UPDATE #34 what would cause that much damage to a S&W Revolver

Striker said:
How do you fix the forcing cone in a case like this though?
Click to expand...

I think the procedure would be to remove the barrel, cut down the diameter of the barrel where it screws into the frame so the threads can be extended, then reinstall the barrel. The threads/trimming would need to be tweaked so the barrel tightens up as it is perfectly aligned with the frame.

Then a forcing cone cutter would be used to first trim the forcing cone for the correct cylinder gap, and finally a forcing cone reamer would put the correct chamfer on the inner edge.

Specialized tools like a frame clamp to remove the barrel and forcing cone cutters are required, along with a lathe, so not an easy or cheap job IMO.

If it will cost too much to fix you could always sell it AS IS and list all the problems and perhaps an up and coming gunsmith would like to try and fix.
 
Unless the crane is badly damaged, it shouldn't be a big job for a 'smith who knows how to do it, unless of course there are other problems involved as well. Here is a Brownell's document that describes the process on Ruger and S&W revolvers. http://www.brownells.com/userdocs/learn/Inst-230%20Yoke%20Crane%20Align%20Tool.pdf
Excerpt:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
With Smith & Wesson revolvers, remove the side plate screw that retains
the crane. Then remove the crane and cylinder assembly from the revolver.
Remove the cylinder assembly from the crane. It slips off the rear of the
crane on modern S&W’s. Older models require loosening and removing the
ejector rod.
The crane on either make of revolver should now be placed back into
the frame and the yoke/crane alignment tool inserted into the crane. The
knurled portion of the tool should be as far forward (in the direction of the
muzzle) as possible. Gently press the crane into its locked position while at
the same time depressing the cylinder release button on the Rugers or, on
Smiths, pushing the cylinder release button forward toward the muzzle.
With the crane in its locked position, slide the yoke/crane alignment tool
to the rear of the frame. The small projection on its end should slip snugly
and easily into the cylinder center pin hole in the frame. If it does not slide
into the cylinder pin hole, do not immediately assume that the crane is bent
or warped! The cylinder pin hole may be burred, or for some reason is no
longer concentric.
However, if the cylinder pin hole is in good shape, then you may be faced
with a warped crane. By noting the position of the end of the yoke/crane
alignment tool in relation to the cylinder pin hole you will be able to determine
the extent and direction of the crane warpage. This can normally be
corrected by carefully tapping the crane with a plastic-faced hammer. Under
no circumstances should a steel hammer be used to strike the crane, for the​
crane is relatively fragile and you risk damaging it. BE SURE to leave the
yoke/crane alignment tool in the crane to prevent the collapse or denting of
the crane tube. Check the crane in the revolver frame with Brownells
Yoke/Crane Alignment Tool after each adjustment. Remember, a little pressure​
goes a long way, so be VERY CAREFUL!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------​


The hardest part might be finding a gunsmith who has experience with this procedure in Canada.​





When i googled "revolver crane adjustment" i found an ad for a gunsmith who advertises fixing bent or misaligned cranes for $45, but in the USA of course.​





I'm no expert, but I think before i gave up on the project I would try and talk to some 'smiths in Canada who specialize in revolvers, and see what they say about it.​
 
I got my ATT today for Wortner, I will pack the gun and ship. I will you guys updated
I got a rough estimate at 60-90$ of labor to fix it
 
I believe that Wortners is a competant S&W gunsmith. The prices are reasonable and I haven't seen or heard a bad comment on his work yet.

Be prepared to wait and wait and wait etc to get it back. Apparently there is only one gunsmith and he is busy.

A 686 is a tough gun and well made and I was curious how it why it was fubared. These Gentleman above seem to have great advise.

I did not know those things!
 
Jethunter, I have had no dealings with Wortner, but MD Charlton in BC as close to an S&W guru as they come. No idea what he would charge if he needed to turn back the barrel to correct the forcing cone asymmetry, but it would be done right. I've got a couple of pieces he has worked on, and I couldn't be happier. Hope the OP has good results with Wortner. Be nice to have two real S&W gurus in Canada.

If there is another S&W guru lurking, call out! We need you.
 
[
My gun as multiple issues and I'm trying to figure out what to do with it. repair or sell it.

Here some of the problems I know
-The cylinder get out of timing, If I apply some pressure with my thumb it, while pulling back the hammer
-The cylinder locking slot show some wear and are burred out.
-The ejector rod is slightly crocked even if it as been replace with a bran new one
-The cylinder extractor star show some sign of wear where the hand touches
-The Forcing Cone edge are rounded on the left side and sharp on the right for some reason. [/QUOTE]

It sounds like a lot more than 700 round have been put through it.
But that is water that has already gone under the bridge, which make my comment useless.
 
DLM said:
It sounds like a lot more than 700 round have been put through it.
But that is water that has already gone under the bridge, which make my comment useless.
Click to expand...

If cylinder is out of aligment these problems appear in a fairly low rounds count

It's like driving a car out of alignement with Brand new tires. your Tread will melt like a Snow man under then desert sun

it dosent look that worn out to me
IMG_2654.jpg
 
Hi Volks_R_Us,

I would suggest having your firearm looked at by a competent smith with experience with revolvers.

You have mentioned numerous issues which may or may not be problems.

volks_r_us said:
-The cylinder get out of timing, If I apply some pressure with my thumb it, while pulling back the hammer
Click to expand...

Where are you applying pressure with your thumb? If you are applying thumb pressure to the cylinder when you pull back on the hammer you will induce DCU (doesn’t carry up or improper timing) on a properly functioning revolver.

If it is correctly diagnosed DCU and not user induced a few of the typical culprits could be:

- Worn ratchet
- Locking bolt out of alignment
- Burr on yoke
- Rod run out
- Yoke out of alignment
- Center pin out of alignment
- Hand skipping (worn or modified)
- Faulty stop action
- Debris under extractor star
- No front gauge



volks_r_us said:
-The cylinder locking slot show some wear and are burred out.
Click to expand...

If your cylinder stop window is burred, this may be your DCU problem but would need to be looked at as it’s not a common complaint.

volks_r_us said:
-The ejector rod is slightly crocked even if it as been replace with a bran new one
Click to expand...

Could be rod run out, would have to be looked at to be sure. If severe could cause DCU.

volks_r_us said:
-The cylinder extractor star show some sign of wear where the hand touches
Click to expand...

The extractors are fit at the factory and will have file (on older models) or cut marks (on newer models). If this is the wear you are speaking up, it’s common. If the cylinder is forcibly held while the trigger is pressed the hand will re-cut the extractor star and may now fail to throw the cylinder far enough to engage the cylinder stop (DCU).

volks_r_us said:
-The Forcing Cone edge are rounded on the left side and sharp on the right for some reason.
Click to expand...

Inside or outside edge? This would have to be looked at to determine if it is in fact a problem. If you have proper front gauge and the forcing cone passes plug test this may not be a problem at all. If you don’t, it could be causing DCU.


Improper timing will lead to lead shaving as you shoot (you may feel it blowing back in your face).

With the firearm unloaded and cylinder closed slowly press the trigger. You should hear 2 clicks before the hammer falls. Sometimes the second click happens only moments before the hammer falls so pay attention. Do this six times for each chamber, if all 12 clicks are present your timing should not be an issue. If the hammer falls and you are now able to apply slight pressure on the cylinder and rotate it into a locked position (second click) then the timing is off.

Take care and let us know how you make out.
 
Thanks Alot Silvercore . I wish I still have the revolver in my hands to check everything out.

What made me think the gun had a problem in the first time. Was that once every 5 to 10 shots in double or single action, after a factory 357mag round was fired the hammer and trigger would lock up. Until I put back the cylinder into his locking pin.

My guess is that the cylinder slots didnt turned all the way to the locking pin or it pop out of the pin after the shot was fired. Then causing hammer and Trigger lock up

As for the Forcing cone Edge it rounded on the Outside only on the left side

Thanks
 
It's Coming back :eek:

I got a Call Today from George at Wortner's.
I am still not sure what exactly he fixed but will know when I get the gun back. this, hopefuly should be next :runaway:
I didnt fully understand what he was talking about but all the old parts he changed will be with my gun in a box
 
I got back Today
Took 3 months, He replaced the Cylinder Stop , Bolt and Extractor
I noticed the trigger is no as nice as it used to be.
I will need to try it to make sure the recoil dosent screw the timing up
I think what is the Extrator for but I have no clue why he replaced the other 2 parts. I dont even know what they are for
IMG_3282.jpg
 
You got your gun back in three months?

He must like French Canadians because I have been waiting for over a year for mine!
 
corney said:
You got your gun back in three months?

He must like French Canadians because I have been waiting for over a year for mine!
Click to expand...

LOL ha:

Actually he is a really nice guy. Give him call ask him why it's so long.
I called for the first time 2 weeks ago, wondering why is was so long. He seems to have work WAY over his head. 2 weeks later he called me saying it was ready to be ship back to me.
I knew it would take several weeks but didnt expect 3 months. I guess it's like everything ,when you are the best you have work

What is wrong with your gun BTW ?
 
Oh I've called him. He seems like a nice guy. They told me initally it was going to take 7 weeks. That was last April.

Tommorrow its a Bonjour mon amie call for me.

It was the trigger stub and I needed a S&W repair depot to fix it. MD Charleton told me six to seven months so I choose George because it was to be back in 7 weeks. I'm sure he is busy and I believe his work is good, I just want my fricken gun back.
 
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