What to do with a Win 54

Kazul

Kazul

Member
EE Expired
Rating - 100%
2   0   0
Location
South of Heaven
I have this old(1926) Win mod 54 (.270) that I got from my dad. He insists that it was scoped. The scope he gave me that he says was on it is damaged,the crosshairs fell out??
When I put the Weaver bases and rings on and put a straight edge on the rings it seems impossible that any scope would fit. Unless it was raised up 1" or more. The bolt rotates so far up that it contacts the scope.I've been to a few shops and the either want to cut and re-weld the bolt at less of an angle or scallop it out to just miss the scope.I'm not wanting to make any mods if possible.

It does have a side mounted Williams peep. The front part of the sight screws out. Is it possible to get something that would put crosshairs in the screw part?? or is it meant to be open and you center the front blade sight in it?
kazul13

kazul13

100_1125.jpg

100_1152.jpg

This is my back-up/ lend-out rifle. Most people are scared of an iron sight gun.That's why I'm looking for scope options.It's also killed alot of deer for my grandfather and father and I'd like to uphold the tradition.

The gun shoots great, 1 1/2" groups at 100M from a sand bag rest with factory ammo.

Any ideas would be appreciated.
 
Last edited:
that is surprising, I have a M54 (~1931) and teh bolt handle is exaclty the same as a pre-war Model 70, and it clears with weaver bases/rings easily.

you pics aren;t showing up btw
 
Win 54

I would highly advise you to not alter the rifle. That is a good "peep" sight set up. Use as is, or for hunting, most people would take out the insert and use the larger aperature to sight through. Your eye will automatically centre the rear hole and the larger size will allow a greater field of view.
For target shooting, or sighting in, you could screw in the insert. You will be suprised at the good groups that can be fired with good aperature sights.
 
Um thanks, I had thought I had fixed the picture link.:redface:

Altering the rifle isn't an option.
It's tapped for a scope so I figured it was easy to scope.
With the iron sights I can comfortably shoot 100M but this cal. should shoot to 300M without a problem.I can't see,too well, a dinner plate at 300M but if I can see it in a scope than I can hit it. That's one of the main reasons for trying to scope this oldie.It will extend it's "usefull" distance.
 
I recall seeing pics of early Winchesters scoped with small diameter scopes (7/8") mounted so the ocular was slightly ahead of the bolt handle. If you can find a low powered scope with lots of eye relief mounting it in that fashion might work for you.
 
I agree 100% with H4831.

When I saw this thread title I was afraid you were going to butcher a classic rifle.

can you post a picture of a scope mounted and the clearnace problem with the bolt handle? Does you scope have a very large bell? The bolt handle looks likeit should work with something like a 3X or 4X scope.

I see your point about it being a 300 yard rifle, if you can see the target. A 270 is a potent long range rifle.

But, if it cannot work with a scope, maybe it can be your "rain & snow" rifle. I always take such a back up rifle on a hunt. It hsa been used in heavy snow falls; when my 'good" rifle go dropped into deep mud; and as a loaner when a guy showed up with no bolt in his rifle.

My rain rifles have a bright red plastic tube front sight. (Williams Firehawk??)This collects light and the front sight looks like a red dot when you aim. It replaces the metal front sight on the rifle.

As I write this I am on vacation in a little village in Tuscony. Just met a guy returning from rabbit hunting with a nice looking Berreta shotgun. Anyway, can't peak into my gunroom to check whatsight that is.


This rifle deserves to be used again.
 
I agree 100% with H4831.

When I saw this thread title I was afraid you were going to butcher a classic rifle.

can you post a picture of a scope mounted and the clearnace problem with the bolt handle? Does you scope have a very large bell? The bolt handle looks likeit should work with something like a 3X or 4X scope.

I see your point about it being a 300 yard rifle, if you can see the target. A 270 is a potent long range rifle.

But, if it cannot work with a scope, maybe it can be your "rain & snow" rifle. I always take such a back up rifle on a hunt. It hsa been used in heavy snow falls; when my 'good" rifle go dropped into deep mud; and as a loaner when a guy showed up with no bolt in his rifle.

My rain rifles have a bright red plastic tube front sight. (Williams Firehawk??)This collects light and the front sight looks like a red dot when you aim. It replaces the metal front sight on the rifle.

As I write this I am on vacation in a little village in Tuscony. Just met a guy returning from rabbit hunting with a nice looking Berreta shotgun. Anyway, can't peak into my gunroom to check whatsight that is.

This rifle deserves to be used again.
 
new pics

Here are some pics with the scope on it??
I'm thinking that this scope never fit on this rifle.It's about 3" from the bolt touching the scope until where it needs to go.
The bell on the scope is 1.44" in diameter. It would need to be about 7/8"(by my guessing) for the bolt handle to pass it,but then I don't think there would be enough clearance to hold on to the handle without banging your nuckles into the scope all of the time.

Sorry for the large size but the button on my camera to change sizes is broken(damn kids)
100_1239_00.jpg

100_1233_00.jpg
 
I think you'll find that the rifle has already been modified from original by the drilling and tapping of at least two holes. Not sure if they came drilled and tapped in the front receiver ring or not, certainly not in the rear receiver bridge. Mounts of the day actually screwed on using the receiver sight holes on the side and some were dovetailed into the rear sight dovetail for a front ring. Scopes at that time were smaller in diameter and frequently sat further forward than current scopes.

I think your options may be limited to finding thicker scope bases and/or higher scope rings if you don't wish to modify the bolt. Whether any will actually accomodate a scope and allow bolt clearance I don't know.
 
stocker said:
I think you'll find that the rifle has already been modified from original by the drilling and tapping of at least two holes. Not sure if they came drilled and tapped in the front receiver ring or not, certainly not in the rear receiver bridge. Mounts of the day actually screwed on using the receiver sight holes on the side and some were dovetailed into the rear sight dovetail for a front ring. Scopes at that time were smaller in diameter and frequently sat further forward than current scopes.

I think your options may be limited to finding thicker scope bases and/or higher scope rings if you don't wish to modify the bolt. Whether any will actually accomodate a scope and allow bolt clearance I don't know.
Click to expand...

None of my 54's are drilled. Your gun has been worked on already. But I dont think Id let anyone work on your bolt. Not worth it.
 
Your M54 may have been factory tapped for scope bases. I found the following on the net - hope it helps

"The M54's which were factory tapped for scope (top) mounts have three holes, two in the front ring and one in the back. I believe this was the only D&T pattern used. The rear bridge of the M54 has a little groove and the mount must fit in this groove to fit correctly. Redfield one piece (SR) base is the only one I have seen for this rifle, though I believe Weaver also made one piece bases. Many rifles were later drilled and tapped in the M70 pattern in the rear (adding another hole spaced for the M70 bases) and M70 bases can be used but fit is less than desirable, due to the groove.
If you have an original M54 with the three screw holes, search for the Redfield base, then of course the std Redfield/Leupold rings can be used. They are no longer made but can be found on the shelf here and there. Try Brownells's. I have an older catalogue that lists the Redfield base for them."[/I]
 
Finally referred to my Madis books. It illustrates a factory custom grade rifle with the front receiver ring drilled and tapped. No holes in the rear receiver bridge other than the two side holes for receiver sight and rear scope mount combined. The book does refer to some rifles with heavy target barrels that had additional provision for scope mounting including receiver and barrel block mounting but does not specify the nature of any additional holes in the receiver. Gunsters source may be correct or it may only apply to the heavy target models. My guess is that if the 1 piece Redfield base was used it also required alteration of the bolt handle and there were certainly lots of them altered.
 
If the rifle is of no historical significance, I see no real problem with a bolt handle alteration since the rifle, as others have pointed out, has already been altered with the drilling for a rear scope base. I am an advocate of making the rifle work for the owner unless there is a pressing reason not to do so. To this end I have cheerfully altered various "collectible" rifles for my own use. That this practice may cause some uneven tooth wear (from gnashing) amongst the collectors is not a cause for serious concern IMO.
Your choices are to mount the scope quite high, in European fashion, or to alter the handle. From a functional standpoint, the second option is better. Just have it done by someone who will do a nice job. Regards, Bill.
 
I'd hate to just keep it as a snowy day rifle,it has so much long range potential.

I'll get some higher bases and try that.I'm not sure that will work. It seems to have to go up rather high,but I don't have to change anything to try. I don't like the looks/function of really high bases but I'll try them if I can find some high enough.


Further modifications to this rifle are NOT an option, regardless of what has all ready been done to it.


I'm leaning towards just working with the iron sights and keeping it a close(150M max) range/hunting rifle. I'll look in the e/e or other places for a small diameter moderatly priced scope to try.Or if I can find a one piece redfield base I'll try that. I don't think that's what it was tapped for(due to 4 holes not 3) but I'll give it a try if I come across one.

Again, Thank you for all of you help.
 
I have a Model 54 in 7mm that has not been drilled and tapped but has a peep site on it, also have some orignal bullets from the 1950 and the gun has had less than 200 rounds put through it as the barrel has been checked as perfect by a gun smith in Ontario many years ago. The only damage is where sombody put the wrong peep sight on and notched the stock a bit. Just my thoughts. Johnny G1
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom