What difference does 200 fps make?

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Potashminer

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So, I've taken many deer with my 7x57 Ruger #1 - have always used Nosler 150 grain Partitions and they chrono @ 2,800 fps or so with RL-19, just like it says in the Nosler reloading manuals. So that load is down about 8 inches at 300 and almost 2 feet down at 400 (from a 200 yard "0"). As I understand it, the Partition wants at least 1,800 fps impact velocity, and this load has that out beyond 500 yards (much further than I have ever shot). I don't own one, but I suspect the 7mm-08 is right there as well.
I did take a cow elk with a 165 grain 308 Win, then took my last two elk with a 225 grain 338 Win Mag. Carried a 250 grain 9.3x62 this fall north of Grande Cache, Alberta. Just acquired a 375 H&H that I have no idea what I'll do with here in Manitoba. Bigger game = bigger hammer, I think I understand.
From Nosler manual, I see that a 280 Rem, on up through 7mm Weatherby will all do 200 fps up to 500 fps more than the 7x57, using 150 Partitions. For Western Canada deer hunting, is there anything positive accomplished with that extra speed? Conversely, having grandkids approaching the centerfire hunting age, if I dropped my loads by 200 fps and found an accuracy node, what would I be giving up?
 
For long range competition shooting, optimizing ballistic coefficient and velocity within an accuracy node will definitely help keep you in the game.
For hunting purposes at medium range, up to 500m-600m 200fps is going to be negligible to shooter or prey.
 
Just from point of view of impact performance 200 fps will make about 125 yards difference. What one will do, the faster one do 125 yards farther away more or less. 500 fps more will equal out about 300 yards farther away. It'll vary a bit but thats close enough for government work.

Most decent cartridges are rather impressive close up, slowly deteriorating to pretty good, then good enough, then dog####e as they lose velocity. If I can push the "impressive" portion out 2-300 yards farther I'm going to do it. Slow it down enough, and you may never see the "impressive" part in the first place. Keep the ranges short enough and even some mild cartridges look good, and if ranges are always short you may never know the difference.
 
We tend to discuss extremes on this forum, but the reality is most hunting does not require extreme long range shots. For western Canada deer hunting with a 7mm cartridge, 90% of the time there is no advantage to a bullet going faster than 2800 fps. If you don't shoot past 300 yards, and don't shoot in howling winds, you won't notice any practical difference comparing your 7x57 to a cartridge like the 7mm mag pushing the same bullet 200 fps faster.

You can usually get closer than 300 yards with some planning and effort. Some skilled shooters enjoy the challenge of long range precision shooting, and can actually make good use of fast, flat shooting and very accurate rifles. I know few of them. But they are rare. However some hunters don't have adequate hunting or shooting skills and won't make the effort to stalk close enough to compensate for lack of skills. They want to be able to shoot at pretty much anything they see, and figure better equipment is the answer. A fast accurate rifle won't help them, and wounded game is often the result.

A faster bullet will sometimes kill deer a little quicker, but I doubt you'd notice, and dead is dead. Faster does not equal "more dead" but does equal more ruined meat. I suspect Dogleg is one of the few who can make long range hunting rifles do good work waay out there, and as he mentioned, if you want or need to stretch your range then faster bullets might be better for clean kills if you can accurately place those rare long shots.

To summarize, in a few rare circumstances for a few very skilled shooters very fast, ultra accurate rifles are a real advantage. I prefer to focus on choosing a hunting rifle that fits me, that i can use instinctively and intuitively to shoot quickly when a close / fast opportunity arises, that has no flaws in form or function and is precise enough from improvised rest field positions that i cannot blame a miss on the rifle, but on my marksmanship.
 
Your 7mm 150 grain partition started slower will still kill and as has been stated you probably won't notice a lot of difference inside 300 yards. It may be worth considering a lighter bullet for low recoil game killing with your grand kids. I'd suggest the 120 TTSX and Ballistic tip, the TTSX driven to 2970 fps in my 7mm08 is mild in recoil and kills well.

Where larger cases and powder charges shine is launching heavier bullets at useful speeds to produce effective killing on large game, in my mind at least. Everything else has been stated. While all NA game has been and can still be killed with a 175 grain bullet in a 7x57 that same bullet from a larger case made shooting beyond 200 yards much easier in the era before BDC reticles, turrets and laser range finders were at everyone's disposal.
 
In normal hunting conditions and ranges (the average hunter is lucky to shoot out to 300 yds) an extra 200 fps makes no noticeable difference.

The animal will be just as dead.
 
Had to read your post to understand the question. I think I get what you are asking. To confirm.

In all cases we are talking about the exact same bullet weight and diameter, a 150 gr Nosler Partition in .284".
You are contemplating shooting this bullet from different cartridges that generate different velocities,
You are contemplating shooting this bullet from the same rifle, at a reduced velocity.

As you said, you need 1800 FPS for optimal performance on impact. For your purposes, the main effect of changing MV is to affect the maximum distance at which you can engage an target while maintaining your minimum of 1800 FPS on impact.

Using jbm ballistics software, 150 gr Nosler partition
@ 2600 FPS drops below 1800 FPS at 380 Meters - 200 FPS from baseline
@ 2800 FPS drops below 1800 FPS at 460 Meters Your baseline
@ 3000 FPS drops below 1800 FPS at 540 Meters +200 FPS from baseline
@ 3300 FPS drops below 1800 FPS at 660 Meters +500 FPS from baseline

So in terms of reducing your MV 200 FPS to make a softer recoil for your kids, you are giving up 80 meters of your max range to maintain 1800 FPS impact V.

Does that answer your question?
 
Lets consider 3 examples, 180 gr Partition bullets loaded in the .308 at 2600 fps, .30/06 at 2800 fps, and the .300 Winchester at 3000 fps.

If in each case the rifle is sighted 2" high at 100 yards, the .308's bullet will cross the line of sight at about 190 yards, the .30/06 bullet will cross the line of sight at about 210 yards, and the .300 Winchester bullet will cross the line of sight at about 230 yards.

With this same sighting, the bullet will drop 6" below the line of sight at about 265 yards for the .308, about 290 yards for the .30/06, and about 310 yards for the .300 Winchester.

The .300 Winchester will have an inch of wind drift (10 mph full value wind) at about 125 yards. The .30/06 wind drift is an inch at about 120 yards. The .308 wind drift is an inch at about 115 yards.
 
Just off the top of my head, for field shooting white-tailed deer, the 2800 fps cartridge with a 100yd zero (typical) you will be holding off target at 300+ yards a 3200 fps cartridge you will be holding off target at 400+ yards.
There all kinds of variables though, skill, range estimation, shooting position, available light, terrain, wind. The list goes on, generally speaking the faster cartridge can help mitigate some of these.
 
If you drop the velocity down by 200 fps with the 7X57 you will only loose 1.5" in trajectory at 300 yds. So instead of 8" low you would be 9.5" low. You would have 1400 ft-lbs of energy, down from 1650 ft-lbs at 300 yds. It won't make much difference to a deer.
 
In the real world the difference is this. Yrs ago I shot a bull elk at 400 yds broadside centered perfect. The elk fell down then got up & made it 3 to 400 yds in the bush. It took till 2 am to find it & I was close to not finding it. The 308 bullet had entered one lung only & not gone through the 2nd. At that point I switched up to a 7mm with 175 grn bullets & later a 300 wsm. You can't plan your shot so having at least some extra umph is valuable. At least for large game like elk.
 
200 fps +/- is insignificant to 2" +/- of better shot placement... learn to shoot what you have.
 
200fps makes a significant enough difference in mountain hunting to be real, as Dogleg illustrated it, it puts your muzzle ballistically 125 yards closer to the animal.

With an average shot of about 220 on mountain goats, the bullet acting like it’s at 95y is a significant plus. More so when you’re looking at the 375y shot on the billy / ram of a lifetime, with a bullet that could act like it’s at 250.

I’ve noticed a large detereoration in bullet performance just above the 2000fps mark, delaying that for another 125 yards is meaningful in my eyes.
 
Potashminer said:
So, I've taken many deer with my 7x57 Ruger #1 - have always used Nosler 150 grain Partitions and they chrono @ 2,800 fps or so with RL-19, just like it says in the Nosler reloading manuals. So that load is down about 8 inches at 300 and almost 2 feet down at 400 (from a 200 yard "0"). As I understand it, the Partition wants at least 1,800 fps impact velocity, and this load has that out beyond 500 yards (much further than I have ever shot). I don't own one, but I suspect the 7mm-08 is right there as well.
I did take a cow elk with a 165 grain 308 Win, then took my last two elk with a 225 grain 338 Win Mag. Carried a 250 grain 9.3x62 this fall north of Grande Cache, Alberta. Just acquired a 375 H&H that I have no idea what I'll do with here in Manitoba. Bigger game = bigger hammer, I think I understand.
From Nosler manual, I see that a 280 Rem, on up through 7mm Weatherby will all do 200 fps up to 500 fps more than the 7x57, using 150 Partitions. For Western Canada deer hunting, is there anything positive accomplished with that extra speed? Conversely, having grandkids approaching the centerfire hunting age, if I dropped my loads by 200 fps and found an accuracy node, what would I be giving up?
Click to expand...

I love the journey of load development and achieving the most out of the cartridge. All of the rifles I had custom built always had a 27" or 28" barrel to exceed velocities from the reloading manual, and it always worked. A 200 fps increase in speed is what I would advocate, for my personal purpose. Flat shooting cartridges is a useful value in the Great Plains or wide open fields of Alberta and Saskatchewan. It came in handy a few times for me, however for the most part, a long stalk to reduce the shooting distance did the trick. My flat shooting rifles are there,"just in case" big boy steps out and the long shot (500 yards) is my only choice.
 
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