whats the best load for sporting clays.
- Thread starter czscotia
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If I got money to spend I will buy AA12 1 1/8 8 and 7.5 at 3 dram load should be 1200 fps but for practice and even matches I will use the winchester target 1 1/8 at 1150 fps 8's or 7.5 after a 100 plus rounds of shooting they do not beat me up at all.I do not like the fast loads 1250 fps and up they kick to much and are very snappy you are only breaking a target not killing game.
The faster the ammo, the worst the pattern! Also much more recoil! A supersonic shotshell looses velocity at twice the rate of a subsonic. Bottom line: SLOW 1 1/8 Oz loads out perform 1 Oz 1300 + FPS loads at distance. For those who say the faster loads make more smoke when hitting a target, that is all below 30 yards! While there is a .1 ft/lb difference at 40 yards in energy, there are more pellets in the core of the slower load and mre pellets equal a better break. It is all physics and math and not a presumption!
Regards,
Henry
Regards,
Henry
I like a pretty hot load for sporting clays. Especially the club I'm at tends to have some pretty good distances and some targets that pop into view late and pop out early. The Remington Nitros are a pretty great sporting clay load, I think they are around 1350fps. They do beat you up a bit after a little while at the range.
The faster the ammo, the worst the pattern! Also much more recoil! A supersonic shotshell looses velocity at twice the rate of a subsonic. Bottom line: SLOW 1 1/8 Oz loads out perform 1 Oz 1300 + FPS loads at distance. For those who say the faster loads make more smoke when hitting a target, that is all below 30 yards! While there is a .1 ft/lb difference at 40 yards in energy, there are more pellets in the core of the slower load and mre pellets equal a better break. It is all physics and math and not a presumption!
Regards,
Henry
How slow is slow? Can you recommend a specific round?
I use Federal Gold Medal paper and Winchester AA at 2 3/4 Dram. Even the Winchester Extra Light work (1145 fps). At 40 plus yards, it is a decimal points of difference between supersonic and subsonic loads. But by patterning, ALL the subsonics have denser and better patterns than the supersonic. So, if we adhere to the three pellets to break a target, you got many more pellets on the target with the subsonic loading.
Ths past Sunday, we had a target that would break after you dropped the gun from the shoulder. That is over 40 yards. I did not change chokes and kept the Muller IC in. The Federal Gold Medal paper 8 showed better breaks and even smoke compared to the guys shooting LM and Mod.
The only problem with the slow stuff: it shoots one to two chokes tighter in a well performing barrel like the Beretta Optima. To get spread on the closer stuff, I use Federal Top Gun or Remington Gun Club both a 3 drams.
Try a simple test. Shoot a load/choke combination into a lake at +- 30 yards. Shoot the fast stuff and then shoot the slow stuff. The slow stuff has less spread. You don't even have to go to the patterning board for that easy visual! I do that for the non-belivers during a practice round. It really changes their perception about ammo!
Henry
Ths past Sunday, we had a target that would break after you dropped the gun from the shoulder. That is over 40 yards. I did not change chokes and kept the Muller IC in. The Federal Gold Medal paper 8 showed better breaks and even smoke compared to the guys shooting LM and Mod.
The only problem with the slow stuff: it shoots one to two chokes tighter in a well performing barrel like the Beretta Optima. To get spread on the closer stuff, I use Federal Top Gun or Remington Gun Club both a 3 drams.
Try a simple test. Shoot a load/choke combination into a lake at +- 30 yards. Shoot the fast stuff and then shoot the slow stuff. The slow stuff has less spread. You don't even have to go to the patterning board for that easy visual! I do that for the non-belivers during a practice round. It really changes their perception about ammo!
Henry
speed of sound
speed of sound in air at stp is roughly 1130 fps, lower at higher elevations and decreases with air density(Pressure). you would need a pretty soft load to get under the speed of sound with a shot shell.
recoil is a function of projectile weight not speed, at an equal speed a 7/8 oz load has less recoil than the 1 1/8 because pellet energy is the same for both loads. push the 7/8 oz load to a higher muzzle velocity and recoil will increase. but the time that the force acts on the shooter is less than the 1 1/8 so the perception of recoil changes. Some people are more sensitive to this.
My own opinion with trap and sporting clays is: "speed kills". I'd rather have a few less pellets going faster, than a whole lot of pellets going relatively slower. some else said it here a miss is a miss doesn't matter if it is by inches or feet. A fast first shot on a double, gives you more time to catch up to and hit the second.
The faster the ammo, the worst the pattern! Also much more recoil! A supersonic shotshell looses velocity at twice the rate of a subsonic. Bottom line: SLOW 1 1/8 Oz loads out perform 1 Oz 1300 + FPS loads at distance. For those who say the faster loads make more smoke when hitting a target, that is all below 30 yards! While there is a .1 ft/lb difference at 40 yards in energy, there are more pellets in the core of the slower load and mre pellets equal a better break. It is all physics and math and not a presumption!
Regards,
Henry
speed of sound in air at stp is roughly 1130 fps, lower at higher elevations and decreases with air density(Pressure). you would need a pretty soft load to get under the speed of sound with a shot shell.
recoil is a function of projectile weight not speed, at an equal speed a 7/8 oz load has less recoil than the 1 1/8 because pellet energy is the same for both loads. push the 7/8 oz load to a higher muzzle velocity and recoil will increase. but the time that the force acts on the shooter is less than the 1 1/8 so the perception of recoil changes. Some people are more sensitive to this.
My own opinion with trap and sporting clays is: "speed kills". I'd rather have a few less pellets going faster, than a whole lot of pellets going relatively slower. some else said it here a miss is a miss doesn't matter if it is by inches or feet. A fast first shot on a double, gives you more time to catch up to and hit the second.
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My favorite source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_sound says it is slightly faster than that. The previous poster stated that the difference between 1200ft/s and 1300ft/s is 10ths of a second. he is correct.
Recoil is force (gunpowder) acting against mass (shot) Higher velocity requires more force and more force = more recoil. The only way to reduce recoil and increase speed is to reduce mass.
I think what you experiencing is a wider pattern. The higher velocity spreads the shot more...
Phatman, well done! Recoil is powder charge, pellet and wad weight and speed! Actualy slow and heavy is better than fast and light! We realised this shooting IHMSA metal targets many years ago. Speed only looks impressive within 25 or so yards. At distance, more slow pellets are more impressive due to the denser center core!
If one wants to be more informed on ballistics: www.shotgunreport.com My good friend Bruce Buck has spent much more time on patterns and testing of loads!
Regards,
Henry
If one wants to be more informed on ballistics: www.shotgunreport.com My good friend Bruce Buck has spent much more time on patterns and testing of loads!
Regards,
Henry
Personally I prefer slightly faster loads because I feel they are somewhat forgiving on lead, especially if one tends to underlead a bit. It's true that there is apparently a small difference between slow loads at 1145 and those I shoot in skeet and trap at 1200 (1 oz and 7/8 oz; about 3 or 4 inches the of travel at the distances I am shooting the last time I tried to calculate it out.) But, like I said, difference seems to help with lead. I accept that slower loads yield somewhat denser patterns, but I don't think the difference in density is all that significant. The loads I am using certainly pattern very well and I can't honestly say I have shot at a bird in the past few years that I felt went through a hole. Just my $0.02 worth, of course, but I'm kind of with Tommy G on this one.
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When I started shooting trap I used 3 dram loads for my handicap and switch to 2 3/4 dram for singles. Then doubles fist shot was the light load and second shot was the heavy load.
Now I just use the 2 3/4 dram load for everything. I have found it to pattern better in my shotgun and is easyer on my shoulder after 200-300 rounds in a day.
Find the load your shotgun likes and use it for everything, with in the rules of course.
Now I just use the 2 3/4 dram load for everything. I have found it to pattern better in my shotgun and is easyer on my shoulder after 200-300 rounds in a day.
Find the load your shotgun likes and use it for everything, with in the rules of course.
Winchester makes a AA at less than 1000 fps.
As far as lead goes the gain with super fast is small. Often when we miss it is by quite a bit more. Just me, but on my first shot on doubles, speed of load does not matter much but amount of recoil does matter a lot. Less recoil allows me a faster recovery for second shot
