Who bought the 750 rounds of 9 mm Sumbro ammo from Ellwood Epps?

[2katz]

Before you fire them look them up on the internet. They may be proof ammo at over 45,000 psi. Check them over before you blow your piston up and look like a racoon.

 

[B]

Last batch of bad ammo was from 2014. Is it confirmed that ammo was part of lot 01-02-2013 or 02-02-2014?? If so I am wondering why it was sold in the first place.

 

[B]

Here is the very, very old release on the bad ammo.

Lot # 02-02-2014

Sumbro NATO Conformant 9mm 124gr +P w/ Hard Primer

These +P Rounds have an average chamber pressure of roughly 45,000 psi and should not under any circumstance be fired through a weapon not designed to handle these pressures. (SAAMI standard chamber operating pressure is specified at 35,000 psi.)

PLEASE READ THE BELOW MEMORANDUM REGARDING THIS AMMUNITION:

M E M O R A N D U M – For Immediate Release

To: All Concerned Parties / General Public Notification Date: 18 December 2013

Subj: Sumbro 9MM 115 Grain LOT # 01-02-2013 Classification as NATO +P

Sumbro 9MM 115 grain lot # 01-02-2013 (found stamped inside the flap of each 50-round box) was manufactured using an energetic double-base powder. AmmoZone imported this ammunition directly from the manufacturer but only became aware of the powder change once the product had arrived. Our expectation was to be delivered a round that conformed to SAAMI specifications, so we submitted random samples to H.P. White Laboratory, Inc. in Maryland for independent testing of conformance to SAAMI pressure and velocity specifications.

The report from H.P. White shows that this ammunition has an average Peak Chamber Pressure of 45,632 psi, which is 30.3% above the SAAMI service pressure limit of 35,000 psi as specified in ANSI/SAAMI Z299.3-1993 for peak chamber pressure. The NATO 9MM service pressure is specified as the slightly higher 36,550 psi, but per the NATO specification [STANAG 4090 and NATO Manual of Proof and Inspection AC/225 (P111-SP1) D/170 (REV)], each weapon and each component must be capable of handling an overpressure of 25%, or 45,687 psi.

This ammunition is thus designated as NATO +P and should not be fired from any weapon not rated for the pressure as reported in this independent test, and as with all +P ammunition, the operator assumes all responsibility when using overpressure ammunition.

While any weapon designed to NATO 9MM specifications should be capable of firing this ammunition, the ammunition generates pressures consistently above the recommended service pressure, and while still within the NATO spec, these pressures are at the very top end of the proof pressure requirement for a NATO 9MM spec weapon. It is therefore the recommendation of AmmoZone Corporation that this ammunition be fired only from weapons designed to handle service pressures of 45,000 psi or greater.

 

[2katz]

Looks like it was a used batch that must have been turned in by a customer. It was not labeled as new.

 

[contact148]

Before you fire them look them up on the internet. They may be proof ammo at over 45,000 psi. Check them over before you blow your piston up and look like a racoon.

The store will have their name and address likely means to contact them because of the Ontario ammo registry

 

[gdawg]

Interesting. So it was for both the 124 and 115 gr? Looks like Epps just sold another 1500 rds of the 124gr.

Here is the very, very old release on the bad ammo.

Lot # 02-02-2014

Sumbro NATO Conformant 9mm 124gr +P w/ Hard Primer

These +P Rounds have an average chamber pressure of roughly 45,000 psi and should not under any circumstance be fired through a weapon not designed to handle these pressures. (SAAMI standard chamber operating pressure is specified at 35,000 psi.)

PLEASE READ THE BELOW MEMORANDUM REGARDING THIS AMMUNITION:

M E M O R A N D U M – For Immediate Release

To: All Concerned Parties / General Public Notification Date: 18 December 2013

Subj: Sumbro 9MM 115 Grain LOT # 01-02-2013 Classification as NATO +P

Sumbro 9MM 115 grain lot # 01-02-2013 (found stamped inside the flap of each 50-round box) was manufactured using an energetic double-base powder. AmmoZone imported this ammunition directly from the manufacturer but only became aware of the powder change once the product had arrived. Our expectation was to be delivered a round that conformed to SAAMI specifications, so we submitted random samples to H.P. White Laboratory, Inc. in Maryland for independent testing of conformance to SAAMI pressure and velocity specifications.

The report from H.P. White shows that this ammunition has an average Peak Chamber Pressure of 45,632 psi, which is 30.3% above the SAAMI service pressure limit of 35,000 psi as specified in ANSI/SAAMI Z299.3-1993 for peak chamber pressure. The NATO 9MM service pressure is specified as the slightly higher 36,550 psi, but per the NATO specification [STANAG 4090 and NATO Manual of Proof and Inspection AC/225 (P111-SP1) D/170 (REV)], each weapon and each component must be capable of handling an overpressure of 25%, or 45,687 psi.

This ammunition is thus designated as NATO +P and should not be fired from any weapon not rated for the pressure as reported in this independent test, and as with all +P ammunition, the operator assumes all responsibility when using overpressure ammunition.

While any weapon designed to NATO 9MM specifications should be capable of firing this ammunition, the ammunition generates pressures consistently above the recommended service pressure, and while still within the NATO spec, these pressures are at the very top end of the proof pressure requirement for a NATO 9MM spec weapon. It is therefore the recommendation of AmmoZone Corporation that this ammunition be fired only from weapons designed to handle service pressures of 45,000 psi or greater.

 

[Rust]

Interesting. So it was for both the 124 and 115 gr? Looks like Epps just sold another 1500 rds of the 124gr.

It was me.
I am expecting the newer type Sumbro ammo made in the last 3 or 4 years. Brass case, brass coloured bullet jacket either in 3 - 500 rd bags or in the black and neon green boxes. I have had mostly great experiences buying this type of thing from Epps. If I have concerns, I have no doubt they will look after me if I wish to return it.

 

[caperaway]

Sounds like factory 9mm Major.

 

[jparent]

In my experience Sumbro is fantastic for practicing clearance drills. I've had up to 70% failure to fire rates with that crap, and the brass was garbage.