POI change between shooters (land and right handed)

JR86

JR86

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I was out shooting on the weekend with a friend of mine. I'm left handed and he's right handed. We were shooting at 200 yards and between is two shooters there was a consistent 2" down, 2" left POI on 5 shot groups. Group sizes were similar but not in the same spot. He's a newer shooter while I've been doing this for a few years. He says he had proper eye alignment/relief on the scope.... But I can't think of anything else that would cause a consistent shift like that other than different positions behind scope.

We were shooting from bench so I don't believe he was canting rifle. And even that I don't think would be consistent or that pronounced.

Any thoughts?
 
There are many possibilities for a point of aim shift.

1. Parellax can be significant even at 200 yards. Double check for that.
2. The way a different shooter holds the rifle and recoils with it. Someone who is 150lbs VS 250lbs for example.
3. Being shot from different sides/shoulders ( as stated: right and left handed)
4. Placing the rifle differently on sand bags or bipods can create a shift as well.
5. Differences in trigger control/timing

My thoughts are that it is not just any one single solitary contibuter, but a bit of each culminating in the "sum of differences" so to speak.
 
Me and my brother in law are same situation. We are both right handed and poi changes significantly at 100yards. BUT me an my father are exactly same when using scopes BUT changes with open sights.
 
dthunter said:
There are many possibilities for a point of aim shift.

1. Parellax can be significant even at 200 yards. Double check for that.
2. The way a different shooter holds the rifle and recoils with it. Someone who is 150lbs VS 250lbs for example.
3. Being shot from different sides/shoulders ( as stated: right and left handed)
4. Placing the rifle differently on sand bags or bipods can create a shift as well.
5. Differences in trigger control/timing

My thoughts are that it is not just any one single solitary contibuter, but a bit of each culminating in the "sum of differences" so to speak.
Click to expand...

x2.

If you had it setup right. Its set up to fit you... With my rigs I can drop into any position and have almost perfect sights through my optic and be comfortable... my shorter friends or bulkier ones... Are very obviously straining/pressing or shuffling around trying to get a good sight picture... We all know the more you touch the rifle the less accurate that shot will be lol.
 
My wife an I experienced the same thing while plinking with her scoped .22 at short range (50-100 yds). We couldn't shoot the same rifle without me re-zeroing it for me or holding off to compensate. So naturally I needed to buy a new scope for my target .22 to eliminate the problem. :D The trigger pull sucks on her rifle anyway. lol
 
dthunter said:
There are many possibilities for a point of aim shift.

1. Parellax can be significant even at 200 yards. Double check for that.
2. The way a different shooter holds the rifle and recoils with it. Someone who is 150lbs VS 250lbs for example.
3. Being shot from different sides/shoulders ( as stated: right and left handed)
4. Placing the rifle differently on sand bags or bipods can create a shift as well.

5. Differences in trigger control/timing

My thoughts are that it is not just any one single solitary contibuter, but a bit of each culminating in the "sum of differences" so to speak.
Click to expand...

Exactly, this is not unusual in the least.
 
Everyone's eyes can be different and view the target differently. Many years ago three of us shot on a set of targets (100 yards) with the same rifle. We are all right handed, right eye dominant. The 3 groups were all small in a vertical line... each about 2 inches from the other... the extreme was 6 inches from the top group to the bottom group. I don't understand the reasoning behind this but I know not everyone shoots a rifle with the same POI. Some do, some don't.
 
if I had to throw another suggestion into the hat it would be the different side

not sure if the stock has a cheek piece that's different on either side, my Mossberg MVP is more geared toward a right hand shooter, it fits differently for lefties. his cheek weld will be different giving him a different picture impacting his POI. just like if you are not in the same spot every time it can change your own POI.
 
Thanks for all the info! Now I can go take back all that stuff I said about him not knowing how to use a scope! ;)


We were using a bubble level
Stock appears ambidextrous
 
Right should vs. left shoulder. Cheek pushing on one side vs the other.

Have you looked at the muzzle of a CZ858? There is a detent there to align the brake at either 10;30 or 1:30, to accommodate the right and left handed shooters. Without an angled brake, the rifle would jump high right for a right handed shooter.
 
I have found the same thing happens as well with my left handed friend, his groups are usually an inch or so to the left compared to mine when shooting the same rifle. I feel this is due to different grip technique/ trigger control and the fact the cheek is on the other side of the rifle. I have also found that some of my right handed friends have a different point of impact due to a difference in grip technique, if the rifle is not a big boomer I shoot my rifles with as little contact as possible I/E bench rest style. Most other shooters make greater contact with the stock the I do!
 
The answer is probably "barrel time". This phenomenon is most noted with double rifles but also effects single barrel rifles and pistols. The gun will move a small amount during recoil wile the bullet is still in the barrel. The rifle will move differently depending on how it is held. Not only for right vs. left handers but also the same guy holding the same rifle differently. The lighter the rifle, heaver the recoil and slower the bullet the more pronounced the point of impact will change.
 
Oh and I am a lefty that can shoot right handed as well and yes I do see a difference when I shoot the same gun off the same bags but switch hands. Hell I can see a difference just on my bad and inconsistent form from one sitting to the next.
 
Parallax and eye alignment. Cheek rest is different.

Cheers.

P.S. Did shoot with one of my rifle last week. We where 3 good shooters. Zero was different for the 3 of us.
 
I have some experience with this as well. I'm right handed, but blind in my right eye. Growing up my brothers and I shared rifles and I always "pulled" shots left.

My theory is the way the rifle recoils on a lefty. The follow through is to the opposite side and so the shot goes that way.

It would be interesting to see what happens in a free recoil situation. Both of you shoot the same gun/load setup on sand bags so only your finger touches the trigger. My guess is the groups will be much closer to point of aim for both or both of you.
 
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