Where by ammo for Steyr M95 8x56R
- Thread starter trip43
- Start date
TRADEX (tan button at top of page) actually HAS the brass in stock right now. Partizan, Boxer primed, unfired, new. They also have dies, etc.
LEE PRECISION makes a nice die set which works okay.
Tradex also HAS the virtually-unobtainable bullets for this critter, just listed them a couple of days ago. .330" diameter, 208 grains
Gun-show ammo marked with Eagle and Swastika is Austrian-produced after the Anschluss. Sometime you will run into earlier ammo produced while they were independent.
Stuff with a STANDING BEAR is Bulgarian, Sofia Arsenal, and I have seen it as late as 1944. Nice ammo but every bit as corrosive as the stuff my Uncle Bob makes out in the garage!
If you get some ammo, DON'T throw the CLIPS away! There are none being made now, anywhere. They reload easily, anyway.
Just don't buy ALL that brass and ALL those slugs before my pension cheque gets here! I need a bit, too!
Hope this helps.
LEE PRECISION makes a nice die set which works okay.
Tradex also HAS the virtually-unobtainable bullets for this critter, just listed them a couple of days ago. .330" diameter, 208 grains
Gun-show ammo marked with Eagle and Swastika is Austrian-produced after the Anschluss. Sometime you will run into earlier ammo produced while they were independent.
Stuff with a STANDING BEAR is Bulgarian, Sofia Arsenal, and I have seen it as late as 1944. Nice ammo but every bit as corrosive as the stuff my Uncle Bob makes out in the garage!
If you get some ammo, DON'T throw the CLIPS away! There are none being made now, anywhere. They reload easily, anyway.
Just don't buy ALL that brass and ALL those slugs before my pension cheque gets here! I need a bit, too!
Hope this helps.
No, not yet. Have to wait for the pension cheque to get here so I can develop one!
However, Barnes in CARTRIDGES OF THE WORLD - 6th Edition, gives:
46 grains of 3031 with a 198 for 2310 MV and 2358 ft/lbs ME
45 grains of 3031 with a 206 for 2300 MV and 2420 ft/lbs ME
FACTORY LOAD with a 206/8 for 2034 MV and 2233 ft/lbs ME
Considering the factory levels with this round, I really don't like the idea of going almost 300 ft/sec faster with a 208 slug.
On the other hand, the original stuff WAS loaded with a square-flake powder which would not burn as progressively as the IMR types.
Still, I don't think I would exceed these loadings: my arthritis is quite bad enough now!
If you are loading for the Carbine or the Stutzer, it would be a REALLY good idea to stick to quick-burning powders, although you might go to a more progressive powder for the longer Rifle.
Still, the original loading for the 1888/90 cartridge, with its slightly-smaller case, as used in the Model 95 had a 244-grain slug popping out the muzzle at 2030 and the commercial loads ran at 2100! For power, these pretty much equalled a .303, but each time with a heavier bullet, going a bit slower.
I HAVE fired my Bulgarian 95 long Rifle with original Bulgarian 1944 stuff and can state (most authoritatively, my shoulder tells me) that recoil is definitely there!
Have fun with the toy and let us know how things come out.
Be nice to see a few more of these back on the ranges.
However, Barnes in CARTRIDGES OF THE WORLD - 6th Edition, gives:
46 grains of 3031 with a 198 for 2310 MV and 2358 ft/lbs ME
45 grains of 3031 with a 206 for 2300 MV and 2420 ft/lbs ME
FACTORY LOAD with a 206/8 for 2034 MV and 2233 ft/lbs ME
Considering the factory levels with this round, I really don't like the idea of going almost 300 ft/sec faster with a 208 slug.
On the other hand, the original stuff WAS loaded with a square-flake powder which would not burn as progressively as the IMR types.
Still, I don't think I would exceed these loadings: my arthritis is quite bad enough now!
If you are loading for the Carbine or the Stutzer, it would be a REALLY good idea to stick to quick-burning powders, although you might go to a more progressive powder for the longer Rifle.
Still, the original loading for the 1888/90 cartridge, with its slightly-smaller case, as used in the Model 95 had a 244-grain slug popping out the muzzle at 2030 and the commercial loads ran at 2100! For power, these pretty much equalled a .303, but each time with a heavier bullet, going a bit slower.
I HAVE fired my Bulgarian 95 long Rifle with original Bulgarian 1944 stuff and can state (most authoritatively, my shoulder tells me) that recoil is definitely there!
Have fun with the toy and let us know how things come out.
Be nice to see a few more of these back on the ranges.
- Location
- Tucson, Arizona
dosing, a friend, whose father was in the Austrian army in WW1 told him they used to do the same thing when they ran short of their own ammunition.
however you might look at www.buffaloarms.com for the brass.
however you might look at www.buffaloarms.com for the brass.
Montreal was still in Canada, last I looked.
TRADEX. In stock right now.
Yes, fireforming 7,62x54R will work but you do get a short case. You seat the bullet OUT to compensate.
Still, there are all those hungry 8x50s to feed and NO brass, so you buy 8x56R fresh and fireform the 7.62 to feed the unaltered original rifles, which were 8x50R. The you trim. Trimming cases is a LOT easier than trying to weld on an extra 2mm brass collar, any old day!
Whatever, gentlemen, DO have fun. I am very happy that there are more of these old things going to show up at shoots in the future.
They have all been away too long.
TRADEX. In stock right now.
Yes, fireforming 7,62x54R will work but you do get a short case. You seat the bullet OUT to compensate.
Still, there are all those hungry 8x50s to feed and NO brass, so you buy 8x56R fresh and fireform the 7.62 to feed the unaltered original rifles, which were 8x50R. The you trim. Trimming cases is a LOT easier than trying to weld on an extra 2mm brass collar, any old day!
Whatever, gentlemen, DO have fun. I am very happy that there are more of these old things going to show up at shoots in the future.
They have all been away too long.
Those numbers sound pretty good ,I was expecting 2100 to be the limit even withe lighter slug . I`ve been chcking all over the net and Hornady still loads this cartridge with the 208 slug and it sells on Cabelas for $27/box and I`m checking with their Canadian store to see if they`ll bring some in as the U.S store won`t ship.
I`ve also read that 7.62x54r can be reformed to work but I see if how the Partizan cases work first.
I`ve also read that 7.62x54r can be reformed to work but I see if how the Partizan cases work first.
Yes, 7.62x54R CAN be made to work.
The fly in the ointment is that the original cartridge for the rifle used a casing 50mm long, 7.62x54R is 54mm long and the casing you WANT is 56mm long.
Full-length sizing and cutting a casing BACK, say from 54mm to 50mm, is a heck of a lot easier than trying to stretch it out from 54mm to 56mm.
Just stands to reason that:
a. if the longest cases are available, and you need them, they are the perfect solution,
b. the less brass you trim, the less problems you will have with case-neck thickness, and
c. most of us don't have the equipment to re-draw the shorter casings to the greater length.
So you get the 8x56R cases for the 8x56R rifle, now that they are available (for the first time in history) able to handle Boxer primers and, if you really NEED 8x50R (for an unconverted rifle) you convert it from 7.62x54R. Converting from the longest case to the shortest involves removing a quarter-inch of brass, and that is quite enough length that the brass 'way down there will be starting to get thicker.... which can give you thick necks... which can give you nasty pressure spikes and all kinds of ugly things happening.
Path of least resistance is 56 for 56, 54 for 50 and stash away all the 54mm stuff you can get because it is useful for TWO calibres.
But we are just SO lucky that we have the correct 8x56R brass available at last.
The fly in the ointment is that the original cartridge for the rifle used a casing 50mm long, 7.62x54R is 54mm long and the casing you WANT is 56mm long.
Full-length sizing and cutting a casing BACK, say from 54mm to 50mm, is a heck of a lot easier than trying to stretch it out from 54mm to 56mm.
Just stands to reason that:
a. if the longest cases are available, and you need them, they are the perfect solution,
b. the less brass you trim, the less problems you will have with case-neck thickness, and
c. most of us don't have the equipment to re-draw the shorter casings to the greater length.
So you get the 8x56R cases for the 8x56R rifle, now that they are available (for the first time in history) able to handle Boxer primers and, if you really NEED 8x50R (for an unconverted rifle) you convert it from 7.62x54R. Converting from the longest case to the shortest involves removing a quarter-inch of brass, and that is quite enough length that the brass 'way down there will be starting to get thicker.... which can give you thick necks... which can give you nasty pressure spikes and all kinds of ugly things happening.
Path of least resistance is 56 for 56, 54 for 50 and stash away all the 54mm stuff you can get because it is useful for TWO calibres.
But we are just SO lucky that we have the correct 8x56R brass available at last.
i chrono'ed the 1938 austrian stuff at 2365fps from a 20" barrel. this load shots high. with IMR 4064 an hornady softpoints, loaded to hit to the sights, velocity is around 1900fps.
they are neat rifles, one of my favourites. in excellent condition they are beautiful rifles. took a muley a few years ago with one.
a note on the lee data for this cartridge that comes with the dies, it is actually lee's very light 8mm mauser data. so in the larger 8x56R case they are more like "trapdoor" loads.
they are neat rifles, one of my favourites. in excellent condition they are beautiful rifles. took a muley a few years ago with one.
a note on the lee data for this cartridge that comes with the dies, it is actually lee's very light 8mm mauser data. so in the larger 8x56R case they are more like "trapdoor" loads.
Right you are, MiG25: LEE is VERY conservative with their data.
Same thing, in a away, with Hodgdon. I wrote them a real barn-burner of a letter, quite a few years ago, because NONE of their hottest loads for the .303 even approached the standard military load from 1910, which load was arrived at by splitting the difference between the (known) most accurate load... and the maximum safe load arrived at in a specially-built rifle with ALL max tolerances and an absolute-MIN barrel: worst-possible-case scenario.
They wrote me back a very nice letter explaining that a lot of guys, especially in the States, just loaded right to the nuts whenever possible and with no regard to the condition of the rifle..... and some of the rifles were old, ropey and hadn't seen a weapons tech since Noah got his papers for Second Mate. They also said that they HAD duplicated the military load and sent me the data to duplicate the 1910 load: 174-grain bullet at 2440 ft/sec precisely. Very nice, very helpful, very polite. And they know their stuff.
But that was before the North American National Pastime turned out to be suing everybody and anybody who might even look at you sideways.
LEE knows what they are doing, too; they are just trying to lawyer-proof themselves and still remain in business. It's a real pity when things get this bad.
What was it that Shakespeare said? Oh yeah, "First thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers!".
Have fun!
Same thing, in a away, with Hodgdon. I wrote them a real barn-burner of a letter, quite a few years ago, because NONE of their hottest loads for the .303 even approached the standard military load from 1910, which load was arrived at by splitting the difference between the (known) most accurate load... and the maximum safe load arrived at in a specially-built rifle with ALL max tolerances and an absolute-MIN barrel: worst-possible-case scenario.
They wrote me back a very nice letter explaining that a lot of guys, especially in the States, just loaded right to the nuts whenever possible and with no regard to the condition of the rifle..... and some of the rifles were old, ropey and hadn't seen a weapons tech since Noah got his papers for Second Mate. They also said that they HAD duplicated the military load and sent me the data to duplicate the 1910 load: 174-grain bullet at 2440 ft/sec precisely. Very nice, very helpful, very polite. And they know their stuff.
But that was before the North American National Pastime turned out to be suing everybody and anybody who might even look at you sideways.
LEE knows what they are doing, too; they are just trying to lawyer-proof themselves and still remain in business. It's a real pity when things get this bad.
What was it that Shakespeare said? Oh yeah, "First thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers!".
Have fun!
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