lots more time on the range.
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Cool. How do you like the Pro Core?

Another question. Am I missing any other options where one company makes both a full size 22 and 9mm in same line with same grip, controls etc?
 
CZ has their cadet .22 (stand-alone or top end conversion), and their 75/85/Shadow. Not sure if the Cadets are still in production though.

Or you could look at 1911's, lots of options there.
 
However imo shooting 22 vs 9mm is kinda diff animal though. If u wanna train for IPSC I suggest finding the pistol u perform the best and stick with 9mm. I been down that route. When it comes to practice drills and timing it for improvement u wanna do it in 9mm so everything feels exactly the same when running real stages
 
If you reload 9mm, which you should be doing for competition anyways the price difference is not as noticeable (e.g. 18 cents a round using range pickup brass, a little more if you have to buy once fired).
 
Pick the gun you would want to use in competition.

Both the SIG P226 and the Glock give you the option of using a conversion kit, but you may not want to use use a DA/SA for IPSC. I believe you would be required to decock before holstering, which would mean firing your first shot DA each round of competition. I love my 226, but i wouldn't use it in competition.
 
I use the PPQ .22 and the Q5 Match combination. Both amazing guns. The .22 will help you with your marksmanship and reducing flinch when you're first starting out. Nothing replaces shooting 9mm though when it comes to improving your skills as an IPSC shooter. Recoil control and timing become very important once you have your basic marksmanship down. It's just not the same with a .22.
 
darks1d3 said:
I use the PPQ .22 and the Q5 Match combination. Both amazing guns. The .22 will help you with your marksmanship and reducing flinch when you're first starting out. Nothing replaces shooting 9mm though when it comes to improving your skills as an IPSC shooter. Recoil control and timing become very important once you have your basic marksmanship down. It's just not the same with a .22.
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This.

.22LR is great at the start, then starts to not matter much the more you progress. I still advocate starting with a .22 though. Just last night, two new-ish shooters with a 9mm and they are shooting everywhere. Flinch city. I tried the gun and the gun is fine. :)

I shoot a Shadow in IPSC/IDPA and for a .22, I use a Grand Power K22. I have a Kadet kit for my Shadow, but it needs a 15-16lb mainspring to reliably set off .22, so I've stopped using it. I just use the GP. DA/SA like the Shadow, and the other differences in grip, trigger, mag release, etc is irrelevant to me.
 
cdndfs said:
Cool. How do you like the Pro Core?

Another question. Am I missing any other options where one company makes both a full size 22 and 9mm in same line with same grip, controls etc?
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I really like the Pro Core. It was a big improvement over the 4.25". I've since gone to a red dot as well and the package works great. Better than I will be for quite a while. I can't comment on other offerings. I didn't get to try out very many choices before deciding on the 22/9mm pair.

A consideration for me was also that I am left handed and the M&P's have ambidextrous slide releases and reversible mag releases.
 
GU4RDI4N said:
Pick the gun you would want to use in competition.

Both the SIG P226 and the Glock give you the option of using a conversion kit, but you may not want to use use a DA/SA for IPSC. I believe you would be required to decock before holstering, which would mean firing your first shot DA each round of competition. I love my 226, but i wouldn't use it in competition.
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The CZ Shadow 1 is probably the most prolific IPSC pistol and it's DA/SA. It just takes practice to master the DA first shot.
 
mcwalther said:
The CZ Shadow 1 is probably the most prolific IPSC pistol and it's DA/SA. It just takes practice to master the DA first shot.
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So true. If a shooter will compete, s/he will dryfire. DA trigger time with the Shadow will overcome any irrational fear of a DA first shot. Added bonus: those little laser cartridges are fantastic with a gun like the Shadow. Now you can get DA trigger time and see where the little laser dot shows up on transition drills, etc. Fantastic combo.
 
A .22 helped me train away the flinch too. Dry firing helps too. But it's too easy for our mind to remember that dry firing has no recoil. A .22 at least gives us a bit of a kick which we can train ourselves to ignore. And that makes it easier to ignore the bigger kick.

At first glance having guns with similar shaped grips for size and angle makes a lot of sense. But if you're like a lot of us and are aiming for a fairly wide variety of handguns and would like to include a revolver or two as well then the whole similar shape grip takes a big downturn in importance.

Answer that question to yourself truthfully and if it really is a case that you're SURE you'll be happy with just one 9mm for ever and ever then a .22 companion with a very similar size and angle grip does make a lot of sense.
 
I ventured down this road myself when I first started and as others have stated while there is some benefit to getting a bunch of trigger time with a .22 if your focus is IPSC you are going to want to stick to the gun you shoot in competition. I spent a whack load of money on a Kadet kit for my Shadow and found after the first bit of training it wasn't worth using because the lack of recoil and the different timing of the gun made it like shooting a different gun than what I used in competition. There is value in owning a .22 ( I have a few) for new shooters, my wife and just fooling around but as a training tool my opinion is stick to what you will compete with.
 
You really should be considering the size of your safe. You’re going to buy so many handguns. Believe me - 6 months ago I wasn’t even going to buy one handgun. Just get the RPAL “because” they told me.

I’m up to 5 and the wife has 2. And 2 ARs

PS. 22s kinda suck
 
Walknby said:
That approach did work for me. I purchased the M&P 22 and the M&P 9 range kit as my first guns. The 22 has helped me with grip and trigger control not to mention the pocket book. I usually start and end with the 22 when I practice. Since starting I have added the M&P9 Pro CORE so I don't have as many similarities between the 22 and the new 9 but it is still helpful. Plus the 22 still gives me lots more time on the range.
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I went this route although I have no plans on IPSC. I bought the range kit in 9mm and the M&P 22 fits the same holster. It is a good trainer since they are both pretty much the same size and platform and if and when you take new shooters to the range, the .22 is a nice introduction to pistol shooting.
 
BCRider said:
A .22 helped me train away the flinch too. Dry firing helps too. But it's too easy for our mind to remember that dry firing has no recoil. A .22 at least gives us a bit of a kick which we can train ourselves to ignore. And that makes it easier to ignore the bigger kick.

At first glance having guns with similar shaped grips for size and angle makes a lot of sense. But if you're like a lot of us and are aiming for a fairly wide variety of handguns and would like to include a revolver or two as well then the whole similar shape grip takes a big downturn in importance.

Answer that question to yourself truthfully and if it really is a case that you're SURE you'll be happy with just one 9mm for ever and ever then a .22 companion with a very similar size and angle grip does make a lot of sense.
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Of course I won't be happy with just 2. I figure within a couple years I'll be up to at least 6-7 (shotgun, AR, 2-3 pistols, revolver, 22 rifle and hunting rifle) :cool:

I like the idea of having a varied collection. I agree that the .22 will be mostly to learn shooting basics and pistol marksmanship but that its utility will wear off as I attain a certain level of proficiency.

I'm so undecided on what to get. I don't think I really like the target oriented 22 pistols. Just don't like how the look. My wife is also going to learn on the 22 so I have to consider her. She will theoretically go through same transition as me but probably won't shoot as much. I guess i'll look for something decent but economical in 22 and save the money for reloading gear so that I can shoot more 9mm.
 
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