I want to have built the most accurate 22 rimfire rifle that can be had. I want to know what action,barrel,trigger and stock,chassis to accomplish this. Basically what in your opinion would create this rifle as far as a parts list and the person to build it! No requirement other than being the most accurate build possible. Yes I realize the ammo limitations and the importance of lot testing. What chamber, what length barrel.gun weight etc. Some explanation as to your picks would also be greatly appreciated. Help me spend some money HAHA
Ultimate build for Accuracy
- Thread starter Longstud
- Start date
- Location
- Southern Vancouver Island
Without knowing yer intended uses for the build, all I can recommend is sift through the Anschutz listings to get an idea on the build type & style you wish for.
Bring money.
https://www.anschutznorthamerica.com/factory-rifles.html
Ye could go Nutz and splurge on a Bleiker rifle as well. Bring even more money.
Bring money.
https://www.anschutznorthamerica.com/factory-rifles.html
Ye could go Nutz and splurge on a Bleiker rifle as well. Bring even more money.
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You're only going to get the ultimate rimfire accuracy shooting off a bench with a BR specific stock. For any other discipline, the cost for that extra 0.1" you gain at 50 yards is lost at further distance. The ammo quality and ballistic properties of .22 LR just aren't there. If you're interested in bench rest accuracy... the information is out there that you seek, as this is not the forum for it.
So I’m to assume that asking about a rimfire gun on the rimfire forum is wrong. Nobody on here has experience building a custom rimfire rifle. Nobody here has ever shot rimfires trying to put multiple bullets through the same hole. No limitation on the build is what I stated. If that means a single shot BR gun that’s fine. Component list and gunsmith is what I’m seeking. MOST ACCURATE POSSIBLE
Pretty sure I’ve seen challenges on here for 1/2 and 1/4 at 50 so I assumed I could get some opinions.
Pretty sure I’ve seen challenges on here for 1/2 and 1/4 at 50 so I assumed I could get some opinions.
As Rabid says, rimfire benchrest demands the ultimate accuracy, but beyond 50 yards it's difficult at the very least, even impossible, to determine where ammo inconsistency and environmental conditions override rifle accuracy itself. In other words, the greater the distance, the more factors other than the rifle come into play when it comes to results on the target. More popular than rimfire benchrest is PRS-style shooting. For the reasons outlined above, however, in long-range shooting an ultimate build with ultimate accuracy is less important than it is in dedicated benchrest shooting.
Having made that qualification, he best rimfire accuracy is obtained by benchrest shooters using the best of all components involved. These include the the barrel and it's chamber, the action, the stock, the trigger, the optics. It's also necessary to include everything from the ground up that will support the rifle -- but this can be left to another discussion.
Regarding the barrel, the equipment lists published in the past indicate that successful shooters have used a variety of custom barrels, including Shilen, Benchmark, and Hart. I haven't seen recent equipment lists and don't know if last years successful shooters used one brand much more than another. But the point is that there should be more than one make of custom barrel that can be quite good. The same goes for chambers. Is there one that stands head and shoulders above the rest? It's doubtful. Much might depend on what certain rimfire specialist smiths prefer or what make of ammo a shooter intends to use. For actions, Turbo and Hall have been at the top of winners lists in the past and probably are still. In the past Jewell triggers were common on winners lists as were McMillan stocks, but there are other top notch products.
But no matter what is identified as the winningest or "best" barrel, action, stock, and trigger, none of this is particularly useful without a builder, a rimfire specialist gunsmith, who can put it all together to make a first-rate rifle. If someone is spending the kind of money needed for the best components, it's probably best left for a skillful smith to put it together. Unfortunaely, rimfire benchrest is not as widely and deeply embraced by shooters in Canada as it is in the United States and there are proportionately fewer rimfire smiths here than there.
Having made that qualification, he best rimfire accuracy is obtained by benchrest shooters using the best of all components involved. These include the the barrel and it's chamber, the action, the stock, the trigger, the optics. It's also necessary to include everything from the ground up that will support the rifle -- but this can be left to another discussion.
Regarding the barrel, the equipment lists published in the past indicate that successful shooters have used a variety of custom barrels, including Shilen, Benchmark, and Hart. I haven't seen recent equipment lists and don't know if last years successful shooters used one brand much more than another. But the point is that there should be more than one make of custom barrel that can be quite good. The same goes for chambers. Is there one that stands head and shoulders above the rest? It's doubtful. Much might depend on what certain rimfire specialist smiths prefer or what make of ammo a shooter intends to use. For actions, Turbo and Hall have been at the top of winners lists in the past and probably are still. In the past Jewell triggers were common on winners lists as were McMillan stocks, but there are other top notch products.
But no matter what is identified as the winningest or "best" barrel, action, stock, and trigger, none of this is particularly useful without a builder, a rimfire specialist gunsmith, who can put it all together to make a first-rate rifle. If someone is spending the kind of money needed for the best components, it's probably best left for a skillful smith to put it together. Unfortunaely, rimfire benchrest is not as widely and deeply embraced by shooters in Canada as it is in the United States and there are proportionately fewer rimfire smiths here than there.
Easy there, fella. To the best of my knowledge, nobody posting here has an "ultimate accuracy" rifle, or is seriously involved in rim fire accuracy, either in competition or the building of such rifles. There are some such folk on RFC, which is arguably a much better source of rim fire information than here. People here, such as myself, can best be described as interested amateurs, no matter the depth of knowledge we might possess on certain topics.
Yes, there are some very good rifles in this circle, but you said "the most accurate possible", which significantly narrows down the options.
I can still help you along a little. First, let's take a look at what is currently the most accurate rim fire in the world: Calfee Spec 5 "Black Death"
Barrel: Shilen Rachet, 24"
Trigger: Modified FF
Action: E-Turbo
Chamber: Calfee spec, 2° leade, 0.155" engraving
Where is there to go from here? Look out for the new V-3 Turbo, triple lug action with crescent shaped firing pin. Barrels... a number of manufacturers make excellent blanks, the difference will be mainly in how well the Smith does their work. Top picks include Shilen rachet, Muller corrugated 8, MI-4, modified MI-4, and 90 driver.
Yes, there are some very good rifles in this circle, but you said "the most accurate possible", which significantly narrows down the options.
I can still help you along a little. First, let's take a look at what is currently the most accurate rim fire in the world: Calfee Spec 5 "Black Death"
Barrel: Shilen Rachet, 24"
Trigger: Modified FF
Action: E-Turbo
Chamber: Calfee spec, 2° leade, 0.155" engraving
Where is there to go from here? Look out for the new V-3 Turbo, triple lug action with crescent shaped firing pin. Barrels... a number of manufacturers make excellent blanks, the difference will be mainly in how well the Smith does their work. Top picks include Shilen rachet, Muller corrugated 8, MI-4, modified MI-4, and 90 driver.
have had over a dozen full bench guns built over the last 15 years and a fellow in bc and out east coast has some of the best of them
hall’s swindlehurst, one 40x, stiller, and so on,
so much to type would take a week
was in 2007 in Vienna Austria involved in a new rimfire world organization
willlet others chime in
will say it is a chase for ammo once you get the right platform
maybe more later
hall’s swindlehurst, one 40x, stiller, and so on,
so much to type would take a week
was in 2007 in Vienna Austria involved in a new rimfire world organization
willlet others chime in
will say it is a chase for ammo once you get the right platform
maybe more later
Once you find the right combination in your search then you will be fitting it with optics then searching for the ammo it likes best then add a tuner and find the fine point that shoots the best.
Your current experience and where you plan on competing could be a limiting factor. In Ontario are there any clubs that shoot outdoors during the winter? Some clubs are active but the Covid has put a crimp on many events.
You will always be searching for an edge. There are different classes for BR and Sporting rifle. You may want to shoot at both 100 and 50 yards or metres.
Our club shoots BR and Sporter at 50 yards. At 100 metres we shoot BR, Target, Semi Auto, Sporter and Precision rimfire classes. Different clubs use different targets.
A friend built a Stiller 2500 and last I heard it was for sale at around $5500 but he wants to sell his whole package which includes scope, rest and ammo which might see $10,000 in total. I saw a target he shot that qualifies for the 1/4" club.
Your current experience and where you plan on competing could be a limiting factor. In Ontario are there any clubs that shoot outdoors during the winter? Some clubs are active but the Covid has put a crimp on many events.
You will always be searching for an edge. There are different classes for BR and Sporting rifle. You may want to shoot at both 100 and 50 yards or metres.
Our club shoots BR and Sporter at 50 yards. At 100 metres we shoot BR, Target, Semi Auto, Sporter and Precision rimfire classes. Different clubs use different targets.
A friend built a Stiller 2500 and last I heard it was for sale at around $5500 but he wants to sell his whole package which includes scope, rest and ammo which might see $10,000 in total. I saw a target he shot that qualifies for the 1/4" club.
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sillymike
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
While not my thing, you could always build a rail-gun
Or buy a new Anschutz, have it ship Eley. Get them to test as many lots as possible. Buy as much of that lot as you can afford... then practice and practice some more... to be able to reproduce these groups
Or buy a new Anschutz, have it ship Eley. Get them to test as many lots as possible. Buy as much of that lot as you can afford... then practice and practice some more... to be able to reproduce these groups
Now we are getting somewhere. Thanks for the informative suggestions. I see in multiple places good reviews on the Shilen Ratchet barrels. I will be researching actions a little further in the near future. Now I’m gonna research for the best rimfire smiths and see if they’ll even build me a rifle. I use to guide for a living and my guide gun was nicknamed Black Death which is kinda funny to me. It was a Browning BPS 10 gauge that was very effective. I recently gave it to a fellow CGNer and sent it to help fill his freezer and feed his family. Anyway I digress, getting pumped about this build. Thanks
When anyone is considering a "high end" expensive rimfire to achieve the best accuracy, it's very worthwhile to keep in mind one very important factor. No rifle, no matter what the barrel, action, stock etc. can make up for inconsistent ammo. In other words, the most accurate custom rifle or factory rifle can't make bad ammo perform like it's the really good stuff.
On a more general note, shooters are sometimes surprised by the different results between a higher end rifle and a more modest one. A "good" rifle will usually produce smaller groups than the more modest rifle. The smaller groups produced by the good rifle is the result of it shooting the the ammo at hand more closely to the best the ammo itself can do. The average rifle can only do what it can, which is usually to produce less consistent results due to the limitations of the rifle itself. In other words, a good rifle can let mediocre ammo shoot to its best potential. So too with a more modest rifle but it's best potential is never as high.
Ammo is probably the most difficult to find component when it comes to accuracy. There is no such thing as finding the make of ammo your rifle likes. It's all about finding the best lot of ammo for a particular rifle. It's possible for two different rifles to respond very well with the same ammo. It's also possible for two rifles with the same make of barrel to shoot the same ammo differently. Lot testing the best ammos is the only way to find ammo that wlill shoot well.
To be sure, achieving the best from a custom rifle or a "high end" factory rifle is not inexpensive. No shooter can reasonably expect to find a lot of inexpensive ammo that will make a rifle perform to the highest levels of accuracy. It's only very infrequently done, if at all, because if or when such inexpensive ammo is produced finding it is like winning a lottery -- a result of great luck and pure chance. To obtain the best results, shooters should expect to have to get the best available ammo, like Eley Tenex, Lapua Midas +, or RWS R50 -- all expensive varieties -- and then lot test it.
To add a note of caution to this formula for getting the best ammo for a particular rifle, lot testing different lots of top tier ammo doesn't necessarily mean that the testing is guaranteed to find great ammo. Why? There are only a limited number of lots of Tenex, Midas +, or R50 available in Canada at a time. This country is a relatively small market, with a relatively low demand for top ammo. Ammo dealers in Canada will be unlikely to order more ammo than they can sell. As a result they won't order a great number of different lots of ammo at a time. It's possible that out of three or four different lots of, say Midas + or Eley Tenex, one will be very good in a particular rifle. But there's nothing to say that one out of four or five must be good. Of course the odds of finding a very good lot improve if all dealers in Canada obtain different lots in quantity around the same time. Should this occur, a shooter could obtain test samples from all dealers who had the ammo in question, test, and then determine if any is worthwhile buying in quantity. The suggestion made above in an earlier post to send the rifle to the Eley testing facility in Okotoks is a good one. If a good lot is available, it can be purchased and time will be saved.
On a more general note, shooters are sometimes surprised by the different results between a higher end rifle and a more modest one. A "good" rifle will usually produce smaller groups than the more modest rifle. The smaller groups produced by the good rifle is the result of it shooting the the ammo at hand more closely to the best the ammo itself can do. The average rifle can only do what it can, which is usually to produce less consistent results due to the limitations of the rifle itself. In other words, a good rifle can let mediocre ammo shoot to its best potential. So too with a more modest rifle but it's best potential is never as high.
Ammo is probably the most difficult to find component when it comes to accuracy. There is no such thing as finding the make of ammo your rifle likes. It's all about finding the best lot of ammo for a particular rifle. It's possible for two different rifles to respond very well with the same ammo. It's also possible for two rifles with the same make of barrel to shoot the same ammo differently. Lot testing the best ammos is the only way to find ammo that wlill shoot well.
To be sure, achieving the best from a custom rifle or a "high end" factory rifle is not inexpensive. No shooter can reasonably expect to find a lot of inexpensive ammo that will make a rifle perform to the highest levels of accuracy. It's only very infrequently done, if at all, because if or when such inexpensive ammo is produced finding it is like winning a lottery -- a result of great luck and pure chance. To obtain the best results, shooters should expect to have to get the best available ammo, like Eley Tenex, Lapua Midas +, or RWS R50 -- all expensive varieties -- and then lot test it.
To add a note of caution to this formula for getting the best ammo for a particular rifle, lot testing different lots of top tier ammo doesn't necessarily mean that the testing is guaranteed to find great ammo. Why? There are only a limited number of lots of Tenex, Midas +, or R50 available in Canada at a time. This country is a relatively small market, with a relatively low demand for top ammo. Ammo dealers in Canada will be unlikely to order more ammo than they can sell. As a result they won't order a great number of different lots of ammo at a time. It's possible that out of three or four different lots of, say Midas + or Eley Tenex, one will be very good in a particular rifle. But there's nothing to say that one out of four or five must be good. Of course the odds of finding a very good lot improve if all dealers in Canada obtain different lots in quantity around the same time. Should this occur, a shooter could obtain test samples from all dealers who had the ammo in question, test, and then determine if any is worthwhile buying in quantity. The suggestion made above in an earlier post to send the rifle to the Eley testing facility in Okotoks is a good one. If a good lot is available, it can be purchased and time will be saved.
sillymike
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I can still help you along a little. First, let's take a look at what is currently the most accurate rim fire in the world: Calfee Spec 5 "Black Death"
Barrel: Shilen Rachet, 24"
Trigger: Modified FF
Action: E-Turbo
Chamber: Calfee spec, 2° leade, 0.155" engraving
And I'm sure that in a benchrest match. Mr. Sherrill (using a sub-par rifle and ammunition) would kick my butt... even if I was using his best rifle/ammo combo...
And they are still here on tge East coast, Jeff.
Agreed, once built, its the ammo chase. Testing and finding a good lot, etc.
I could write a book, imported and got built about 2 dozen full blown rimfire bench rifles
only have a new hall left
got a JLC carstensen rail that was a v block and with click adjustable I converted it to a rimfire rail gun my friend still has
JLC used to sell dies made by BAT machine
calfee is a crook, stole a barrel that was a hummer, tried to blackmail a manufacture into getting a few free actions or he would blackball him and then calfee did
his guns don't shoot any better than about a dozen other builders
the chase is in the ammo,
most guns are pretty good, and it takes about 1500 rounds or more before you can even begin to tune a rimfire barrel
lilja makes the barrels for the high end rimfires name escapes me right now Bleiker and quite frankly
rimfire barrels shoot about 125 thousand rounds before wearing out but lilja pre wears them out for bleaker so they shoot lights out for only 40 thousand rounds
I have a pappas one piece rest made by him and it is jewelled just like his daughter Jessica the only 2 ever jewelled by pappas
it takes 2 years to become good and longer to become great
it is fun and entertaining and a real learning experience, but not easy
need 6 great windflags, balanced and set up the same
need a uppy downy flag if not 3 of them and maybe some wind probes by gene beggs a good friend who delivered some to the usa
nationals for me when I needed them when mine got stolen, he drov3e from texas to st loius for me and to visit his friends when he was not planning to go, a true friend
I and 2 others designed and had ian robertson make the JTR br stock used in over a dozen countries at the next worlds for shot range br
rimfire is difficult and just buying a great done does not automatically mean you can shoot 250's
maybe more later but I don't type so good
I can talk you off the ledge longshot then you change your name to lone shot he=he
later and yes the hall will be sold this year or next
only have a new hall left
got a JLC carstensen rail that was a v block and with click adjustable I converted it to a rimfire rail gun my friend still has
JLC used to sell dies made by BAT machine
calfee is a crook, stole a barrel that was a hummer, tried to blackmail a manufacture into getting a few free actions or he would blackball him and then calfee did
his guns don't shoot any better than about a dozen other builders
the chase is in the ammo,
most guns are pretty good, and it takes about 1500 rounds or more before you can even begin to tune a rimfire barrel
lilja makes the barrels for the high end rimfires name escapes me right now Bleiker and quite frankly
rimfire barrels shoot about 125 thousand rounds before wearing out but lilja pre wears them out for bleaker so they shoot lights out for only 40 thousand rounds
I have a pappas one piece rest made by him and it is jewelled just like his daughter Jessica the only 2 ever jewelled by pappas
it takes 2 years to become good and longer to become great
it is fun and entertaining and a real learning experience, but not easy
need 6 great windflags, balanced and set up the same
need a uppy downy flag if not 3 of them and maybe some wind probes by gene beggs a good friend who delivered some to the usa
nationals for me when I needed them when mine got stolen, he drov3e from texas to st loius for me and to visit his friends when he was not planning to go, a true friend
I and 2 others designed and had ian robertson make the JTR br stock used in over a dozen countries at the next worlds for shot range br
rimfire is difficult and just buying a great done does not automatically mean you can shoot 250's
maybe more later but I don't type so good
I can talk you off the ledge longshot then you change your name to lone shot he=he
later and yes the hall will be sold this year or next
Without knowing yer intended uses for the build, all I can recommend is sift through the Anschutz listings to get an idea on the build type & style you wish for.
Bring money.
https://www.anschutznorthamerica.com/factory-rifles.html
Ye could go Nutz and splurge on a Bleiker rifle as well. Bring even more money.
First thing that came to my mind.
