what milsurp for military competition?

simko

simko

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my local range hosts annual competition, any military rifle can be used, im not expecting a sub moa rifle, but i was wondering if there are any military rifles that are inherently very accurate? Id prefer not to do a lot of mods, but if theres a relatively inexpensive military rifle that i can accurize that would be neat too.

Aaron
 
EOHC has a milsurp competition 3 or 4 times a year - any unmodified pre 1945 design.
I usually end up picking a rifle I haven't shot in a couple of years just because I can.

No prizes if we win, just CGN bragging rights but it's always neat to see how well you can do with a gun you haven't shot for a while (and sometimes have never shot before).
 
simko said:
my local range hosts annual competition, any military rifle can be used, im not expecting a sub moa rifle, but i was wondering if there are any military rifles that are inherently very accurate? Id prefer not to do a lot of mods, but if theres a relatively inexpensive military rifle that i can accurize that would be neat too.

Aaron
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Swedish mauser, M96 or M38 doesnt matter much, both have superb accuracy :)
Jocelyn
 
The most accurate is a Swiss K31. Those with good bores will get sub MOA with no mods. Mines does with issue sights if I can hold it. Used a Swede Mauser before until I found one of these. K31's with very good bores are easy to find ATM.
 
The Swede is accurate, if your eyes work with open sights. Mine don't any more.

The Lee Enfield #4 has a peep sight that can be zeroed and works much better with older eyes. That is what I would use.
 
it's much more the gunner than the gun, but over the past few years, the highest consistently ranking guns at the EOHC match have been the:

- K31
- Garand
- Swedish m/96
- P14/17
- LE No 4

in roughly that order.
 
Someday, some old vet of the vintage/service rifle comps. will write a book on this. Perhaps even forworded by a world shooting icon like Larry Fish.
Meanwhile the shooting world waits a bit longer.............
 
My first choice would be a Garand particularly if shooting timed or rapid relays or any match requiring quick reloads. I own and shoot other rifles that are more accurate but my M1 will do 2-21/2" off the bench at 100 yds. Most vintage rifle matches are not shot from a bench so MOA is not as important as excellant easily ajusted sights ,rapid reloads, 8 round capacity etc. And the ping is just cool.

To meet your criteria of relatively inexpensive (and if it doesn't have to be pre 45) then a Norinco M14 has many of the good features of the Garand.
 
PP has the right idea. There is NUTHIN' that can keep up with a decent Ross.

Buddy and myself entered an ironsight comp at CFB Shilo a number of years ago. There were 23 teams and we were the ONLY one with two bolt rifles; all other teams had one or more SA or selective-fire rifles. We came in 10th place, shooting reactive steels against beltfeds and semi-autos. Our round count was about 50%, as compared to 2 to 3% for the Minimis. You won't have that problem.

I would point out that the 74/75-point 1100-yard Bisley target was shot 101 years ago..... by a Ross. It has been equalled 3 times but it has never been beaten.

Failing a decent Ross, a really good P-'14 is really hard to beat and a Number 4 is good competition for almost anything. SMLE sights are the same pattern as the MN 91/30; it just took the Russians 23 years to catch up. SMLE is capable of very decent shooting with a minimum of work.

Properly bedded and with a trigger job, ANY of them can do the job if you can work with the sights. Aperture sights are the best, post forward sight almost a necessity. That silly barleycorn-and-V-notch should have been scrapped in 1865..... British DID scrap it in 1907, come to think of it.

Most important point of all: be sure to have fun!
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The Ljungman AG42 is very accurate and surprisingly cheap. There are a couple listed in the EE for less than $350. The 6.5x55 on its own is a very accurate round. I also agree with the guys who suggest using the M96.
 
You guys are worried about MOA type ability? I just wish that my old guy eyes were MOA capable. Hell, I'm happy to just SEE an 8.5 x11 target at 200 yards, let alone hit the darn thing! ! ! ! :D

I'm OK at 100. Managed a 5'ish inch group the other day with a really nice shooting flintlock off some simple front bags. That's about par for me and basic iron sights at that distance.
 
Can you guys that have club competitions for these old pre '45 rifles describe the event a bit more? I'm keen on trying something with my local club that uses the classic milsurp guns. But I'm not sure how best to set up the event.
 
Depends how much range you have.

If you have 300 yards or so, just put up a batch of steels of varying sizes at random ranges. Put a time limit on the shoot, best time to clear the field wins. This goes hand in hand with 'hits count first, then time': 1 left up in 9 minutes beats 2 left up in 3 minutes. Shoot a STOP plate to stop the clock; any targets left standing count against you.

Or you can do a match on the same basis, but with limited rounds: 15 targets, 16 rounds, 6 minutes time limit.

Do it like a curling match: A side and B side from shooting team against team, match winner is the result of the A and B winners having a shoot-off. This one is fun; everybody gets to shoot twice, some will have to shoot 3 or 4 times. Better bring enough ammo!

At Shilo and at Ft. la Bosse club, practical matches with period gear, time limits, obstacles, razor wire and all the fun and games.

Or if you have enough room, do a walk-up. Start at 600, 5 rounds prone supported, 500 is 5 rounds prone unsupported, 400 is 5 rounds sitting, 300 is 5 rounds kneeling, 200 is 5 rounds squatting, 100 is 5 rounds standing.

Or a bowling-pin match: half a dozen barrels from pointblank to 250 or so, 3 bowling pins standing on each one. Shoot the pins OFF the barrels to score..... and it can be really hard to scoop one off the top with a .303 after it has fallen, impossible with a .223.

You can think up lots more from that.

Have fun!
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Swedish m/96 Mauser FSR rifle. These have adjustable aperture sights on them. Many were bought privately, but many were also owned by the Swedish Army and loaned to various Gun Clubs in Sweden.

In the time period you are setting, (before 1945,) Sweden had Conscription, and when the Army released you, then you became a member of the Militia up to 60 years old if necessary. You also had to spend two weeks every year on Military Service, and qualify on the rifle range. An issued rifle, equipment and ammunition was kept at home and the Hemvarnet, (Home Guard) could mobilize within 12 to 24 hours. In case anyone thinks that the Home Guard of Sweden was not an effective force, their first duty was "to PROTECT THE ARMY while it mobilizes". Every man was a trained Soldier who kept his skills up during the years, especially his shooting skills.
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