Using pull down powder for. 223

kevinm1980

kevinm1980

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So I have 2 lbs I pulled from surplus 7.62x54r 147gr bullets.. Each round had 48-49 gr of a powder that seems to be similar to 4895.. So going to use powder to try and work up a for 223 with 55gr bulk bullets going to start with 21gr of the pull down powder and work up.. To me this seems like a good safe starting point but would appreciate some input from other reloaders
 
I don't have a lot of experience with reloading yet, but what makes you think its similar to 4895? And is that H4895 or IMR4895? I was always taught to toss any unknown powders, but some more experienced reloaders should chime in soon.
 
Fivehundred... It's kinda a guess but load density and the speed of round suggest it's similar to surplus military 4895..
And I always use mag primers for 223.. And everything else.. If this works may be pulling apart Mor surplus ammo.. Lol
 
Will be a project this week to make some and work up to 23 grains.. And try them on a Chrono next weekend if 23 grains isn't enough may make more.. But just looking for blasting ammo so as long as it reliably cycles my ar-15 I'll be happy
 
First off, you can't tell what a powder is by looking at it. A great way to get into trouble fast.

Not sure of the velocities the cartridges delivered but what you need to figure out is the burn rate. In your case it should be relatively easy. Lots of info on velocity on the internet.

Also, CanadaAmmo has done a lot of playing with such powders and being the nice guy he is would likely be able to tell you exactly what you have and what it would be useful in.

Most powders used in such cartridges runs at around the same burn rate as IMR3031.

From your extremely brief description of the cartridge it could have been made anywhere from over 70 years ago to recently. Lots of different powders could have been used. Not only that a lot of different nations loaded the 7.62x54 for the Russians, then later the Soviets.

A couple of things seem to be fairly constant. 2800fps with 147 grn bullets out of an M91/30 and usually a powder charge of 48.0 grains. Cartridges of the World lists 49.0 grains of IMR3031 as approximating the military load.

I believe IMR3031 would be a good place to start. IMR4895 being slower MAY give you a hotter load than you want.

It would be a good place to start for two reasons. One it is faster than IMR4895 and would be more suitable for the 223. I like IMR3031 in the 223.

I have pulled the bullets from a lot of Czech and other Soviet satellite produced ball cartridges and have always used IMR3031 as a base to start from. Please follow safe starting procedures and work up you loads from minimum spec.
 
I've been using 22gr of 3031 in 223.. Just because I was buying for 36 a lb.. But this is cheaper and figured 21 gr was a good starting point.. Unless it's fast like 4198.. But can be because mosin would blow up.. Lol
 
21g is unlikely to cycle, unless the rifle is over-gassed like my Norinco. That will take about 23 to 24, depending on the rifle.

I suggest you load 5 of each, in o.5 increments, all the way to 26 gr.
 
Thanks for the advice! Hoping it works well.. I like cheap powder.. And the bullets I pulled are good for 303 win win
 
kevinm1980 said:
So I have 2 lbs I pulled from surplus 7.62x54r 147gr bullets.. Each round had 48-49 gr of a powder that seems to be similar to 4895.. So going to use powder to try and work up a for 223 with 55gr bulk bullets going to start with 21gr of the pull down powder and work up.. To me this seems like a good safe starting point but would appreciate some input from other reloaders
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Personally I would have bought a rifle to shoot those in without pulling them apart. I would never load a powder if I had no idea what it was, sounds like a good way to hurt yourself. I'd throw it in the campfire by the handful before I loaded it in a high pressure cartridge.

I wonder why you would do this rather than just buy a pound of powder? By the time you figure out what works and find a load that's decently accurate you'll be just about out of powder and it will have just been a waste of barrel life at a high risk of damage to yourself and your rifle.

I wish you luck and hope it works out well for you.
Be safe
 
cr5 said:
Personally I would have bought a rifle to shoot those in without pulling them apart. I would never load a powder if I had no idea what it was, sounds like a good way to hurt yourself. I'd throw it in the campfire by the handful before I loaded it in a high pressure cartridge.

I wonder why you would do this rather than just buy a pound of powder? By the time you figure out what works and find a load that's decently accurate you'll be just about out of powder and it will have just been a waste of barrel life at a high risk of damage to yourself and your rifle.

I wish you luck and hope it works out well for you.
Be safe
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H4831. Please chide him. I am tired of kids that never left the house without a full briefing and a string connecting their mittens.
 
You should have seen the stupid responses this question got on a Facebook reloading page. Most people said he is just going to blow up his gun and kill himself no matter what.
 
Yeah Facebook page was a good laugh, the way they were talking it was like I was going to fill a case full of bullseye... Lol I don't know what this powder is but am sure it somewhere between 3031 and 4350.. And that I'll end up with a charge somewhere between 21-27gr.. But after that realized those ppl must only reload one caliber follow the recipes exactly in modern manuals.. Which seem tame compared to older manuals.. Thay have no ambition to learn.. Paint by numbers ppl, what I'm doing is not necessary I have canister powder go through at least 2lbs a month.. I'm doing this out of curiosity and love for the hobby
 
"The desire for safety stands in the way of every great and noble enterprise"

-Tacitus

The powder is probably not too far off from the 4895s based on how much is in the loaded rounds and comparing it to Hodgdon's data for 150 grain bullets in 7.62x54R. You are unlikely to blow anything up if you start low and work up using 4895 data for .223.

Reloadng is like cooking. You don't always need an exact recipe if you can apply general principles and guidelines.
 
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