WIN 244 to Replace Win 231

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Winchester says 244 is the new 231.

I have used 231 for years as a general purpose pistol plinker ammo powder. I used 16 pounds in the last 2 years.

Now I see 244 being offered. The load data suggests a similar burn rate and application (which is good), but I would have to develop new loads for all the calibers I load.

Has anyone used it and have any opinions?
 
KotKotofeich said:
Is hp-38 still going to be available? Since it was an identical substitute?
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Hodgdon owns the license for Winchester's powder line so since they have the same owner and are the same exact powder aside from lot to lot differences I would say no. It wouldn't make sense to discontinue one but not the other but I suppose a company who distributes several identical powders just under different names may not follow any logical path.
 
B said:
Hodgdon owns the license for Winchester's powder line so since they have the same owner and are the same exact powder aside from lot to lot differences I would say no.
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I was hoping they were simply dropping 231 to consolidate to hp-38 only... :( Not looking forward to redoing my recipes either :(

Alternatively, is there a powder anyone can recommend as a good all around powder for pretty much every pistol caliber instead of 244 (and if so, why?) If we have to switch, why not switch to something better (if available)?
 
I have no inside info on the future of HP-38 I am just speculating. There are many better powders out there for sure. Accurate #2 and #5 are extremely versatile and Vihtavuori also has a few options. They are much harder to find and typically more expensive though.

I used to use Titegroup for everything because $25/lb was hard to beat and it worked for nearly everything as far as bulk range ammo. The heat never bothered me but with the price the same as everything else I wouldn't touch it. Might as well buy premium powder if the prices are all the same...
 
I tried it.

In 9, 4 gr average was 997 fps and 4.5 gr gave an average of 1169 fps with 124 gr copper plated seated at 1.15. This is out of a 4.25 inch barrel.

In 38, 4 gr average was 545 fps with 158 gr copper plated out of a 4 inch barrel.

In my limited observation the Winchester 244 is similar in performance with HP38/Winchester 231. Accuracy is also good.

When trowing the charges working up loads with win244, I weighted each charge and every now and than I experienced small variations. It may be user interface error. The flakes do not seem as uniformed in shape/size for the win 244 as for the HP38/win231.

As a HP38/win231 fanboy, I would substitute them for the win 244 in a pinch.
 
SP641 said:
I tried it.

In 9, 4 gr average was 997 fps and 4.5 gr gave an average of 1169 fps with 124 gr copper plated seated at 1.15. This is out of a 4.25 inch barrel.

In 38, 4 gr average was 545 fps with 158 gr copper plated out of a 4 inch barrel.

In my limited observation the Winchester 244 is similar in performance with HP38/Winchester 231. Accuracy is also good.

When throwing the charges working up loads with win244, I weighted each charge and every now and than I experienced small variations. It may be user interface error. The flakes do not seem as uniformed in shape/size for the win 244 as for the HP38/win231.

As a HP38/win231 fanboy, I would substitute them for the win 244 in a pinch.
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Is that a typo? Looks to be 200 fps too slow.
 
KotKotofeich said:
I was hoping they were simply dropping 231 to consolidate to hp-38 only... :( Not looking forward to redoing my recipes either :(

Alternatively, is there a powder anyone can recommend as a good all around powder for pretty much every pistol caliber instead of 244 (and if so, why?) If we have to switch, why not switch to something better (if available)?
Click to expand...

These days, the "best" powder is whatever you can find in a 8 pounder.

But a real good all round powder is RAMSHOT SILHOUETTE or ZIP. Hard to find, though.
 
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My understanding of the 231 situation is that manufacturing it creates a waste product that is expensive to deal with. I have used a lot of it over the years, as well as 296 and 680. An acquaintance has 2 + drums of 231, I think they are 35 lbs each?
 
My understanding of the 231 situation is that manufacturing it creates a waste product that is expensive to deal with. I have used a lot of it over the years, as well as 296 and 680. An acquaintance has 2 + drums of 231, I think they are 35 lbs each?
 
No. From the manufacturer; not the distributor. Typically Expro Chemical and Bofors.

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